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Maximumbob wrote: My personal sweet-spot in a kill team is 5 ABR intercessors, 2 Aggressors, and an inceptor. Sargent with a PF.
15 SIA shots at 24", 12+2D6 aggressors (X2 stationary), 6 S5 AP-1. Fall back and shoot, move, advance and shoot with no penalty. Coupled with 12 PF attacks in melee.
Struggling to find a better balance for my playstyle.
That's about where I'm at. It's just really tempting to get up to T5.
I want to include reivers, but I can't really justify doing so.
Pods deny the use of two of our most important Kill Team components: VanVets and Termies. Amusingly though they can fit Bikes because WTFGW. They're still a pass for me, even on T1.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/09/05 14:08:49
Sterling191 wrote: Pods deny the use of two of our most important Kill Team components: VanVets and Termies. Amusingly though they can fit Bikes because WTFGW. They're still a pass for me, even on T1.
Cool, thanx for not answering my question, which was "if you HAD to use one, how would you load out the Vet squad?", not "Are DP worth taking?"
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/09/05 14:16:32
If you HAD to bring 1 or more, how would you kit out a Vet squad to use it?
Storm bolters. It costs about as much as the termies, *but* you the droppod itself is pretty durable and being able to roadblock (and chew through) a giant blob of cultists or gaunts has value. Oldmarines still have a cost problem when you try to kit them out for the very fancy stuff, but stormbolters are cheap and can overwhelm anything with a greater than 4+ armor save.
It used to be a good idea to drop a plasma squad, but I'd rather spend the point on Hellblasters and just nail the same target from greater than 24 inches away.
Bender wrote:* Realise that despite the way people talk, this is not a professional sport played by demi gods, but rather a game of toy soldiers played by tired, inebriated human beings.
Emphasis mine. You asked two question. I answered the one I felt qualified to respond to. I won't take pods, so I'm not going to give you erroneous info on what to put in them. If you want me to bs you, I'm more than happy to do so.
Emphasis mine. You asked two question. I answered the one I felt qualified to respond to. I won't take pods, so I'm not going to give you erroneous info on what to put in them. If you want me to bs you, I'm more than happy to do so.
That's fair. I was just hoping for something more than a shut-down. I'm always brainstorming ways to buy more models and with DPs being useful, even empty, I was giving them some thought.
Heck, I may even just use 1 to drop in my Watch Master to be close to my Intercessors
Galef wrote: I'm always brainstorming ways to buy more models and with DPs being useful, even empty, I was giving them some thought.
Heck, I may even just use 1 to drop in my Watch Master to be close to my Intercessors
There's absolutely nothing wrong with that mate. Sometimes the cons outweigh the pros however, and in this case I feel that they do. Especially in the context of stratagem based deepstrike, which changes the equation considerably.
Now if pods were cheaper, and/or we could take optimal squad configurations in them, itd be a different story.
Slayer-Fan123 wrote: Well the army has the option to basically save points for 1CP. It's hard to pass up that opportunity.
Alternatively, I see the value in spending 65pts to SAVE 1CP and be able drop in on Turn 1. I just want to try and get MORE value out of that.
I'd love to drop in 5 Vets with 4 Frag cannons, but man is that points inefficient. SB/SS Vets seem sadly the only option Or at the very least, I could use a DP as terrain.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/09/05 15:12:35
If I had to use one, I'd try and build around the team's main weakness: lack of termi & VV team members. So a) limited survivability and b) no withdraw and shoot.
That would probably mean nearly full stormshields to help mitigate survival, only drop where I can get the team in cover, and maybe a blackshield and sarg with CC weapons.
297pts buys you ten vets, 8 SS/SB, 2 THs (maybe a different weapon) and the pod. Not terrible, by any means, but you've gotta have a really good reason to cleary bubblewrap turn one, or it seems a bit pointless.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/09/05 15:14:10
Alright, crazy talk time. Three Invictors forward deployed, backed by three of grouchoben's teams (shave the THs for power fists), backed by a turn two drop of two Gravis-Fortis teams out of the teleportarium.
Should have just enough points leftover to fit three HQs (two for DW batallion, one for SM vanguard) and still meet the "boots on the ground" requirements.
Probably a terrible idea, but sounds absolutely hilarious.
And it doesn't matter if the unit gets the aura. Regular Reivers are useless and got the aura, AND they have more means to get into range to use that and their grenade.
Nobody is clamoring towards them for a reason. It's a bad idea, period, especially with the lost extra shot.
Apocryphal statement. It is a good idea even if it is not the most competitive.
Slayer-Fan123 wrote: Well the army has the option to basically save points for 1CP. It's hard to pass up that opportunity.
Alternatively, I see the value in spending 65pts to SAVE 1CP and be able drop in on Turn 1.
I just want to try and get MORE value out of that.
I'd love to drop in 5 Vets with 4 Frag cannons, but man is that points inefficient. SB/SS Vets seem sadly the only option
Or at the very least, I could use a DP as terrain.
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UM, no.
Look, the army is already CP hungry as is, and you got IG to fill that gap. If you're going pure, you don't HAVE points for Drop Pod missions, especially as you need to get bigger squads to get bigger value of the Drop Pod or 1CP.
The latter starts to make more sense so more points can be invested towards units you might struggle with like tanks.
CaptainStabby wrote: If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.
jy2 wrote: BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.
vipoid wrote: Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?
MarsNZ wrote: ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
So, just a small thing. Had a little game the other night. I was very much surprised and pleased with the output of a couple 5 man stalker bolt rifle teams.
They did a good amount of work on a pair of Hellbrutes and even a maulerfiend as well as working over some chaos marine squads.
The two damage was great and I think they have a good use in the force, especially vs MCs which they could use the poison rounds on, kraken or vengenace rounds I feel like with some ok rolling will really help out vs polishing off some T7 vehicles even.
I may need to pick up a box for them. I'll field them a few more times to try it out.
AngryAngel80 wrote: So, just a small thing. Had a little game the other night. I was very much surprised and pleased with the output of a couple 5 man stalker bolt rifle teams.
They did a good amount of work on a pair of Hellbrutes and even a maulerfiend as well as working over some chaos marine squads.
The two damage was great and I think they have a good use in the force, especially vs MCs which they could use the poison rounds on, kraken or vengenace rounds I feel like with some ok rolling will really help out vs polishing off some T7 vehicles even.
I may need to pick up a box for them. I'll field them a few more times to try it out.
math wise SBR are better than ABR, however, ABR are more versitile and the weight of fire makes them almost as good. They do excel at killing spce marines and MC though.
For me the versility makes the ABR my personal Choice, however, if my local meta was a lot of Terminators/primaris etc, it would we worth the switch.
Much like Han Solo, never tell me the odds. Though jokes aside, I'm well on board with ABRs as well. I just may make up a couple 5 man stalker teams as well as the 2 ABR teams I have already.
Going to try the satlkers out some more but the 2 damage makes them tasty for the fire support while the ABR teams move up and hose down the targets with weight of fire.
instead of the crovus i could play the xiphon, do you think this list could do something, this point lvl is rly nasty for DW^^ tryed to include a Levi but nothing makes sense XD
Admech & Deathwatch --------------------------------------
Don´t Hessel the Hof
I feel that with that low point limit, you are going to need to be very efficient with your points to remain competitive. I would consider dropping the corvus and replacing with a contemptor mortis with 2 twin las. This may even leave you enough left over to include a bike squad to help with mobility(both mobility of this unit as well as a teleport home for a kill team) and chaff clearance.
I would also look at the stalker bolt kill team. How do you intend to use them? Typically I use them for backfield long range fire support - if that is the plan, keep it efficient and get rid of the melee units. You could have 7 stalker bolts and 2 terminators for the same price- one terminator with a cyclone, and the other with a power sword. Sit them in cover and soak up volume of fire with the termie and big shots with the ss.
I know I've ask about Drop Pods already, but what to you think about using one in conjunction with the Beacon Angelis to basically drop in a Primaris unit?
Basically you deploy Hellblasters (or an Intercessor unit with plenty of Hellblasters or Plasma Inceptors) out of LoS.
Turn 1 Drop Pod comes in with a Character with the Beacon, then teleport over the HellBlasters.
The net effect is the same as having the Hellblasters themselves in the Drop Pod, even though this isn't possible. All the better if the Character is either a Capt or WatchMaster for rerolls
Ahhh ok now i get it, just replace the corvus and the 3 bikes + VV
So i just need to look how to include Anti tank
The good thing in this tourny is, the missions, you choose them almost like ITC but a bit different, these guys sit on my home base marker and score every round
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2019/09/12 06:06:51
Admech & Deathwatch --------------------------------------
Don´t Hessel the Hof
Some options could be:
dread with lascannon and missiles
Mortis contemptor dread with twin las cannon (my favourite)
Razorback with las cannon (Lazerback)
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/09/12 06:43:38
Galef wrote: I know I've ask about Drop Pods already, but what to you think about using one in conjunction with the Beacon Angelis to basically drop in a Primaris unit?
Basically you deploy Hellblasters (or an Intercessor unit with plenty of Hellblasters or Plasma Inceptors) out of LoS.
Turn 1 Drop Pod comes in with a Character with the Beacon, then teleport over the HellBlasters.
The net effect is the same as having the Hellblasters themselves in the Drop Pod, even though this isn't possible. All the better if the Character is either a Capt or WatchMaster for rerolls
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Well a jump cap moves 12+d6, and the beacon has a range of 6" anyway, and hellblasters just need that 15" range, so I'm not sure the pod is a worthwhile investment over a good old jump cap, if that's the payload.
Some options could be:
dread with lascannon and missiles
Mortis contemptor dread with twin las cannon (my favourite)
Razorback with las cannon (Lazerback)
Hm with mortis contemptor i have 50 points left. Add two bikes?
Ven Dread is to squishy, razorback too gues i need to include the mortis contemptor
Why is the razoback your favourite? beacause he costs only 110 points? ^^
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/09/12 09:00:53
Admech & Deathwatch --------------------------------------
Don´t Hessel the Hof
Now, I see lists with missile launchers in the vet teams ? Do you all really find them as key units ?
I'm sure I get their use but if they are so key, why do they feel that way to you all ? Just for curiosity and perhaps new DW players who may read this.
As heads up I usually run my forces to hug the enemy and run a good amount of frag cannons for my heavies so haven't tried a missile launcher fire base yet.
AngryAngel80 wrote: Now, I see lists with missile launchers in the vet teams ? Do you all really find them as key units ?
I run two pairs of missile vets in Stalker Vet teams pretty consistently. They're not the killiest, or the most reliable, of lads (barring one set who consistently make some of the most eye popping clutch rolls when I absolutely positively need them to), but they're a threat that cant be ignored. Their big appeal is that they draw fire, and with their range that fire usually means heavy weapons that the Stalker Vets toting Storm Shields are in a great spot to soak. They're also a necessary component of the Bike/VV combat squad formula.
In short, they aint flashy, they aint meta defining, but treat em right and they'll do solid work for you.
Admech & Deathwatch
you mean replace the bikes and 2 vanguards for more stalker und 2 termis?