Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

So, from where I'm sitting.. BA can do a pretty lethal alpha-strike list. Quite possibly better than tau, unless I'm missing somthing key. What follows is the general concept.

Librarian + Jump pack, Blood Lance, Sword or Rage. = 125

1 x 5man assault troops
+ meltagun, meltabombs = 115

3 x 5man scout squad
+ combat blades = 225

3x Stormraven Gunship
+ TL-lascannon, Typhoon missile 675

2 x 2 Land speeder squadren
+ Typhoon missiles 360

= 1500

We have 10 standard typhoon missiles, 12 str 8 ap 1 long range missiles, three twin-linked lascannons and quite-possibly a lance-weapon from the librarian if the Assault Troops swap their jump-packs for a 1st turn drop-pod. Obviously second turn we loose those 12 bloodstrike missiles but we hope the damage is done!

Pretty decent troops too, all things considered! C&C?

Drop the AMs, get Corbs to help you go 1st.

I think you should ditch the Land Speeders and use the points to make the scouts into assault squads. Meltaguns or flamers in 5 man squads is a big difference, as is power armor and WS 4. Hitting on 5+ against many things is bad.

Also, use even more points to put a Sanguinary Priest in there with them, cause you're going to need the extra initiative and FNP in squads that small.

So minus scouts and speeders gives you 585
Two more assault squads costs 230
plus two Priests is another 150 points about

Then you can take two speeders maybe or bigger assault squads.

5 scouts are worthy of a 50 points land speeder storm, not a 200 point gunship. Just my opinion, but I think you'll have great speed in your list and the assault will be anti-climactic.

rdlb wrote:Hitting on 5+ against many things is bad.

The only thing they hit on 5+ is WS 7 or greater, the primary deficit for them at WS 3 is defensive in nature (getting hit by WS 4 enemies on a 3+).

Your other points are quite valid though.

Jack

Are the stormravens tough enough to survive if you end up going second?

jshbchnn wrote:Are the stormravens tough enough to survive if you end up going second?

Nope, which is why I suggest fitting in Corbulo to re-roll the 1st turn dice.

Wait.. what could reliably put firepower down on a list like this? From range, assuming a defensive long-ranged set-up?

Corbulo is a fair point. The aim is (like alot of mech lists) min/maxed units with the emphasis on firepower not assault power.

Razerous wrote:Wait.. what could reliably put firepower down on a list like this? From range, assuming a defensive long-ranged set-up?

Guard 1500:
Without going into a full-out list-
6 Chimeras
2 Autocannons
1 S8 Blast (PBS Soulstorm)
3 Vendettas
2 Manticores

If this goes first on you, it'll curb-stomp you.

If you go 1st, you'll kill all 3 Vendettas, hurt both Manties, and then it's a battle. In their turn 1, they'll probably still kill all your speeders and a Raven.

Iron_Chaos_Brute wrote:

Razerous wrote:Wait.. what could reliably put firepower down on a list like this? From range, assuming a defensive long-ranged set-up?

Guard 1500:
Without going into a full-out list-
6 Chimeras
2 Autocannons
1 S8 Blast (PBS Soulstorm)
3 Vendettas
2 Manticores

If this goes first on you, it'll curb-stomp you.

If you go 1st, you'll kill all 3 Vendettas, hurt both Manties, and then it's a battle. In their turn 1, they'll probably still kill all your speeders and a Raven.

Fair, I guess. Deployment wise only the vendettas and manticores will be in range for sure, the other's depends on who rolled what & placed stuff where. This list does have the options of entirely deep-striking in But thats piecemeal as it doesn't make use of DoA.

Yeah that's what I meant...getting hit on a 3+

Thanks for the correction.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, I think Corbulo is not a good bet if he's just there as a way to ensure you go first, the vast majority of the time you can roll two dice and still not get a six.

I think a back up plan for going second would be better...

Razerous wrote:

Iron_Chaos_Brute wrote:

Razerous wrote:Wait.. what could reliably put firepower down on a list like this? From range, assuming a defensive long-ranged set-up?

Guard 1500:
Without going into a full-out list-
6 Chimeras
2 Autocannons
1 S8 Blast (PBS Soulstorm)
3 Vendettas
2 Manticores

If this goes first on you, it'll curb-stomp you.

If you go 1st, you'll kill all 3 Vendettas, hurt both Manties, and then it's a battle. In their turn 1, they'll probably still kill all your speeders and a Raven.

Fair, I guess. Deployment wise only the vendettas and manticores will be in range for sure, the other's depends on who rolled what & placed stuff where. This list does have the options of entirely deep-striking in But thats piecemeal as it doesn't make use of DoA.

My criteria for list-making these days is: "Can it survive against a Guard army that goes first?"

Drop pods or en-mass jump pack blood angels (Jump pack assault marines are well priced, likewise for the cheaper but transport-buying grey hunters) will ruin any guard armies day.

As for the alpha strike.. its basically how much pew a stormraven with a free TL-lascannon, 4 bloodstrike rockets and a 25pt typhoon upgrade; Its pretty pew. 675-900pts could make a pretty standard core (900 = +3 scout squads).

Edit: OH Damn! Dreadnoughts + assault ramps. Furioso dreads with a 12" move +dread base + 2" disembark + 6" charge.. thats an easy 22".. Ooo! (right?)

@ Razerous you forgot the DC Dread's fleet added in. :Þ

True but DC are a bit of a diamond encrusted platinum cannon.. That can't capture objectives.. Pretty awesome but pretty damned expensive when you play their full better-than-assault-marines-slash-everything potential.

I hate five man assault squads.

They stinketh.

G

Black Blow Fly wrote: I hate five man assault squads.

They stinketh.

G

Why? You hate them because they are win sauce or because they suck?

Five-man assault squads tend to evaporate in a single turn of shooting, which is why they stink.

TheRhino wrote:Five-man assault squads tend to evaporate in a single turn of shooting, which is why they stink.

Which is why you have them in a transport and accompanied by a Sanguinary Priest.

Depends on what kind of transport...anything other than a LR has too many weapons that can oust them and once ousted, FNP is not great when low numbers are involved.

Sanctjud wrote:Depends on what kind of transport...anything other than a LR has too many weapons that can oust them and once ousted, FNP is not great when low numbers are involved.

Not to mention with a 5 man unit, a Demolisher Cannon, Plasma Canon or 2 Plasma guns just chew through them, FnP or not.