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I have a couple painted Blood Angels that both have an MK6 Corvus Studded Shoulder Pauldron on them and I wanted to know if I should put the Blood Angels Chapter Sigil on the left where the MK6 piece is the other one has the MK6 pice on the right so should I put the tear drop on that one to or should I leave it bare?

Personally I would put the The correct symbol for the shoulder pad on that side (I think that was expressed badly) I mean if the Chapter Symbol goes on th LHS Shoulder pad and the tear drop goes on the RHS then replace one of them with the MK6 and leave the other as it should be if they were both MK7.

Alternitively do what you want it is your model dude

On Mk6 Corvus, the chapter symbol goes on the right.

Thank you for your input on this Ed_Bodger sorry wasnt thinking straight when I wrote that its early. And thanks Shas'O Dorian I saw a pic like that somewhere and thats why I asked this question I also want to know if the MK6 piece provides better protection I thought I heard somewhere it was stronger than the MK7 piece but was harder to reproduce so that was why that portion of the armor changed to the new shoulder pad

That and IIRC the Comm equipment was stored in the "beak". Which makes headshots a priority. In the case you want to ambush an enemy the first thing you shoot is their Comm equipment so they can't call reinforcements & when that equipment is in front of your face well. . .

That explains why they changed the helmets I always questioned that to but I was still talking about the shoulder pads sorry I should ave been a little more clear on which mk6 piece I was talking about

Shas'O Dorian wrote:That and IIRC the Comm equipment was stored in the "beak". Which makes headshots a priority. In the case you want to ambush an enemy the first thing you shoot is their Comm equipment so they can't call reinforcements & when that equipment is in front of your face well. . .

Because you would otherwise never aim for the head... but yea.

Also, they looked dumb. XD

Soladrin wrote:
Because you would otherwise never aim for the head... but yea.

No the first thing you drop is the comms, and astartes having super human human reflexes stand a better chance at survival if the first shot at the comms is not in their head as well .

If you shoot someone in the head, he can comms as much as he wants too... hes not gonna be using m..

And according to 40k novels, no one ever fights in locations where comms work, there will always be static or jamming, no exceptions.

So where's the comms on a mk7?

The studded shoulder pad is an inferior piece of equipment that could be more easily constructed. During the days of the Horus Heresy it became more difficult to repair and replace armour so where possible the right shoulder pouldrons used the newer materials to better protect the warrior's gun arm and so a studded pad was used on the left arm.

There is no reason that newer better shoulder armour can't have studs added to it to make it look retro. I don't believe that the veterans that tend to have this kind of armour would favour inferior armour. More likely that they have modern stuff made to look ancient to fit in some older suit or simply for taste.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
After 10000 years of use, how many of these inferior shoulder pads are likely to have survived?

With the imperium's logistics problems? Probably more then were ever used

If I remember correctly, the studs were actually bolts used to keep the layered plates of ceremite armor together.


And in the game, I love Beakie armor, I think its easier to paint (a bit less detailed) and the models are a bit smaller

Yeah I think if the veterans are still using this armor it must have some good qualities to it I think those bolts holding the layers of ceramite toghether also deflect rounds a little better thats what I was told so I dont think the armor is inferior in protection but in design and since the left shoulder is the biggest target presented to the enemy you would want that area to have more protection right? so I think the armor was just harder to repair that is why it was changed

The MkVI helmet is excellent for being shot in the face: a nice high-angled surface for deflecting shells, rather than the shell-trap of MkVII armour. There's a reason why many historical helmets had a 'beak' to them.

This is very true but not everytime is a round going to deflect especially the mass reactive bolt rounds SM's use and when your enemy knows where your comm system is which happens to be on your face their only going to shoot at your head

Of course, on a mk7 helmet the comms are just by the ear. Can't see it making much difference.

against a sloped surface a exploding round will do less then a solid slug.

the impact will cause the bolt to detonate, but the sloped surface will deflect most of the force

a solid slug will transfer more of its energy to the surface, doing more damage then the exploding shell, but neither will do much.

Except they're going to try and shoot you in the head anyways, on the principle that everyone keeps their comm-system in their head. Besides, bolts need to penetrate their targets for their mass-reactive warheads to react to mass and detonate. If your armour increases the degree to which shells deflect, then...you do the math.

Speaking of, anyone here familiar with the Israeli Merkava tank? It put the engine block at the front of the tank to put another foot or two of metal in between incoming fire and the crew.

actually ill go with you on this these helmets probably are the better ones but they should have at least put the main parts of the comm system not in the very direct line of fire it should have been located in the back of the helmet with the mic in the front but not in the beak

the same logic behind cars having the engine in the front right?


the logic of slopes applies to tanks as well. modern tanks have low profiles and obtuse angles in their armor plates.

older tanks, namely WW1 and some WW2 tanks were much more upright in profile and had more blocky designs.

German tanks were more streamlined then the rest(till the T-34s that is) allowing for greater damage resistance.

Yes the same logic does apply now i really think about it wow that probably explains why the german tanks were so hard to take out

Grey Templar wrote:

older tanks, namely WW1 and some WW2 tanks were much more upright in profile and had more blocky designs.

You mean like a Leman Russ?

yes exactly like the leman russ

The Mk 6 Shoulder Plates were not stronger. They were weaker, because the newer suits were being made from new materials discovered during the Great Crusade. When those materieals were no longer available, doe to the fighting, the Tech Priests of Mars did what they could...they made an inferrior Shoulder Plate, but put "studs" in them trying to get extra strength. The "studs" were made from the superior materials. However, due the supply issues, all they could do was the limited "stud" design.

The Mk 6 "Beakie" helmets were very popular with the Astartes, who liked how rounds could be deflected away from the face due to the shape of the armor. It was also less bulky, and allowed a better range of movement for the head. However, during fighting with other Astartes, it was discovered that many Bolt rounds would actually be deflected down into the neck, instead of away from the face. That's why Mars designed a new helmet.

Now, 10,000 years after the Heresy, some Astartes wear the older suits of armor as a form of respect of those that came before them. It is considered a sign of honor, as the suit has protected a warrior for close to 10,000 years. Less traditional Chapters will use the newer suits when available, as they are superior, but they may not have anything else. Even the Chaos Marines look to upgrade their suits when they have a chance, taking what newer armor components will work when they can.

All of this is bunk, as it was simply the art design of the early 1980's that determined how the armor looked. The studded shoulder pads looked tougher, so they were put in. As more modern designs started to creep into the range, the story listed above was introduced to explain the new direction that the art was going in. I can still remember seeing Mk 7 and Mk 8 Space Marines for the first time, WAAAAYYYY back in 1992. They were very cool then. Much better than most of the Mk 6 miniatures available at the time. I still have a soft spot in my heart for the Mk 6 Armor, though, as that was the first mark of Power Armor that I purchased for 40K.

Hope this helps...

CaptainLoken wrote:Now, 10,000 years after the Heresy, some Astartes wear the older suits of armor as a form of respect of those that came before them.

I was just about to make this point to answer some earlier posts but CaptainLoken has already said it. The superior or inferior qualities inherent in the materials and/or deisgn of Heresy era armour are largely irrelevent. The studded shoulder pad came to symbolise the Imperial defenders on Terra and this is why suits have either remained as they were then or might possible have been made more recently in the same way. The spiritual and psychological value of such armour is of far more importance to an Astartes than degrees of protection.

Many suits of armor are a conglomoration of multiple marks leaving the additional protection of a specific piece of armor, shoulder pad, helmet, shin guards, small.

if a complete suit of say Mk5 is together it provides a greater amount of protection then a Mk7 or 8, hence the moniker "artificer"

on a side note. anyone ever seen a plastic marine with "Heresy" shin guards and helmet? you see pads and breastplates, but never the legs and helmet.

Alright this all finally make sense to me and I thought that the MK7 helmet was recently having the same bullets deflecting into the neck problem that the MK6 helmets used to have?

Soladrin wrote:If you shoot someone in the head, he can comms as much as he wants too... hes not gonna be using m..

And according to 40k novels, no one ever fights in locations where comms work, there will always be static or jamming, no exceptions.

Ah, but someone ELSE can grab the comms equipment & use it. Two birds with one stone so to say, you destroyed the comm link AND kill someone. Simple tactic of Isolate, Kill. Where as straight up kill may work, but it alerts the enemies main force to your pressence.

Yea I've read the books and that's 100% right. I begin to wonder why they even bring them lol.