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Hey, I've just started playing WHFB and this is my first meager attempt at a 2250 army

L: Chaos Sorcerer Lord, 4th lvl, MoT, Disc, Roar, Golden Eye and Talisman of Protection : 370 points

H: Chaos Sorcerer, 2th lvl, MoT, Disc, Infernal Puppet and Talisman of Protection : 210 points

H: Chaos Sorcerer, 2th lvl, MoS, Steed of Slaanesh, 2xdispel scrolls : 200 points

H: Chaos Sorcerer, 2th lvl, MoS, Steed of Slaanesh, 2xdispel scrolls : 200 points

C: Chaos Warriors x 12, MoS, musician, BSB (war banner), Shields : 245 points

C: Chaos Warriors x 12, MoS, musician, BSB (war banner), Shields : 245 points

C: Marauder Horsemen x 5, MoS, Throwing axes, light armor : 90 points

C: Marauder Horsemen x 5, MoS, Throwing axes, light armor : 90 points

C: Chaos Warhounds x 5 : 30 points

C: Chaos Warhounds x 5 : 30 points

S: Chaos Knight x 5, MoS, musician : 220 points

S: Chaos Knight x 5, MoS, musician : 220 points

R: 2 x Chaos Spawn : 110 points

Total 2260 (so I need to free 10 points, shouldn't be too difficult)

Well, the basic idea is to use the warriors and spawns as a tarpit and engage the main enemy force. The real force should in theory be the knights / magic and the horsemen with a sorcerer on the steed of slaanesh go warmachine/skirmish hunting.

Hoping for some constructive input and please bear in mind that this is my first army EVER so I wont be offended if it totally sucks noodles.

Regards

Kaleb

well first off.... you can only have 1 bsb, and it can only be an exalted hero.... so thats saving you 100 points. also note you can only have a single magic item of each, so no 2x war banners. youve also got dual talisman of protections....again only 1 of these is allowed per army.so thats another 15 pts.

suggestions: the talisman of pro is not really worth it. for whenever you need a ward save (facing high str hits or otherwise that ignore your chaos armor) a 6+ save probally wont do much. having 4 sorcerers in your army with 4x dispel scrolls seems like overkill. with the 4 sorc you have, your already getting 6 DD wich is respectable. 4 more dispel scrolls.... are you planning on facing off against magic heavey lists? otherwise id probally loose 2 of the scrolls. so as it is, counting the 10pts your over, ive hacked off 120pts. heres a suggested alternitive based on your idea.

L: sorc lord MoT, DoT, ninfernal puppet, golden eye, roar = 355
H: sorc, lvl 2, MoT, book of secrets, scroll = 155
H: sorc, MoS, power familiar, dispel scroll, 140
H:exalted, BsB, banner of wrath, SoB, bronze armor = 215

C: 12 warriors, cmnd, shields MoS = 232
C: 11 warriors cmnd, shields, MoS = 216
C: 10 maruders, flails, champ MoS = 68
C: 5 warhounds = 30
C: 5 warhounds = 30
C: 5 Horsemen MoS, Throwing axes, light armor = 90
C: 5 Horsemen MoS, Throwing axes, = 85
S: 5 chaos knights, champ, standard = 240
S: 5 chaos knights, champ, standard = 240
R: 2 spawn, MoS = 150
tota; = 2246

tried to keep your characters, youve still got your tizzy lord sorc who will dominate in magic vrs anything short of a tizz daemon or slaan army, the puppet helps with miscasts or screws enemy miscasts, the other 2 sorc add some more punch, book of secrets helps with any miscasts, plus adds a nice fire spell, while your slannesh sorc gets an extra PD to help with tougher spells. i put a basic exalted in, who carrys a neat magic missle banner for some more magic offensive power, plus he can hold his own in a challenge. (suggest running him in the block of 11 warriors) otherwise your list is the same. i added a small group of foot maraduers to mainly act as a flank gaurd, or charger and to provide some help for the warriors, the spawns got ASF, and your knights lost thier marks, since they already cause fear, and so they should'nt really need to worry about most psycology stuff. i did have to drop the light armor on 1 of the horsemen groups to make everything fit under limit, but if you really want it, the maruder footmen could loose thier flails instead. i did drop your slanesh steeds, mainly because fast moving sorcs going for combat dosent really do much.... especially on a lvl 2, they will probally just get pegged off. your flying sorc lord can easilly take over the role of fast mobile blasty guy with his lowbies throwing out stuff to cover him from a distance (and from the saftey of your core units)

tatics wise, your knights will runwiththe horsemen and hounds, your disc sorc generally makes a nusiance of himself and your other 2 probally run wioth the maruders or other warriors, or even solo to just provide core support. i wouldnt worry bout war machines, since your knights can easy deal with them.

Darth is taking you in the right direction, but his list could be trimmed to be more efficient.

Cut out the unit champions. Cost a lot & can force a challenge at the wrong time.
No need for a mark on the spawn - their job is to hold units, not win combats.
Change one of the horsemen units to flails. They can either hunt warmachines or flank/rear charge ranked units.
Not a bit fan of the Banner of Wrath. No magic banner, War Banner or the frenzy banner are all good choices.
Need a disk on TZ sorcerer #2. Mobility is very important in getting in range for your spells.

well first off.... you can only have 1 bsb, and it can only be an exalted hero.... so thats saving you 100 points. also note you can only have a single magic item of each, so no 2x war banners. youve also got dual talisman of protections....again only 1 of these is allowed per army.so thats another 15 pts.

Ah, misunderstood that. Thx for clearing that up.

having 4 sorcerers in your army with 4x dispel scrolls seems like overkill. with the 4 sorc you have, your already getting 6 DD wich is respectable. 4 more dispel scrolls.... are you planning on facing off against magic heavey lists?

You are probably right. Ill probably play mostly against skaven, vc and dwarves.

The plan with the sorcerers on slaanesh steed was that they should join the marauder units as both are fast cavalry. That idea has been flushed down the drain I just love the model of the steed, but to be honest Im having trouble finding any real use for them.

Cut out the unit champions. Cost a lot & can force a challenge at the wrong time.
No need for a mark on the spawn - their job is to hold units, not win combats.
Change one of the horsemen units to flails. They can either hunt warmachines or flank/rear charge ranked units.
Not a bit fan of the Banner of Wrath. No magic banner, War Banner or the frenzy banner are all good choices.
Need a disk on TZ sorcerer #2. Mobility is very important in getting in range for your spells.

I agree with you on the TZ sorcerer, imo he will do better with a disc. I think ill play around with different banners. I don't think I'll take unit champs, as you say, the challenges can f*** them up pretty easily.

Thx for the input, keep it coming, its always refreshing to get new ideas and stomped the old ones to the curb

Regards

Kaleb

point of clarification. The warrior units are allowed to take a magic banner (up to 50 pts?) on their unit standard. This is separate from the battle standard bearer (character) who adds an extra +1 to resolution and allows for a re-roll on break checks, and can also carry a magic banner with no points limit.

Darth and Ran say good things, though I may disagree on some command options and stuff. Here's my spin and I'll explain what I'm thinking:

L: Sorcerer Lord - MoT, level 4, golden eye, infernal puppet, disc = 370
H: Sorcerer - MoT, level 2, book of secrets, talisman of protection, roar, disc = 220
H: Sorcerer - MoS, level 2, 2 dispel scrolls = 175
H: Exalted - MoT, BSB, biting blade, enchanted shield, collar = 190

C: 12 Warriors - MoS, full command, shields = 232
C: 12 Warriors - MoS, standard, musician, shields = 220
C: 5 Horsemen - MoS, musician, t.axes, light armor = 96
C: 5 Horsemen - MoS, musician, t.axes, light armor = 96
C: 5 Warhounds = 30
C: 5 Warhounds = 30

S: 5 Knights - MoS, standard, musician = 240
S: 5 Knights - MoS, standard, musician = 240

R: 2 Spawn = 110
--------
2249

Sorcerers > My level 4 is much like Darth's level 3 (?), except with another level (5 dice gateway ftw ) and the roar put onto the other disc sorcerer, as it means the level 4 isn't necessarily as tempted to get that close to things and yell - remember that gateway requires no LoS. My level 2 tizz dude is basically Darth's, except on a disc and with roar, AND with the talisman: I don't know about you or Darth, but a 5+ ward is quite a bit better than a 6+ ward the way I roll. And shooting him will be a decent priority for the other dude. Then the sorcerer coven finishes up with the level 2 slaanesh guy, except mine is mostly a scroll caddy. If you can handle 1 scroll in the army, I'd prefer to give him either spell familiar or the eye of tizz gift, so he will have a better chance of getting spells he can use against all opponents.

BSB > Like Darth, I think you need a BSB more than a 4th sorcerer. Mine is pretty middle of the road, with 4 S5 AP attaks (importantly: magical, for those ethereals you're likely to run into with VC), a 2/5+ save and MR(2). An option would be to put the book on him though, effectively giving you a 4th caster

Core > Much like your core, but with adjusted command. Cav get musicians to help them do their job (bait-n-flee, light combat), and the warriors that hold onto the BSB get a champion to absorb a challenge he may not want. Other champ is dropped for points.

Knights > Nice work, keep them slaanesh for taking on all these terror causers now. Also, standards are nice on non-khorne knights, so they can win more.

Spawn > Yay spawn!

That's my take anyway. Basically yours, but with the BSB added and some item / command swaps.

- Salvage

sorry my initial likst was suposed to have the lord as lvl 4. as for spawn with MoS they get ASF, wich while not intended to win combat, its sure to make foes think twice, plus it makes sure they get thier licks in before possibly getting killed. question? how do you get a 5+ ward of the talisman? it says its a 6+ ward save... unless it stacks with something i forgot about? otherwise, i defer to salvage, as his help on my own WoC has proven extremly competetive.

Im pretty sure MoT stacks with the Talisman, thus a 5+ ward save?

Yes the ward saves do stack also guys you have to remember with BSB that if you take a magic banner you can't take magic items as well, it is one or the other not both.

Can i choose a BSB and not add a magic banner? So he can still have magic items or do a BSB have to equip a magic banner?

PG: 121 WoC army book:

"one exalted hero in the army may carry a battle standard for +25 points. The exalted hero carrying the battle standard can have any magic banner (no points limit) but if he carries a magic banner he cannot carry any other magic items."

yes your bsb can have a "normal" banner and magic items. But if he chooses to take a magic banner, no other magic items allowed.

Great, thats what I thought. Thanks for clearing it up.