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This was an arguement with one of my friends, it started out who has the right to outlaw/ destroy all proof that a primarch existed....
well its fairly good guest that the emporar (sorry on spelling) did it. but my qusetion is why???
we came up with a few ideas
one; turn choas before horus heresy and to pretect the rest of the primarch the emporar kill him and destroy all data with him involed.
two; the primarch didn't share his farthers hate for xones and so the emporar blashed him from the imperium as he couldn;t bring himself to kill his son
so if you have an idea plaese help solve it

its really simple.

one went-This record has been deleted by the Inquisition, any further inquiries will be dealt with harshly. Blessed be the mind too small for doubt. are you still reading this? if so you can expect a call from us momentarily-



Seriously, the only real information is that one was loyal and one was a traitor. it is also possable that both were destroyed before the heresy.

[quoteSeriously, the only real information is that one was loyal and one was a traitor. it is also possable that both were destroyed before the heresy.

There is none, because the two Lost Primarchs disappeared with their Legions prior to even the Great Crusade.

oldone wrote:This was an arguement with one of my friends, it started out who has the right to outlaw/ destroy all proof that a primarch existed....

Games Workshop?

Grey Templar wrote:Seriously, the only real information is that one was loyal and one was a traitor. it is also possable that both were destroyed before the heresy.

Which isn't that real, since at least one of the Marine codexes has previously mentioned that they both fought in early days of the Horus Heresy, probably on Horus' side.


To my mind, the best theory remains that both Legions fell to Chaos, and were completely destroyed during the Heresy. After the Heresy, the High Lords expunged all record to make the destruction complete, as a punishment for their fall. The same was not done for the other Traitor Legions because they are still running around causing a ruckuss.

so if they had all been completely destroyed then we would have all records purged from the library and no spiky marines?

Most likely. If their elimination is complete, no reason to keep the knowledge of them around to inspire rebellion.

As far as I know the only sources said that their was no record of them.

their just hooks GW threw out their to encourage creative thinking, but sadly enough I have seen it turn into Flaming more than anything else.

It will all be detailed in the next SM Codex.

Codex: Lost Marines.


In all seriousness, I think Toeko has it spot on.

In one of the videos put out by the black library one of the authors, I 'think' it was Dan Abnet, said he was working on a new SM series and he was being allowed to flesh out some of the information on at least one of the lost Primarchs.

If I can find the vid, I'll add a link here.

Sasori wrote:It will all be detailed in the next SM Codex.

Codex: Lost Marines.

tisk tisk. . . GW spies will hear this and we will surely be doomed for stumbling onto their plans.


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StubbyGB wrote:In one of the videos put out by the black library one of the authors, I 'think' it was Dan Abnet, said he was working on a new SM series and he was being allowed to flesh out some of the information on at least one of the lost Primarchs.

If I can find the vid, I'll add a link here.

I had heard mention of this a little while back but never heard anything about it.

I love Dan Abnet but I think the "lost" primarchs should be Taboo for official authors/GW to touch. Keep them "gone" and allow us lesser mortals the ability to dream.

Honestly, there is no way to solve any of this without more information. Anything here is mere speculation/fan fiction.

I haven't read the Horus Heresy novels but I saw someone paste a quote from it once...

It was of Horus seeing a vision of all the Primarchs in their incubation tubes... and Horus strokes one of the tubes and feels a big feeling of sadness because it's cracked or the infant inside is flawed... I can't remember which, anyway, that was supposed to be one of the expunged Primarchs.

Yeah, Horus is upset because of some unspecified event that occurs to the Primarch. I think he says something along the lines of 'great potential that would never be fulfilled'. I don't think it states if Horus had personally meet the Primarch, or the Emperor had related the lost Primarch's fate to him at a later date.

If Abnett is writing about the lost Primarch... I wonder how much you'd have to bribe him to make it a female Primarch? Because seriously, I'd pay a couple grand for that.

yeah, and the instant you did 2 shield breaker rounds would go right through both of your skulls.

alas, poor Rube and Abnett. we knew them well. the tried to change the cannon of 40k irrevocably and paid the price.

I would still be worth it.

Abnett paid a price? I assumed he was doing well (Ultramarines Movie).

I've never read his stuff.

Henners91 wrote:Abnett paid a price? I assumed he was doing well (Ultramarines Movie).

I've never read his stuff.

I think he's talking about the fact Abnett has developed Epilepsy in a rather poor joke. Indeed they've changed the cannon of 40K to more match with Abnett becasue they realize he's their best writer so just let him shape the universe.

Wow, harsh...

Toeko wrote:As far as I know the only sources said that their was no record of them.

their just hooks GW threw out their to encourage creative thinking, but sadly enough I have seen it turn into Flaming more than anything else.

Exactly what I've always thought. GW wanted to give people some leeway to make their own home-brew SM/CSM chapters. However as long as we're speculating I've always been fond of the second idea the OP proposed, the missing primarchs encounter a friendly or ambivalent xenos race and are ordered to destroy them, but refuse to carry out a command which they see as futile butchery, and flee with their new allies beyond the light of the astronomican.

As for my least favorite explanation, FEMALE PRIMARCH!? no, just no, not a misogynist or anything but i cringe every time i see a "female marine" thread.

Maledictus wrote:

Toeko wrote:As far as I know the only sources said that their was no record of them.

their just hooks GW threw out their to encourage creative thinking, but sadly enough I have seen it turn into Flaming more than anything else.

Exactly what I've always thought. GW wanted to give people some leeway to make their own home-brew SM/CSM chapters. However as long as we're speculating I've always been fond of the second idea the OP proposed, the missing primarchs encounter a friendly or ambivalent xenos race and are ordered to destroy them, but refuse to carry out a command which they see as futile butchery, and flee with their new allies beyond the light of the astronomican.

As for my least favorite explanation, FEMALE PRIMARCH!? no, just no, not a misogynist or anything but i cringe every time i see a "female marine" thread.

Simpliest explaination is the best. They Primarchs did not survive their childhood. They got eaten by giant space-tigers or something. 18 out of 20 Primarchs rose up to be the leaders of their worlds. 90% uber-success rate is still pretty good. The Primarchs are not infallible as the Horus Heresy shows.

KamikazeCanuck wrote:

Maledictus wrote:

Toeko wrote:As far as I know the only sources said that their was no record of them.

their just hooks GW threw out their to encourage creative thinking, but sadly enough I have seen it turn into Flaming more than anything else.

Exactly what I've always thought. GW wanted to give people some leeway to make their own home-brew SM/CSM chapters. However as long as we're speculating I've always been fond of the second idea the OP proposed, the missing primarchs encounter a friendly or ambivalent xenos race and are ordered to destroy them, but refuse to carry out a command which they see as futile butchery, and flee with their new allies beyond the light of the astronomican.

As for my least favorite explanation, FEMALE PRIMARCH!? no, just no, not a misogynist or anything but i cringe every time i see a "female marine" thread.

Simpliest explaination is the best. They Primarchs did not survive their childhood. They got eaten by giant space-tigers or something. 18 out of 20 Primarchs rose up to be the leaders of their worlds. 90% uber-success rate is still pretty good. The Primarchs are not infallible as the Horus Heresy shows.

Then why all the mystery? i was under the impression that the events of the lightning tower were cannon...if they died as children why not have malcador just say "STFU Dorn, you know they were all eaten by space tigers, how could you forget"

Maledictus wrote:

KamikazeCanuck wrote:

Maledictus wrote:

Toeko wrote:As far as I know the only sources said that their was no record of them.

their just hooks GW threw out their to encourage creative thinking, but sadly enough I have seen it turn into Flaming more than anything else.

Exactly what I've always thought. GW wanted to give people some leeway to make their own home-brew SM/CSM chapters. However as long as we're speculating I've always been fond of the second idea the OP proposed, the missing primarchs encounter a friendly or ambivalent xenos race and are ordered to destroy them, but refuse to carry out a command which they see as futile butchery, and flee with their new allies beyond the light of the astronomican.

As for my least favorite explanation, FEMALE PRIMARCH!? no, just no, not a misogynist or anything but i cringe every time i see a "female marine" thread.

Simpliest explaination is the best. They Primarchs did not survive their childhood. They got eaten by giant space-tigers or something. 18 out of 20 Primarchs rose up to be the leaders of their worlds. 90% uber-success rate is still pretty good. The Primarchs are not infallible as the Horus Heresy shows.

Then why all the mystery? i was under the impression that the events of the lightning tower were cannon...if they died as children why not have malcador just say "STFU Dorn, you know they were all eaten by space tigers, how could you forget"

Didn't say they weren't eaten by space-tigers. They just said it was a big missed opportunity. Having a primarch eaten by a space-tiger sounds like a pretty big missed opportunity to me.

Because would you really want to go 'lol mah kidz got eaten by da spess tigrz" if you were the Emperor? Its also possible that they just.. never did anything. They didn't have the same spark or go to to rise to the top so they just sat at the bottom hoping no one noticed them.

Shatter.proof wrote:Because would you really want to go 'lol mah kidz got eaten by da spess tigrz" if you were the Emperor? Its also possible that they just.. never did anything. They didn't have the same spark or go to to rise to the top so they just sat at the bottom hoping no one noticed them.

so we have two legions of college dropout underachiever marines still living in the emperors basement back on terra....

Exactly. If your brother got eaten by a space-tiger would you want to talk about it? Well actually you'd probably talk about that all the time! - but not if you were a Primarch in the year 30,000.

A female primarch! ? Blashphemy!

Actually! Great idea so many people would hate it though.

Imagine, the reason we don't have female space marines is because the special procedures for them were in thus said female primarch who is now gone. So instead of trying over the emeperor just decided to stay with males who where is majority at the time. And the sisters of silence took a vow of silence at the loss of their primarch and just rermaind with the emeperor. I mean the sisters of silence are supposed to be badass, taking on daemons and stuff.

And for the other one could have landed on an exodite world and raised by eldar on the far far edge of the galaxy and still hasn't meet humans. Or almost any other xenos race for that matter.


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And horus was in a feverish dream. His reference to the primarch was more or less saying its a shame they never "made it". Because like the rest of the primarchs they could have been great.

Made it, doenst mean they died. Just that they weren't encountered again

Maledictus wrote:Exactly what I've always thought. GW wanted to give people some leeway to make their own home-brew SM/CSM chapters.

To be honest, I don't think it was specifically done to encourage people to create their own... there's enough scope within the fluff for that anyway.

They were supposed to be a mystery. Not to encourage every second gamer to create a 2nd or 11th Legion...

KamikazeCanuck wrote:Simpliest explaination is the best. They Primarchs did not survive their childhood.

Except that according to the 2nd Ed Ultramarines Codex they took part in the Great Crusade, and that it 'seems likely' that they fought on Horus' side during the Heresy.

Dude. it was totally to give players the option to be an original legion. Traitor or loyal. All 40K fluff is just to get your imagination going. They never figured they'd actually have their own publishing house.

As for that old codex. consider them retconed out. That was before the HH books when things were more mysterious. All legions are accounted for now and there is only 18.