Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I'm building a Chaos Daemon Army and I'm getting near to my next paycheck and was wondering about what to buy, I am stuck between running three Daemon Princes or Two Daemon Princes and A Soul Grinder.

To Me the Soul Grinder seems like it would be a little too fragile because there's no way to repair WD or Immobilized results I was wondering what the general opinion of them was?

If the choice is between 3 daemon princes or 2 and a soul grinder. Pick 3 daemon princes. 1 soul grinder doesnt last long, as all of the enemies anti-tank go right to the soul grinder. 3 daemon princes also are more killy.

Yeah, mrwitter has it right. I love the Soul Grinder model, but Daemon Princes with the Mark of 4+ Invul can carry Bolts of Tzeench, which is your main can opener.

YMMV. Personally, I never take princes. Grinders have always been spectacugreat for me.

That said, Grinders are perfect illustrations of the "one = none" idea. Two of them are hellaciously useful. Three are even better (over 2k, anyway).

I know centurian99 and green blow fly, two very good players who run demons use grinders. Thats the best I can give you, as I dont play demons. But I do fear the grinders more.

What you should really do though is through that money in your savings account.

Personally I would take 2 grinders and a prince as soul grinders have the best fire power in the whole army. If you spam daemon princes then you won't have enough efective fire suport.

If your army needs fire support (as Daemon armies often do) you are better off using SoulGrinders w/ Phlegm
Daemon Princes as fire support are just ok, and quite often its better to take Tz Chariot Heralds or even Horror squads for the same thing.
I think the best use of DPs is either the super Nurgle ones (who are basically GD themselves) or incorporating them into a Fateweaver build.

I'd give the grinders tongue aswel so they stand a chance of destoying tanks without having to get too close for comfort.

Never leave home with less than 2 soul grinders, 3 is preferable. However, the debate between grinders and princes isn't as clear cut.

Here's my rule of thumb. What do you have in your list that can kill a init 4 or above walker. If you fill your hq with heralds, and your elites with crushers or flamers, then you need princes in heavy support. If fielding a greater daemon in your hq and fiends and your elite's, then you can take grinders in heavy support.

I dunno, I have reservations about taking vehicles in an army that can get 3 maximum. Given the mech-heavy metagame, you're just giving the opponent's AT weapons easy targets.

Mortified Penguin wrote:I dunno, I have reservations about taking vehicles in an army that can get 3 maximum. Given the mech-heavy metagame, you're just giving the opponent's AT weapons easy targets.

That is a good point but it can be mitigated by taking 2 Greater Daemons and maybe some Fiends or Bloodcrushers. Any of these units will force your opponent to spread his AT weapons across the board. Functionally its alot like playing a X-Zilla or heavy armor mech list but with both types of units.

The nice thing is that AV13/13 + D. Possession goes a long way to ignoring AT firepower.

They just seem too fragile to me because a Daemon can take 4 wounds where it takes one shot to drop a soul grinder.

It takes the right one shot, though -- you can take a Daemon down with torrent of fire from assault cannons and plasma guns without too much trouble, whereas you need close-range meltas to have a reasonable chance of taking out a Soul Grinder. And if you don't take it out because of the Possession, or because you only shot off one of its many weapons, you're about to lose the melta unit.

I've not played with Daemons, but I usually find I get more trouble from Soul Grinders than Daemons when I play against them, because my opponent deploys and moves to make it hard for me to get close to the Grinder without dying en route...

TheBlackVanguard wrote:They just seem too fragile to me because a Daemon can take 4 wounds where it takes one shot to drop a soul grinder.

Well you're trading immunity from S6 and below and virtual immunity from S7 for the chance that you can be taken out by one lucky shot. With Meltaguns, its always a threat that you can be taken out quickly, but that is why you run multiples. Besides, to use a Meltagun they have to get up close which is where a SoulGrinder gets very nasty with its super Bolter/super Heavy Flamer and assaulting.

I think a Daemon list can use either DPs or Soulgrinders but its my opinion that they work best in 3's, not mixed.

Mortified Penguin wrote:I dunno, I have reservations about taking vehicles in an army that can get 3 maximum. Given the mech-heavy metagame, you're just giving the opponent's AT weapons easy targets.

Yeah, but if Their anti-tank weaponry isn't firing at your soul grinders then they will be firing into your GD's, princes and bloodcrushers and remember, it's still pretty unlikely

I've had good luck with Prince spam and GD spam. I cap out both HQ and HEAVY with flying MC's at 2k. It's really tough to spread your fire around that much, especially when other stuff is bearing down on you too.

I'm a tau player and as stated before I can solidify the "One=none" You need at least 2 soulgrinders coming down in the same turn. Otherwise you have presented a very juicy target to all your opponents AT guns that aren't as effective against say a DP.
I play daemons regularly (3 of my friends play them) and 2 use soul grinders. If 2 come down same turn you can bet one dies but 3/4 the time the second one will survive for another turn. But if one comes down, It then goes down, hard.