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Hey guys this is my first guard, list and first post here just wanted to know how you think these lists would do in a game because i have never played a game.


ok im taking a lot of advice and am revising list...AGAIN....AGAIN!


HQ

Company Command Squad regimental standard, ( 2 flamers and 1 Grenade Launcher) 70 pt


Elites
7 Ratlings 70 pt

5 Storm Troopers 1 Melta gun 1 power sword 105 pt

Troops

Vet Squad (3 grenade launchers) 85 pt

Vet squad 2 melta guns 95 pt

Platoon Command Squad (2 flamers) 40 points

Infantry Squad (1 Grenade Launcher) 55 points

Infantry Squad (1 grenade launcher) 55 points

(Heavy Bolter Team, 3 heavy bolters) 75 points

(Lascannon team, 3 Lascannons) 90 points

Fast attack

1 Hellhound, smoke launchers and Heavy Stubber, heavy flamer 145 pt

2 devil dogs, 2 multi meltas, smoke launchers 280 pt

Heavy Support

1 Leman russ battle tank, (Heavy Bolter Sponsons)170 pt

1 Leman russ battle tank 150 pt



1500 points 'Zactly

anything thats in brackets i have recently added with my remaining points to make it easier for you guys to tell me how im wrong



changes i made with a lot of help from Lt Lathrop: took out the commissar and all the voxes cause i realised the standard does the work of both of them, i decided to keep the Devils cause the range is actually 24 inches with the cannons not 12 and generally put weapons in everywhere i could oh i also bought a new lascannon heavy weapons team. =D

I would split the dogs into three squads, same with the tanks. Pretty short on men.

What is the Techpriest Enginseer for? Since he cannot keep close with dogs, and the LRBTs should be placed separately, I cannot think that he can do someting without servitors.

The trukk with your core squad loaded in, would have a Boom!, at turn 1.

I only see 1 troops choice. You need to add a second. The platoon hq and 2 squads count as one choice. I'd say drop a hellhound, but that seems to be the focus of your army.

If you want you can switch a leman russ for a hydra tank. Move the platoon hq to a command hq with the same options and put the infantry squads to veteran. Which would be 60 points extra with the same options.

The Hydra is good against light vehicles and is heavy anti infantry (kills off high toughness models).

As for the squadrons. Like the others have mentioned. Don't deploy them as squadrons unless you have to. If you put them together you have to all fire at the same target and if they can shoot at one of the squadron vehicles they can target the rest as well. They would also have to move together and retain coherency.

There are two vet squads = 2 troops.

You are going to have trouble with objectives with only 20 scoring squishies, on foot.

For guard, you either have to go gunline or mech. As murdog said, you only have 20 guardsmen as your scoring troops... that will be pretty spectacularly failing as you will see. For gunline, I wouldn't take less than 2 platoons, maxed (or nearly maxed, 4-5 squads) of infantry. That is the only way to be sure those squads won't be blasted into tiny bits right from the get-go. For mech, I would run at least 3 vet squads in chimeras or other suitable transports. Anything less gets squished pretty quickly. If you want to split the difference, go with 1 platoon and 2 veteran squads in chimeras or valks.

Don't use Stormtroopers with 2 flamers, waste of BS 4 and to many points where i think a Vet Squad with 2-3 flamers would cost that much different. I would put meltas or plasma on them.

Ok, up to 45 troops choice models now. I'm not sure if you want to do it, but something to think about is a chimera or two for your troops units. The veterans probably. When I've played guard I've had problems of taking objectives without a chimera to move my troops up there. The veterans can move and shoot, but only at 12" range. Might work, might not, not sure.

Definitely needs transports for the veterans.

Ok well seeing as i have a Lord Commissar i COULD drop the command squad for 2 chimeras exactly, good idea?


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bump.

It would probably be better.

murdog wrote:It would probably be better.

hmm well ill try out the ccs before i commit to buying chimmys and see how it goes

I think you should spread the weapons around. Imo you need to get those two infantry squads some kind of weapon, at least a special. Maybe reduce the number of weapons in the vet squads to do this, or make the HF in the CCS a normal one. While you're at it, you could focus the vets on a specific job (by giving them all the same weapons).

I think the melta weapons on foot will be too easy to dodge. You will have to somehow close with a target, but our men are ultra-squishy. Actually, now that I look at it, you have all meltas and flamers on your infantry. That is more of a mech set up, and will definitely benefit from chims. You probably don't want to walk across the field to attack a gunline, and if they're coming to you, you need to be shooting at them from the start.

I don't think it's necessary, you have the basis for a good hybrid list here. I just think you need to rearrange your infantry so that all the squads have weapons and some of it has some range to it. Find some points to beef up the gunline - take advantage of the bodies to protect some weapons which your CCS can maximize with orders; the gunline protects the tanks and claims close objectives; the tanks have the range to hit wherever they want; the fast attack and elites harrass and delay.

Ok i have updated list but am not sure if i should pimp out my units, or add in more meatshields.

any advice, ideas or c&c you have would be awesomes

Lewismio wrote:HQ
Lord Commissar 70pt

Company Command Squad regimental standard, (vox box, carapce armour) and 1 flamer 95 pt

2 HQs doing the same thing is a waste. You also don't really have a lot of infantry in this list to need 2 HQs, and since the infantry squads you have are really weak... it's even more silly. Lord Commisar gives everyone Ld10, standard gives everyone rerolls. They are essentially doing the same thing, so you can drop one. Single flamer is pointless. Carapace armor is only good in melee; since this squad is only 5 strong, and has no melee weapons, and only made of humans... I would avoid melee. If you aren't going to be in melee then 4+ armor saves are a waste of points, as you can get 4+ cover saves for free, and just by standing behind your own troops, that you will be giving orders to. Vox is pointless, too expensive for rerolls on orders that you are most likely going to pass... that even if you fail, won't make or break you. Basically you could drop the CCS all together, or you could drop the LC and put some heavy weapons in the CCS to take advantage of the BS4, and/or fill out its special weapons.

Lewismio wrote:Elites
7 Ratlings 70 pt

Ratlings are good, I usually recommend a squad of 5. If you need points elsewhere, you could take the points from here.

Lewismio wrote:5 Storm Troopers 1 Melta gun 1 power sword 105 pt

Storm troopers are WAY too expensive to be effective at anything. Drop them. Compared to Veterans they are more expensive, and less effective. The only thing storm troopers are good against are MEQ, as the whole squad has AP3. In light of this, if you want to take the squad for anti MEQ, you should arm it with plasma... as it is the only weapon that really works well with this squad. The squad is absolutely terrible in melee, so drop the power weapon and don't let them get in melee. A 5 man squad will get killed before it has a chance to attack in melee, and because of our poor WS and poor S you won't get any attacks to connect anyway. Melta should be dropped because 1 melta isn't going to get the job done, and it requires you to be in 6" of the enemy. Why spend 105pts on a 5-man single melta squad... when you could spend 100 on a 10-man squad with 3 melta? If you are going to keep the Storm troopers, fill the squad up to the max number, and give them plasma... and use them to kill MEQ, not vehicles.

Lewismio wrote:Troops

Vet Squad 1 flamer (vox box) 80 pt

No. Vets have BS4, and can carry 3 special weapons each. Flamers should be used in squads that have BS3, vets should have grenades or something that benefits from their good BS. You should also fill out the squad with all the weapons they can carry. Special weapons are the only thing that makes IG worth anything. Lasguns are the single worst weapon in the game, if you don't believe me do the math out. Just expect the lasguns to do nothing worth while. In a squad with just 1 flamer, why do you have a vox? What in this squad was worth giving an order to? Drop the vox, swap the flamer to GL, and give the squad 3 GLs. I would also recommend some heavy weapons, as you are lacking a lot of heavy guns in your list.

Lewismio wrote:Vet squad 2 melta guns (vox box) 95 pt

Melta vets need a transport or they will die before they reach their target. Take 3 melta, to make sure the job gets done, because melta vets frequently die before they get a chance to do anything else... one chance to get it right. Drop the Vox, this squad will likely be too far away from your CCS to benefit from orders anyway, as they will be charging vehicles... and they can't receive orders in a Chimera anyway, which they need to have.

Lewismio wrote:Platoon Command Squad 2 flamers (vox box) 45 points

Infantry Squad 1 flamer (vox box) 60 points

Infantry Squad 1 flamer (vox box) 60 points

Platoon with flamers is great. Platoons are good for eating shots for the rest of the army and protecting your rear lines from assaults. Flamers are good because they correct the BS3 issue you have with platoons. I would recommend you fill up the platoon squad with its max number of flamers, and position them just behind your 2 infantry squads and flame over the top.

Lewismio wrote:(Heavy Bolter Team, 3 heavy bolters) 75 points

HBs are ok, you lack a lot of anti armor, so I would recommend you upgrade to autocannons or lascannons.

Lewismio wrote:Fast attack

1 Hellhound, smoke launchers and Heavy Stubber, heavy flamer 145 pt

Love this vehicle. Smoke is pointless, because the Hellhound is fast, it will always be on top of the enemy, and it should be shooting... not hiding. Heavy flamer doesn't work well on a Hellhound, surprisingly. Inferno Cannon has a longer range than a regular flamer, so imo a HB will be able to work better... as it can make the IC's range. Stubber is ok, up to you... I generally don't take them.

Lewismio wrote:2 devil dogs, 2 multi meltas, smoke launchers 280 pt

If you dont hit, it will scatter... 2D6 scatters an average of 7". 7 minus 3 is 4". If you don't get the hole of the blast over the vehicle, it will be useless. Also you have to be at 12" range to melta, but you should probably check with some rules lawyers to figure out how melta works with scatter. Again, smoke is useless. Multi meltas are good for this tank. Overall, 1 would be a maybe... but you definitely don't need 2. There are better/cheaper options for anti vehicle imo. Vendetta would be one of them.

Lewismio wrote:Heavy Support

1 Leman russ battle tank, (Heavy Bolter Sponsons)170 pt

Can't use the HBs if you move, should drop them. If anything put in a hull lascannon.

Lewismio wrote:1 Leman russ battle tank 150 pt

Fine.

List is ok. Not really good, not really bad. Infantry side is really weak. Armor side is basic, and probably could be done better.

ok list has been done... AGAIN thanks everyone with helping i think the voxes were actually a stupid choice seeing as the banner does the same thing XD


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whoopsie what i just posted was illegal...all better now