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I'm quite aware that a lot of people can't stand Blood Ravens (some people get as cheesed of by them as others do about Ultramarines), as they are a chapter from a computer game, but I still play them and I think it would be cool if they had their own chapter tactics which, as with most chapters, could be exchanged with combat tactics. This rule could possibly be gained from a model for Gabriel Angelos, Librarian Isador, Davian Thule etc (the first of whom was in a thread somewhere around here).

Having the chapter tactics rules allows you to replace any tactical squad sergeant with a lexicanium (minor librarian).
The lexicanium's characteristics are;
WS BS S T W I A Ld Sv
4 4 4 4 1 4 2 9 3+

His rules: And They Shall Know No Fear, Psyker.
His wargear; Power armour, force weapon, bolt pistol, frag and krak grenades, psychic hood

The cost for the exchange could be perhaps 20pts. He should be able to purchase up to two powers from those accessible to a regular librarian. The costs could be: smite for 10pts, avenger for 10pts, vortex for 20pts, machine curse for 5pts, quickening for 15pts, gate for 20pts, might of the ancients for 15pts, force dome for 10pts.

He has access to similar wargear options as a sergeant, but may never exchange his force weapon. He may only cast one power per turn.

Any criticism or comments, keeping in mind that these are simply house rules?
Sorry I can't get the characteristics to line up.

Well, I like the idea to exchange the Sergeant by a Psyker.
However, the point increase (20 pts) seems a bit less.
Remember that TS troops must take a psyker for a much larger pt increase.

How about 50pts? going all the way up to something around 100pts seems ridiculous, as he isn't as good as a propper librarian and has to stay with his squad.

I'd say 50 points with a single free power. Gotta remember that a power weapon is already 15 points.

I think he should only get 1 power and as MasterSlowPoke said for free and 50 points is a good amount.

Hmm, okay, 50pts with a force weapon and one free power. Brilliant

IMO, seems overpowered. A force weapon that cannont be picked out.

A way to balance it out is you get 1 free power out of codex marines, OR force weapon.

OR

Make Librarians an elites choice similar to how BA get Chaplains as elites. You could even give a small discount on points to libby's to represent the above average amount of psykers that the Blood Ravens have.

But the potential for every unit to have a psyker is a bit overpowered and kind of unfluffy. Blood Ravens have more psykers than other chapters but not so many that all units could have one.

I agree with pdawg's post. Most Blood Ravens squads have a regular sergeant.

As for pdawg517 and Melissa's suggestion this would be as easy to fix as assigning a 0-'X' limit to this unit. I'm thinking 0-3? As most games only allow a max of six troop choices or you could just say "Half the sgts in your army can take this upgrade" or something to that effect.

The whole problem with one free Psy power OR a force weapon is that I would say "Ok, I'll take the psy power and upgrade him with a power weapon". But I do like the idea of getting Libby's as Elites.

ComputerGeek,

I'm not worried about a power weapon. The big thing is getting force weaponed. The thing would be he would have to choose between a power or force weapon (which can cause ID given that someone fails an invuln save regardless of toughness).

As awesome as an idea of playing a Psyker Marine army sounds (would provide a TOTALLY new play style) I think Melissia's idea to make them 0-3 in Elites, and still capable as an HQ is a better choice. You can still spam the board with them, but fluffwise they're not at the same level as sergeants, showing that they're still somewhat unique in the force.

Just for your information, Thousand Sons squads MUST upgrade a Marine to a Sorceror for 60 points and then MUST take a Psychic power for 10-30 points (almost always 30).

As awesome as an idea of playing a Psyker Marine army sounds (would provide a TOTALLY new play style)

I play a Psyker Marine army already, it's not new

A thought,

Elite libbies could be 90 pts to represent the above avg amount of psykers Blood Ravens have. Make the HQ libby have a similar stat line of the BA Rechlusiarch and cost about the same.

pdawg517 wrote:IMO, seems overpowered. A force weapon that cannont be picked out.

A way to balance it out is you get 1 free power out of codex marines, OR force weapon.

OR

Make Librarians an elites choice similar to how BA get Chaplains as elites. You could even give a small discount on points to libby's to represent the above average amount of psykers that the Blood Ravens have.

But the potential for every unit to have a psyker is a bit overpowered and kind of unfluffy. Blood Ravens have more psykers than other chapters but not so many that all units could have one.

This makes me laugh. Thousand Sons squads all have a Force weapon that cannot be picked out. They have a Psyker in every single unit. Yet Thousand Sons suck and aren't remotely overpowered.

Regardless, I think a better option would be that the following may upgrade their sergeant to librarian:

Sternguard
Vanguard veterans
Terminators

The Librarian would be kitted out in the standard wargear of hte squad, IE terminator armor in a terminator squad, and jump packs if they're purchased for the vanguard veteran squad.



Either that, or allow 1-3 librarians to be taken per elites choice, as independent characters, but elites choice Librarians only have one power.

I just say that they go as an elite choice. They will be IC's.

That's what I meant. 1-3 Librarians as ICs taken per elites choice.

I can't really decide a point cost but here is my 2 cents.

Chapter Tactics: "Finders Keepers" You can buy 1 additional wargear or weapon option on any non vehicle unit. This upgrade can exceed wargear and weapon limits but must otherwise be legal to the unit. For example your tactical squad can wield one more plasma gun than normally allowed.

Blood Ravens are the thief chapter after all.

So 1 libby is an elites choice or how the BA Sanguinary Priests are (1-3) is one choice?

If 1-3 is a single choice that will be OP'd! That is a possibility to field 10 Psykers.

Yes, but that's at least 1000 points for 10 models that can all be instant killed rather easily by heavy weapons fire.

And quite a few of those choices would only have one power. I would also assume only hte HQ choics could become epistolaries.

Still 10 psychic powers a turn is over the top. I think do a similar thing like BA chappies. Have an HQ version who is a better fighter (Rechlusiarch) and the regulars follow the same stat line as in Codex Space Marines.

pdawg517 wrote:Still 10 psychic powers a turn is over the top. I think do a similar thing like BA chappies. Have an HQ version who is a better fighter (Rechlusiarch) and the regulars follow the same stat line as in Codex Space Marines.

See 10 Psychic Powers sounds great and all (Units with the Mark of Tzeentch can use two per turn!) but once you actually play and realize half the game can negate 50% of them or happen to be Tyranids... and then realize Perils of the Warp is a very common thing...

Basically I think you're really overvaluing psychic powers, having played with an army with five Psykers consistently.

Still, from a fluff point of view, 10 psykers on the battlefield for 1 detachment of Blood Ravens is over the top.

From a fluff point of view, Librarians rarely take the field in the first place...

True, but Blood Ravens do have more librarians take the field, but not 10 at once.

Melissia wrote:From a fluff point of view, Librarians rarely take the field in the first place...

You got a source for that?

Librarians are fielded AFAIK whenevr they are needed.
They have led forces and been integral parts of forces deployed.

Its not like they get kept locked up for 'special occasions'.

No, I just have a vague recollection of their duties, which aren't primarily battle-related.

Libbies main duties are not battle related, but they are used when needed. IIRC Libbies main duties have to do with maintaining chapter records and history.

Along with communication and navigation, IIRC. Basically they're a bit of a jack of all trades... a true battle psyker is a frightening offensive powerhouse, while an astropath is much better at communication, and a navigator is much better at warp navigation . Which is why Marines tend to use serf astropaths and allied navigators as well.

Melissia wrote:Along with communication and navigation, IIRC. Basically they're a bit of a jack of all trades... a true battle psyker is a frightening offensive powerhouse, while an astropath is much better at communication, and a navigator is much better at warp navigation . Which is why Marines tend to use serf astropaths and allied navigators as well.

I know this slips in the fluff category but Libbys and Primaris Psykers and other battlefield dudes have nothing to do with astropaths and navigators. Navigator isn't even psyker really, they are abhumans with ability to see into warp with their mutant 3rd eye. Astropaths are weak psykers that are attuned to receive and transmit messages. Astropath slowly loses his ability to feel the real world, they can't take part into actual combat they are just radios made of meat. Navigator can kill anyone instantly by looking the target with his 3rd eye but they are no navigators in tabletop afaik.