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I am of the opinion that targets should be easier to hit if the range is very close. So I propose that if a target is with 1/4 of the weapon's range then BS is upped by 1. Or re-rolls to hit, or something.

Thoughts?

Heh, then call it the "Whites of their eyes" rule.

Sweet! BS 4 on Earthshakers within 60 inches! Mmmm mmm good!

Would be nice. It's kind of annoying spending a turn or two trying to get that meltagun real close to a key enemy vehicle, only to miss.

argueably it would be harder to shoot something thats point blank ready to jump at you and eat your face off. Then again its easier to shoot something right in front of you... its a neat rule, but it would slow the game down unless it was a simple thing like 12' rapid fire being 6' point blank shot

Mathematically, wouldn't all "unlimited" or "infinite" range weapons also always get this bonus then? (1/4)Infinity = Infinity.

Skinnattittar wrote:Mathematically, wouldn't all "unlimited" or "infinite" range weapons also always get this bonus then? (1/4)Infinity = Infinity.

You know what I just realized? Hunter Killer missiles have a longer range than an ICBM. (The Deathstrike).

I would say like 18" or so.

Probably have the max range of the +1 BS be 24" or something of the sort.

Vladsimpaler wrote:

Skinnattittar wrote:Mathematically, wouldn't all "unlimited" or "infinite" range weapons also always get this bonus then? (1/4)Infinity = Infinity.

You know what I just realized? Hunter Killer missiles have a longer range than an ICBM. (The Deathstrike).

I would say like 18" or so.

Probably have the max range of the +1 BS be 24" or something of the sort.

No, the Deathstrike Missle also has unlimited range, it's a typo in it's descriptive entry. Look at the Table of Contents in the back.

Great idea! Wish I'd thought of it. (Oh wait, I did! About 6 months ago.) 1/4 max range I think is a bit much, because something like a broadside would be shooting with BS4 at 18" (BS5 with a targeting array). I think a good compromise would be getting +1BS at 6" rather than 1/4 max range, except weapons with the "pistol" characteristic wouldn't benefit from it as they already count as assault weapons and close combat weapons.

How about:
At between 6"and 3" you add 1 to bs, as the target is close enough for even the worst of shots to seem like a marksman.
However at 3" or lower your stats return to normal, as the enemy are too close to focus on any one target, but you can spray indiscriminately with little to no downside.

S_P

Space_Potato wrote:How about:
At between 6"and 3" you add 1 to bs, as the target is close enough for even the worst of shots to seem like a marksman.
However at 3" or lower your stats return to normal, as the enemy are too close to focus on any one target, but you can spray indiscriminately with little to no downside.

S_P

this is better i think, but what about pistols do they benefit from the between 6 and 3 inch rule? overall this is proabably the best proposed rule i've seen, not space potato's idea specificlly, but the general idea

Why not apply this rule only to infantry-held rapid fire and assault weapons?

Heavy weapons are generally too unwieldy or fire too many shots to get any more accurate at close range than at long range...
But with assault and rapid fire weapons, this is definitely something I'd go for...

Make it a static range though, as just because your weapon has a longer range, doesn't mean your eyesight is magically better.
I think at 6" or closer the unit would get +1 BS for shooting assault and rapid fire weapons.

This could be the effective boost that Tau need to help against fast close combat armies-- being able to jump and step into that killzone, unload with accurate fusilade, then the suits jump out...


Should not apply to vehicles just because it could be imbalanced, but also because the gunner's sight could be obscured or relying heavily on instruments that cannot track movement as well at close range (try it, fast movement at close range makes it harder to track with vehicle mount weapons).

In_Theory wrote:Why not apply this rule only to infantry-held rapid fire and assault weapons?

Heavy weapons are generally too unwieldy or fire too many shots to get any more accurate at close range than at long range...
But with assault and rapid fire weapons, this is definitely something I'd go for...

Make it a static range though, as just because your weapon has a longer range, doesn't mean your eyesight is magically better.
I think at 6" or closer the unit would get +1 BS for shooting assault and rapid fire weapons.

This could be the effective boost that Tau need to help against fast close combat armies-- being able to jump and step into that killzone, unload with accurate fusilade, then the suits jump out...


Should not apply to vehicles just because it could be imbalanced, but also because the gunner's sight could be obscured or relying heavily on instruments that cannot track movement as well at close range (try it, fast movement at close range makes it harder to track with vehicle mount weapons).

I like this idea, it's alwase sorta annoyed me that you couldn't hit targets easier if your stupidly close

In_Theory wrote:Why not apply this rule only to infantry-held rapid fire and assault weapons?

That's fine, but Assault is WAY too good as it always is.

Pistol, Shotgun, and Rapid Fire should get a +1 to hit. That would fix a lot of problems, especially with Shotguns and Pistols. Pistols kinda suck, especially Plasma Pistols and a +1 to hit at maybe 6" would certainly help make it worth its cost!

Shotguns? Well that's pretty darned obvious! : )

Rapid Fire needs to get better and I think that a +1 to hit would certainly help.

Imagine 2o+ guard dropping 60 BS4 lasgun shots with FRFSRF.... Dear god what an amazing concept. A good idea for a rule if I've ever seen one. Assault and Rapid Fire only, sounds like a good compromise to me.

The Odessey wrote:Imagine 2o+ guard dropping 60 BS4 lasgun shots with FRFSRF.... Dear god what an amazing concept. A good idea for a rule if I've ever seen one. Assault and Rapid Fire only, sounds like a good compromise to me.

It brings another dynamic to the game, as typically shooty units would pose more of a threat to even the closest of assult units.

I think it could be done, as long as it was only for rapid fire, pistol, and shotgun.

i think thats a very good change to the rules, and definitely makes sense...
weve actually had this brought up from a few different people in our group from time to time...
however, i dont think unlimited range and ordnance range weapons should benefit from it...

This rule would add a new positive dynamic the game. Sure gunline units could dish out a large amount of shots but they would be vulnerable to assaults. It would encourage players to play more aggressively and increase the "fun factor" of matches. All in all, I see this as a balanced rule. Anyone wanting to play test this with an ork or IG army for lols?

The rule is not balanced.

It is a massive boost to melta guns, for example because you always try to get into 6 inches already.

Heaps of assault oriented armies carry lots of assault weapons and are given a huge boost unless they are 12 inch chargers. Orks are BS2 and get a free hike to BS3 for nothing.

Tau need to keep away from the enemy to make best use of their long range, it does nothing to help them.

What problem in the current rules is this proposed rule meant to fix?

Hmmmmm, Excellent point. Maybe tihs fits in more for cityfight? Same units in houses could technically use this.

Kilkrazy wrote:The rule is not balanced.

It is a massive boost to melta guns, for example because you always try to get into 6 inches already.

Heaps of assault oriented armies carry lots of assault weapons and are given a huge boost unless they are 12 inch chargers. Orks are BS2 and get a free hike to BS3 for nothing.

Tau need to keep away from the enemy to make best use of their long range, it does nothing to help them.

What problem in the current rules is this proposed rule meant to fix?

That's why I suggested that it only apply to Pistols, Rapid Fire, and shotguns. And Tau rarely get to make use of their long range guns as most assault armies get there in one or 2 turns anyway.

It's supposed to be a bit more realistic and apply boosts to weapon types that REALLY need it.

.... Why does rapid fire weaponry need a boost?
(Also for the record... aren't sluggas a pistol type weapon?)


Automatically Appended Next Post:
As for 'pistols' getting better - two words - Inferno Pistol (hate that thing)

I don't like this idea at all.

Right now there's a large incentive for shooting units to get up close and personal - you get to double your shots inside 12". That isn't the minor benefit of +1 BS, it's a direct doubling of your firepower.

Other unit types with pistols and assault weapons are firing as they run into melee, it's a bonus to effect before they set about doing what they're there for - melee.

I just haven't seen units double tapping at close range and thought 'if only they were marginally more accurate'. Often they'll do little damage, but that's more to do with lasguns hitting power armour than the volume or accuracy of fire. Nor have I seen orks or assault marines fire a round off before charging in and thought 'if only the opening volley was marginally more accurate'.

This rule doesn't really impact the basic structure of 40K in any useful way, it'd just be another rule.

I've had my biker command squad get near an enemy land raider, fire 4 meltas, and roll 3 2's and a 1 to hit....

FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

yea, i'm in favor of this rule ><

This rule sould only be be used if the unit fireing has not moved the previous turn.