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Which one is your favorite? Who do you think is best for the points? And can someone explain to me what the hell is the use for Huron, I don't see him being anywhere near his points worth. What squad do you like to put these HQs in? Thanks for your input, Rod!

Kharn is the only one that approaches useful. DPs are much better.

Huron has a Powerfist and a Heavy Flamer, both of which can be used in conjunction with Warptime, a power that can be used in both players' turns. And he has a Power Weapon for when waiting until I1 will get him killed, which is still very decent in combination with Warptime.

I like Possessed or Cult Marine squads for my Chaos Space Marine Independent Characters because they don't lose Fearless and gain it if they didn't have it before.

My favourite is Typhus, for his effect on hordes, though Ahriman comes in a close second thanks to his ability to use Warptime, Doombolt, and Wind of Chaos in the same turn.

i dont like typhus because of his T5(4)
abby if you got the points to spare
kharn is really reaslly good
fabius is medeocre but you buy him for the 3 pt upgrade which mnakes standard CSM on par with cult marines.

Typhus is T4(5), the number in brackets is his Toughness after the Mark of Nurgle is applied, though I get the impression you're dyslexic, so no worries.

no matter, he still gets instakilled by battlecanons though he is the host of thedestroyer hive

Sure, he suffers Instant Death from 17% of all Battle Cannon wounds he takes, if the Battlecannon causes a hit on every model in the unit he's joined. Terrifying odds really.

I like Lucious just becuase of his miniature its very nice

Ahriman. Nice mini and not bad rules either.

I like Huron and Kharn.

I dont know if "Heroes" is the right wording for this. Hero usually implies someone good.

Hero is fine, if you associate it with Nietzschean Lion or master morality, that of personal excellence and will to power, rather than Nietzschean slave morality, that of constraining one's own interests so as not to deprive others of theirs. The heroes of the Chaos Space Marines are much more heroes in the ancient Greek sense of being mighty and doing epic deeds.

That's the cool thing about the difference between the loyalist Space Marines and the renegade Chaos Space Marines, that the latter can still accomplish heroic deeds, but they do so from self motives, whereas the loyalists are always doing it for someone else: their chapter, their commander, their Emperor.

Nurglitch wrote:
That's the cool thing about the difference between the loyalist Space Marines and the renegade Chaos Space Marines, that the latter can still accomplish heroic deeds, but they do so from self motives, whereas the loyalists are always doing it for someone else: their chapter, their commander, their Emperor.

thats actually a good way of looking at it

It gets better. You know how Space Marines have And They Shall Know No Fear, but Chaos Space Marines have higher Leadership? While they're self-less loyalists obsessed with honour and duty they have great unit cohesion because each one is willing to die to advance the mission objectives or to preserve his battle brothers, and they can all trust and rely on each other. Once turned renegade that unit cohesion begins to break down; after all once the greatest oaths of loyalty have been broken, do you trust your Chapter Master, your Captain, even your squad mates to hold to lesser oaths? You're less likely to worry about Brother Raphael who just got his head blown off by a sniper (better him than you, right), but when everything goes to pot, then it's every Astartes for himself.

But then the 4th edition Codex itself explores how the root of a renegades fall into Traitoris Extremis begins with a moment of selfishness, and putting their own interests first, and that the only bulwark against such corruption is self-denial; that self-denial is necessary to prevent the Astartes' soul from turning inward towards the emptiness of Chaos and damnation. It's all rather Dante-esque.

Well, being a TS player, I'm obviously going to like Ahriman. It helps his mini and rules are good to.

And am I the only one who likes Fabulous Bile? When I run my "regular" CSM list, having a gak load of crazy S6 Chaos Marines running twards them can throw any opponent off.

Little lord Fauntleroy wrote:Well, being a TS player, I'm obviously going to like Ahriman. It helps his mini and rules are good to.

And am I the only one who likes Fabulous Bile? When I run my "regular" CSM list, having a gak load of crazy S6 Chaos Marines running twards them can throw any opponent off.

charging a carnifex and your enemy laughing, then finding out you wound him on 4+ rocks

I kinda miss the old Fabius Bile where his needle gun resulted in enemy models exploding. Now if Fabius still had that and an invunrable save, I would field him in a heart beat as I have always had a soft spot for Fabius.

Kharn he really just is sweet to field.

He took out a carinfex and a hive tyrant, on his own. That takes skills.

Kharn. What a guy!

No Abaddon love, huh? I usually roll with him either with terminators in the land raider or with plague marines on foot. I hate his look though, Typhus is much cooler.

i played against chaos once or three times, and one of those times, some guy fielded Abaddon the Despoiler, he was one tough guy to take down.

Shoot him lots.

Kill the LR he is in, sacrificing whatever unit. Then simply stay away from him all game, shooting him and his unit with AP2 weaponry (or S8+)

Compared to the new characters, they all suck ballz for those that like Force Multipliers...or some more flavor...

Typhus: instant death sucks for a guy over 200 points, esp. since he's geared towards killing the stuff that will likely be able to instant kill him.

Failiman: His rule suck if you take into consideration the Chaos FAQ...a land raider just for a slow ass triple Gift platform, no fething way.

Hurmorous: noob with his weapons...doesn't even get +1A, he has a decent weapon config, but it's so bland...so 'normal' weaponry.

Kharn: best in the bunch, balanced points, offensive power.

Lucious: Contradictory Special rules...his only functions are: Second Doom Siren in a NM squad or a solo character to throw into a mob of hordes.

Failbbadon: crazy expensive for no force multipliers, only contributes in combat and pratically demands a LR which then results in at least roughly 25% of a 2000 point force, and can go stupid in combat.

Fabulous Failius: the only force multipler...and you have to pay for it. It's not bad actually, decent, but he himself is the weakness in the list. He eats a HQ slot and his offensive power is only against High Toughness low armor save opponents...not looking so hot esp. with the lack of power weapon.

IMO, go with a Sorc Lord or a DP if you are looking for competititve and economical. These named characters need a specific list or delivery to make them work, and when they get there they aren't that flashy and expensive for that lack of flash.

It's not to say they can't kill stuff when the oppurtunity arrises, it's just an older codex.

Nurglitch wrote:Hero is fine, if you associate it with Nietzschean Lion or master morality, that of personal excellence and will to power, rather than Nietzschean slave morality, that of constraining one's own interests so as not to deprive others of theirs. The heroes of the Chaos Space Marines are much more heroes in the ancient Greek sense of being mighty and doing epic deeds.

That's the cool thing about the difference between the loyalist Space Marines and the renegade Chaos Space Marines, that the latter can still accomplish heroic deeds, but they do so from self motives, whereas the loyalists are always doing it for someone else: their chapter, their commander, their Emperor.

Nietzche <3

Nurglitch wrote:Sure, he suffers Instant Death from 17% of all Battle Cannon wounds he takes, if the Battlecannon causes a hit on every model in the unit he's joined. Terrifying odds really.

He doesn't like PK's.

And Abaddon has no arms....

Kharn is a great guy though....

Ok I'll stop now