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hi everyone,
i currently working on a 1500pt space marine army list for the ultramarines, for 40k standard missions (i say this as the tournement i am entering requires multiple expansion-armies, just pointing that out now!)
anyway, the force is based on the shooting prowess of the space marines, which is formidable.
heres what i've got so far:

HQ: Space Marine Librarian + Termie + Ep. + Powers (Force Dome and Gates of Infinity) = 175

Troops: 10 man Tactical Squad + Plasma Gun + Plasma Pistol + MM (Free!) = 195

10 man Tactical Squad + Flamer + ML = 170

5 Man Scout Squad + HB (rest have CC weapon and BP) = 85

5 man Scout Squad + ML (Rest have Sniper rifles) = 85

Troops total: 535

Elites: Dreadnought + AC = 115

Heavy Support: Thunderfire Cannon = 100

Devastor Squad + 3 Plasma Cannons + Lascannon = 200

Land Raider + SB = 260

Dedicated Transport: Drop Pod + Deathwind missile launcher + Locator Beacon = 65

Rhino + Hunter Killer Missile = 45


The main tactics with this army is that the drop pod lands behind the enemy with the dreadnought, which has always distracted them so far!
Then, the Scout Sniper Squad (SSS) and Devs, T-Cannon hold in deployment zone, and shoot anything that moves
The Lib. and the basic tactical squad go in the land raider, and then teleport near to the drop pod to capture the enemy base objective
the other scout squad has infiltrated near a central objective, and the plasma tactical squad uses the rhino to support them

and suggestions, comments or other various ideas would be greatly appreciated!

The Lib. and the basic tactical squad go in the land raider, and then teleport near to the drop pod to capture the enemy base objective

This could be a flaw in your tactics, since Tacticals will hardly hold their ground in the enemy deployment zone.

HQ: Space Marine Librarian + Termie + Ep. + Powers (Force Dome and Gates of Infinity) = 175

Not a bad choice BUT you don't really have a worthwhile squad to use him with.

Troops: 10 man Tactical Squad + Plasma Gun + Plasma Pistol + MM (Free!) = 195

Lose the PP, take a Combi-Weapon if you really want. Also this squad needs a Power Fist.

10 man Tactical Squad + Flamer + ML = 170

I'm not a fan of the standard Loadout, I'd rather see Flamer/Heavy Bolter for infantry or Melta/Plasma + Multi-Melta for armor.

5 Man Scout Squad + HB (rest have CC weapon and BP) = 85

5 man Scout Squad + ML (Rest have Sniper rifles) = 85

5 4+ save models makes for an easy kill point. I'd take a 10 man squad of one or the other.

Elites: Dreadnought + AC = 115

Not bad but I prefer either the Plasma/Missile combo or dual TL Autocannons for ranged support.

Heavy Support: Thunderfire Cannon = 100

This is just a playstyle thing but I like the more durable Whirlwind or Dakka Predator.

Devastor Squad + 3 Plasma Cannons + Lascannon = 200

Lascannons and Plasma Cannons don't match up well. I'd take a Missile Launcher or Heavy Bolter if you kept the Plasma.

Land Raider + SB = 260

Why a Storm Bolter? Seems like a weird upgrade. With no Terminators why take a Land Raider at all? Tacticals are just fine in Rhinos or Pods.

i have terminators with PF and SB, but everytime i use them, i cant get them in a good enough position to take advantage, and they get wiped out. I've found the scouts to survive well beyond the expectation, i plan on beefing them up at some point, but not atm. i have got a 10 man sterguard squad in the process of converting, but at 250 pts they are expensive, but do have more attacks...
would a good idea be to replace the lib. with Pedro Kantor, add the sternguard which makes them scoring...
oh and the reason for the storm bolter? it was already on my model when I was doing the list..

This is just my opinion...

The only reason to take a Land Raider is to deliver Terminators.

The only Terminators worth taking are Assault Terminators.

2 5-man scout squads are weak. Either take 5 w/ ML, sniper rifles, and camo cloaks, or take 10 w/ a fist on Sarge and outflank them.



Thunderfire cannons can be good, but you will probably want to run 2 of them. If you're dead set on scouts, run 2 Thunderfires, and 2 5-man scout squads, sniper rifles and a missile launcher in each, and give them camo cloaks. Then you use the Techmarine's Bolster Defenses on the terrain in which you put the scout squads, and you end up with 2 5-man units with 2+ cover saves. This is the only way I'd ever combine Scouts with Thunderfire Cannons.


Librarians can be good. Tonight, a little 100 point Librarian toasted a total of 24 Chaos Marines in an Ambush scenario. You need to play smart, and keep him out of combat. IMO, Null Zone and Avenger are the two best powers to take. Avenger is arguably the best psychic power in the game if used properly, and if you run your Librarian with Assault Terminators, you will want Null Zone. It's really simple: Thunderhammers and Lightning Claws make people roll Invulnerable saves. Null Zone makes them re-roll successful invulnerable saves. This is brutal to most armies out there. Personally, I like my Librarians cheap. I like them hiding in a nice safe Land Raider until something juicy wih a 3+ army save rolls by, and then my opponent removes models by the handful. So I'm OK with spending 100 points on a guy that splatters that many points worth of enemy in one shooting phase. If you want to go Terminator on him, then give him a Storm Shield, Null Zone, and Avenger. Or *maybe* Avenger and Vortex, this way you can do something to enemy armor.


Assault Cannons are only worth taking if they're twin-linked, and you like the platform. For me, this means AC Razorbacks, and Land Raider Crusaders. Other than that, I never use them. You need them to rend, and the more hits that connect, the more likely you are to rend. If you're dropping your Dread in on suicide duty, he should have a multimelta and heavy flamer. Same cost, more killy. Position him between an enemy infantry unit, preferably one with a 4+ save, and a tank. Fire both at the tank and cook the unit simultaneously "by accident". Tried and true, it's ugly as sin.



Devastators are too expensive for what they do. 200 points for 3 Plasma Cannon shots and a Lascannon? For that price, you can buy 4 Multimelta attack bikes.

If you're going to spend 10 points upgrading your Land Raider, what do you want? A Storm Bolter, or a Multimelta? This is a no-brainer.

Tactical squads should all have Rhinos if they're 10-man, and Razorbacks if they're 5-man. No exceptions. They must be mechanized, or it's game over. A 10-man squad should have a Power Fist on Sarge. If you're going to tool them up, my favorite is: Powerfist and Combi-melta on Sarge, meltagun, and missile launcher. It's mediocre all around, but 10-guys with a flamer and a missile launcher in a Rhino is only 40 points less and it sucks a lot more.



Really what you're lacking here is maneuverable melta power. Space Marines are only competitive because they're tough, and they've got maneuverable melta platforms.

ricardo503 wrote:HQ: Space Marine Librarian + Termie + Ep. + Powers (Force Dome and Gates of Infinity) = 175

Personally, I am not a fan of Librarians at all. I think that Pedro Cantor would be a much better choice...or cough up the extra points and take Either Vulcan (190), Lysander or Sicarius (Both 200). All three are valuable choices, each with their own tricks, and can change the course of any game you play.

ricardo503 wrote:Troops: 10 man Tactical Squad + Plasma Gun + Plasma Pistol + MM (Free!) = 195

Taking a PP in your squads is a bad idea. I never really want to risk losing your one good CC guy to a Gets Hot! fail. Give him a combi-melta or a PF instead.

ricardo503 wrote:10 man Tactical Squad + Flamer + ML = 170

I never take MLs, mostly because I always seem to have those damn cheap rockets made in China, and are always a dud....

ricardo503 wrote:5 Man Scout Squad + HB (rest have CC weapon and BP) = 85
5 man Scout Squad + ML (Rest have Sniper rifles) = 85

I personally think that you only take scouts so you can take Telion. Other then that I leave em on the shelf.

ricardo503 wrote:Elites: Dreadnought + AC = 115

If you are gonna drop pod him like you say, just stick with the Multi-Melta. It will work much better for you.

ricardo503 wrote:Heavy Support: Thunderfire Cannon = 100

Taking a Thunderfire Cannon is never, ever a bad idea.... Taking two though is even better!

ricardo503 wrote:Devastor Squad + 3 Plasma Cannons + Lascannon = 200

I hate Devastators with a passion. They are way to expensive, and they aren't even scoring. Buy the boxes for heavy weapons bits, don't take them in your lists. Unless it is an apocalypse game

ricardo503 wrote:Land Raider + SB = 260

Drop the SB, you can just say it doesn't work and not have to pay for it. LRs are great, and if you can take one you should. I don't care what other people say, I always try to squeeze one in. It is very scary to your opponent, so they will try very hard to kill it, but that will give the rest of your army the time and freedom to do what you need.

I think your list was 1495 total. Here are the tweaks I would give it, and I think it would help strengthen it quite a bit.

HQ:
Pedro Kantor - 175

Elites:
Sternguard
Combi-Flamer, Combi-Melta - 145

Dreadnought
MM, SB - 105

Dedicated Transport:
Drop Pod - 35

Troops:
2xTactical Squad
Flamer, HB/MM, PF - 195

Dedicated Transport:
2xRhino - 35

Scout Squad
3 Sniper, 1 HB, Telion - 130

Heavy Support:
2xThunderfire Cannon - 100

LR - 250

Grand Total: 1500

This gives you 4 scoring units, and Stubborn. If you would rather take Lysander or Sicarius, just drop a PF on a sarge and put the extra points there. Please note that I am not 100% on the pts here, I am 99% sure though, as I don't have a dex right in front of me. If I am wrong, please post the correction, and I will try to adjust accordingly.

@Jeb-Stuart

Thanks for the list, the only reason that I haven't stuck Pedro in before is that I don't have a model for him...yet. (one of the many conversion projects i'm working on
i do have sicarus and scratch built calger though (and many captains!)
are the combi weapons for the sternguard worth it, as they can only shoot once per game (but i realise that they keep their special ammunition too..)