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The off-topic forum on Dakka is provided as a place for people to have polite discussions about non-miniature wargaming topics, and currently topics of any nature can be posted there. However, political and religious discussions tend to have a way to make people react very defensively and negatively towards any viewpoint that isn't shared by themselves and that often results in threads that have to be locked or edited by our moderators (which is work for them).

Would you prefer if Dakka's off-topic forum rules forbade political and/or religious discussions? Or do you think that their inclusion provides a healthy outlet for sentiments that would otherwise creep into other forum threads on the site?

I agree that such "discussions" should be actively discouraged if for no other reason than the fact that it is impossible for most people to separate their emotions from their beliefs. If someone has invested a great deal of emotion into whatever they believe, they are automatically defensive when someone questions their belief and prone to striking out (in written form here).

Agnosto, people can't separate their emotions from their gaming opinions, let alone political and religious views. While Dakka is a gaming forum, the off topic forum is set aside for non-gaming discussions. Even though I don't actively participate in them, I believe that they would crop up in other threads if an area were not set aside for them.

Gavin Thorne wrote:Agnosto, people can't separate their emotions from their gaming opinions, let alone political and religious views. While Dakka is a gaming forum, the off topic forum is set aside for non-gaming discussions. Even though I don't actively participate in them, I believe that they would crop up in other threads if an area were not set aside for them.

Apples and oranges. Most rules discussions, even heated ones, wind up with one party or the other just thinking, "fine, whatever" and going on with their life. I dare you to get "pro-life" and "pro-choice" people in the same discussion and witness the same result. These are completely different levels of emotional investment (for most people).

These are just my thoughts on the matter.

I think they are fine to continue.. Thats what the off topic forum is for.

I mean there is a guy, I forgot who has a big 'A' in his signature. If you click on it it identifies him as an atheist. Not a big deal is it..

I think you would be better off saying no abortion arguments/discussion.. IF you have to censor something.. But I never want more censorship.

If people wish to air their political preferences there are so many other more fitting outlets than Dakka.

I don't see that censorship is an issue here.

Dakka Dakka is better than Yakka Yakka to paraphrase and twist ol' Winnie's words

Get rid of them. Both politics and religion. It has absolutely NO place here. A forum I frequent outside of Dakka has religious discussion outright banned simply to keep drama from erupting into a wildfire. With both Politics and Religion, it just comes down to "My beleif is better than yours, and yours is trash.", and when that is contested an all-out flame fest just ensues. I'm tired of it.

So, Heres an idea:

Keep the wargaming to the wargaming forums, (Thats what this forum is for!)
Keep the Religious talk to the religion forums, (We don't need to know about Jesus in a wargaming forum.)
Keep the Politics to the politics forums. ( X politician is an idiot, we know. Don't care.)

Problem solved.

I think that they should be allowed to be posted as long as the people don't rage over someone else.

I don't think they should be forbidden, just maybe moderated a bit more. There seems to be a lot of genuine attempts at reasonable discussion that get trolled and spammed into flame wars.

While a miniature web site is not the first place I would think of to seek religious insight, I think it should be allowed. People talk religion and politics with their friends and co-works all the time. Why wouldn't people be able to do that with their online friends too?

In any forums where political and religous topics are allowed they almost always turn into a one-upping pissing match where people start intentionally trying to rile someone up in most cases.

Dont allow it!

Personally, I agree that they just need to be a bit more strictly moderated. I've seen numerous religious/political topics get into flame wars, and then the thread got locked. On the other hand, there are people on these boards who are capable of having calm, even-minded discussions about the topics. It's punishing the whole for the acts of the few (Though I admit that it may well be a majority of flamers and trolls who go to religious/political discussions in the first place) and I don't think it's necessary to go for an all-out ban on the topics.

I think that if they kept it going to would just piss a whole bunch of people off because a lot of people have different presprectives.

They probabbly shouldn't have it, But
Honestly I dont Really care.

I think if there was a debates section where religous, political and other more serious subjects could, the heated disscussion could be contained

I think both should be allowed, but Moderated more. It seems like most threads become Lock-worthy after the 2nd-4th page.

Is this seriously being considered? Some people can't control their emotions on the internet, I know (and Dakka is by no means alone in this), but the majority of us (just barely perhaps) are capable of having mature discussions surely?

Flashman wrote:Is this seriously being considered? Some people can't control their emotions on the internet, I know (and Dakka is by no means alone in this), but the majority of us (just barely perhaps) are capable of having mature discussions surely?

I think your idea of a 'majority' is a bit distorted. There are a lot of people that like to take their anonymousity to their advantage and stir up a shitfest whenever they can. I think the fact that nearly every single rampant politics/religion thread has been closed without a civil ending to it has spoken a lot. Its just a waste of time for the people that work hard at keeping this forum clean. They shouldn't have to deal with that crap.

Openmindedness is an amazing thing. Everyone should be open minded. But a person should always tread their ground where its appropriate. So if they want to talk religion? Go to a religion forum, its what its made for.

I mean, I'm a member of Airsoft Canada, Basically the airsoft hobbyists hub for everything airsoft in canada. Just recently people started asking medical questions on the off topic and honestly expected an educated answer.

Sure, there could be one out of the thousands that frequent the site that knows a bit about medical issues... But seriously.

Its an airsoft forum, not an online clinic.

This very thing applies to DakkaDakka here. Dakkadakka is a wargaming/miniature creativity forum, I don't see why and how people asserting their beleifs in politics or their religion is really an appropriate thing here. If you sign up on this forum, you sign up to get involved with a community that shares simular interests : Miniatures and model painting. One of the other. We didn't sign up to debate what religion is better. Why your government sucks or whatever.

Miniatures, wargaming, tabletop hobby. Leave it to that, anything else is pretty much useless banter that will probably end up being on the Locked Thread list.

I voted either way. I'd honestly prefer either extreme over the sometimes confusing middle-ground.

I don't care either way until they begin to get offensive to members.

I think that if it's gotten to the point that we're having a poll appearing on the Front Page of DakkaDakka.com then it means that something should be done about it.

It's very rare anyway that people are going to be open-minded on topics as such, not saying that not everyone is narrow-minded, but very few people want to accept other opinions on these topics and it is very literally human nature not to.

I vote that it is banned for the following reasons

1. Less needless work for admins
2. Save people the anger
3. Cut down on spam in that section perhaps? (I don't visit it much)

political and religious discussions tend to have a way to make people react very defensively and negatively towards any viewpoint that isn't shared by themselves and that often results in threads that have to be locked or edited by our moderators (which is work for them).

Understatement of the year.

Would you prefer if Dakka's off-topic forum rules forbade political and/or religious discussions?

Yes, there's no need for something so persistently destructive on a forum devoted to toy soldiers and escapist fun. There are plenty of other places fanatics can go to insult or threaten each other over ideology.

Politics and Religion are no different than discussions about 'Cheese' and soft scores.

As long as the discussion doesn't include attacks, it should be fine.

Sex, religion, and politics; don't discuss at work and don't discuss on dakka.

There are plenty of other websites dedicated to one or more of the three.

Game on.

If someone doesn't want to participate in such a conversation they don't have to click on the link. Very easily solved imho.

If I can avoid posts by people I view as pompous asses then they can avoid political/religious conversations

Politics and Religion are no different than discussions about 'Cheese' and soft scores. As long as the discussion doesn't include attacks, it should be fine.

Except that it regularly results in attacks and worse, which is why a poll on possibly eliminating that part of the forum is being taken in the first place.

BrassScorpion wrote:Except that it regularly results in attacks and worse, which is why a poll on possibly eliminating that part of the forum is being taken in the first place.

I don't see what can possibly be "worse" over a forum. Generally, the worst someone can do is attempt to offend my with some juvenile assault composed of over-used, thoughtless, words. It sure huts....:( (/sarcasm off). I guess I am just thick skinned. Sensitive people are just part of life. I just ignore them and move on my way.

Either way, censorship is never the answer as far as I am concerned. I don't care what they choose to do with their forums, as it is there decision and "freedom of speech" doesn't exist as you are in a private domain; however, I still view censorship as a weak fix and I am entitled to my opinion because they asked me for it

I feel if it was moderated fairly it could work. People who want to "discuss" such things can. Others who do not can pass. I have not been on Dakka much as of late due to a sour taste I was left with over moderation. No names here. A person of religion "A" was straightening out some misconceptions of said religion, and the conversation continued to degenerate. The moderator did nothing to change the tone of the discussion, but continued posting in the thread as if it wasn't going on. An informative post came up about religion "B", and the moderator involved in the other conversation quickly locked the thread. I PM'd him about it and got a dodgy answer, that was vague and did not answer my question. It offered no counter points. I contacted the OP and stated I felt he was not being inflammatory in his post but informative.

As I said, if moderated fairly yes it can be done. I have not seen that, admittedly after that I have not been on much. To make a long story short, I voted "No it doesn't belong here".

Shut it down. Some of the trolls there post for no other reason except to flame bait. A couple of the more vocal idiots don't post anywhere else on the forum that I can see.

BrassScorpion wrote:

Politics and Religion are no different than discussions about 'Cheese' and soft scores. As long as the discussion doesn't include attacks, it should be fine.

Except that it regularly results in attacks and worse

And so do topics about Cheese and soft scores. Thus my point.

Granted, I don't have a horse in this race really because I don't venture into the OT forums.

Here's a thought:

Do we have room for separate forums for religion and politics? A gaming-centered forum I sometimes frequent has the following:

"The Political Mudpit:
Use this forum to discuss current events and specific individuals in politics today."

"Ethos, Mores, et Monastica:
Discuss ethics, morals, religion and philosophy in here."
Furthermore, they have a special forum specifically reserved for debating. Does Dakka have the resources to pull this off?

I think it would be unwise to ban such discussions. While based on the discussion of wargaming, DakkaDakka is still a community. As such, its members should have opportunities to discuss a wide variety of topics with this community.