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I am running black templar. How do I kill the eldar? They lance through my vehicles, their monstrous sword wielding creatures carve through my landraiders, their insane high WS and toughness denies my crusaders the easy kills I expected to make of them. I do NOT have terminators yet. any tactical suggestions? I have never been shut down so hard by any army ever, not even with my orks. We played a 1500 point game, first round I killed 2 walkers in a 3 walker squadron and did 1 wound to a wraithlord? monstrous creature, thats it, he wiped me out. Second game was better, but not much, I managed to punch a small hole through, killing one of his skimmers and annihilating his banshee squad, losing 5 assault troops in the process. I managed two wounds to two out of his three monstrous creatures, dropped the same two walkers, and killed two little guys with guns and thats it, a much better show then the first game, but still pathetic. HELP!

Stop playing to his strengths and play to yours. Drop the Land Raiders, maybe take predators (lascannon) and dreads Lascannon/missile launcher) instead. Squads with missile launchers/lascannons. Keep your distance, make him come to you. Don't assult unless you absolutely must and when you do, make sure you have powerfists in the squad(s). Drop the banshee transport first and then pick off the Wraithlords, should be able to kill one a turn fairly easily.

Don Mondo is right.

For one thing, no Eldar monstrous creature can hurt a land raider in assault unless you let it. They move 6", you move 12". Just stay more than 12" away from them, and they can't assault you.

You haven't posted a list, but it sounds like maybe your BT list depends really heavily on assault. So it will always be weak against Eldar, where you really need some Str 8+ shooting to knock down his transports and wound his monstrous creatures. Terminators aren't really going to help as much as melta and missile launchers would.

Well, as a long-time Eldar player I'd recommend a foot-slogging horde army, i.e., a horde of Black Templars.
Eldar can hardly deal with a horde of Marines.

I thought eldar were a shooty style army, wouldn't making them come to me not work? Black templars are supposed to be melee marines, or so i thought, my codex explains them as such. I did just recently grab 2 preds though, so will prolly use them, but all it takes is a lance shot or two and my pred is gone :/

now, I may be mistaken, but don't black templar have an upgrade for their land raiders, for like 25 pts, that makes lances ignore the "lance" special rule, and make them roll against armor 14? thus rendering you damn near immune to them?

Yes for the landraider, but now you are talking a 300 pt vehicle. Which he just sent his monstrous after, so i can either run from it, and not shoot, or try and kill them, and die :(

Out of curiosity, why did you jump to Black Templar?

And seeing your signature, you should get Vassal if you don't have it yet so that I can test myself against you.

I wanted a new Army no one at my shop uses, and was of a different style then my orks. I still do play my orks, I love em, but want to be able to fit on either side of the big battles we have sometime

Whats vassal?

Warlordron'swaagh wrote:Yes for the landraider, but now you are talking a 300 pt vehicle. Which he just sent his monstrous after, so i can either run from it, and not shoot, or try and kill them, and die :(

Well, Fire Dragons take on a LR with ease, even with AV 14.

Wait, can't you take the "Blessed Hull" upgrade to make your Land Raiders immune to lance weaponry? Now if he has Fire Dragons in a Wave Serpent, your Raider is as good as dead.

As for the Wraithlord, you should be able to just move your Land Raider 12", making it hit on a 6!

@Gavo

Which would be useless if they had wraithswords, since it is almost an auto-penetrate.

If it moves 12" tho it can't shoot, right? so i am ewasting all of its fire power to....run?

The problem is that you're basing your tactics on mistaken archetypes of the army. See if you can borrow an Eldar codex and read it a few times to get a better grasp on what his units are capable of.

You're getting outplayed because of your lack of knowledge.

Warlordron'swaagh wrote:If it moves 12" tho it can't shoot, right? so i am ewasting all of its fire power to....run?

No, the Land Raider has POTMS, which allows you to fire 1 more weapon than normal. Unless the Black Templar one doesn't have it.

Inquisitor_Syphonious wrote:@Gavo

Which would be useless if they had wraithswords, since it is almost an auto-penetrate.

And if you read my post, you'd see that I was referring to the lance weaponry issue, I covered wraithlords later on inthe post (move cruising speed to make the lord hit on a 6).

Wraithlords are lascannon fodder. A Predator Annhilator will make absolutely short work of one, (3+ to hit, 2+ to wound, 3 shots, no armor save, np.)

Eldar are -great- against MEQ armies because they have so many weapons to combat the strengths of marines, (lots of ap "low enough to not allow armor saves" weapons, 183248324309 -different- ways to blowing up tanks, lots of reroll to save/hit psychic powers and the bane of my existance, conceal.)

My biggest piece of advice is to simply try and catch a psychological advantage by maneuvering your vehicles in such a manner that he can't immediately determine the optimum threat and take each turn, (slowly at first,) to outthink him so he'll think twice about flatting out his wave serpents two turns in a row just to unleash hell on your vehicles and most importantly, don't forget to pop smoke, (not too hastily, of course.)

What kind of list do you run with now, anyway?

Yeah, it would be interesting to see a list.

I think I'll be playing him again this sunday, I'll post how i did, and try to get a comprehensive army list for the both of us if i get my tookus kicked again.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I should be playing hi magain this weekend, I dont remember my exact list from the last ga,e, but if he crushes me again, and you guys have been very helpful, so hopefully he wont, I'll post our lists here.

Post lists - what do you use, what do they use.

Seems like a hybrid army with walkers, lords and serpent banshees. Take footsloggers with melta guns - as an eldar player, my styrength is shooting, but when I shoot you, you zeal towards me - thats the most annoying thing about BT.

Take AC/LC preds to take down transports and the lords. Get rid of the lords first, as they will mess youre troops - unless doomed, a large crusader squad should be able to take a banshee charge.