Wehrkind wrote:
The advantages of the big PF is really that it is so flexible. It kills more MEQs than it's points in marines.
A veteran sergeant with a Power Fist costs 45 points, so assuming his squad charged, that veteran sergeant would need to survive 3 (!) full rounds of combat (because of the I1) to reliably make his points back against very many units.
For almost all of the units you actually WANT to get Space Marines into close combat with, you'd actually be better off with the 3 bolter (or even
BP/
CCW) Marines. I think the only exception is
MEQ's. Since just about every
CSM 3+ save squad will beat a Tactical Squad or non furious-charging Assault Squad in close combat, this leaves basically a shooty squad of another
SM army among very few other units as a unit you want to get into close combat with and would rather have a Power Fist Veteran than 3 more Marines.
A little math:
3 Bolters within 12" shooting at a squad with WS4 T3 Sv5+:
6 shots = 4 hits = 2.67 wounds
Those 3 Bolter marines attacking in close combat have 3 attacks (they receive the charge, opting for the significantly more effective 2x bolter shots)
3 attacks = 1.5 hits = 1 wound = .67 unsaved wounds
So those 3 marines cause a total of ~3.34 casualties in a turn.
Obviously, start adding in special weapons (instead of 3 marines, take 2 Marines and a plasma gun for 5 fewer points than the veteran with power fist) and the Veteran becomes even worse, comparatively.
Here's the Veteran Sergeant, replacing those 3 marines, in an identical scenario:
1 Bolt Pistol shot = .67 hits = .447 wounds
3 Attacks (S8) = 1.5 hits = 1.25 wounds (no saves allowed)
The Veteran with Power Fist causes a total of ~1.697 casualties in a turn, about half as many as the 3 bolter marines.
But against another marine squad, the results are very different:
6 Bolter Shots (again, the additional bolter shot is more effective than the additional attack gained from charging- about 11% compared to 8% chance of inflicting an unsaved wound)
6 Bolter Shots = 4 hits = 2 wounds = .67 unsaved wounds
3 Attacks = 1.5 hits = .75 wounds = .25 unsaved wounds- .92 wounds total, compared to
1 Bolt Pistol shot= .67 hits = .33 wounds = .11 unsaved wounds
3 Power Fist Attacks = 1.5 hits = 1.25 wounds (no saves), for 1.36 wounds total
And that's about as effective as the Veteran Sergeant gets compared to an equivalent number of points spent on other Marines.
Unfortunately, not everyone plays static Marine gunline armies, and unfortunately, not everyone who does lets them sit there while your
Tac Squad with a hidden 'Fist advances up the board at them.
The reasons I continue to field them, however, are:
1. Although there isn't any unit I want to be in close combat with that I really need the Power Fist against, it's going to happen from time to time, and without the 'Fist present many units will tear through an entire Marine Squad.
2. Many units either:
a) will get wrecked by my Marine squad in
CC anyway, or
b) have Initiative > 4 anyway, or
c) are
MEQ's, so Power Fists will be *slightly* more effective, or
d) a lot of players don't really understand/ haven't worked out the numbers, and the presence of a Power Fist will affect their strategy, to my advantage
or some combination of the above.
Really, the ideal situation I can think of for Power Fists is that I'm playing against an army with relatively high toughness, and a low model count as far as the shooty squads go(I know that exists, and that it's called Nidzilla). Then I think about how awesome it wound be to have a 6-man infiltrating Veteran Squad, with 2 power fists- for only 163 points! Then I remember how much better in that same situation, not to mention almost any other one a 6-man Infiltrating Tactical squad with 2 Plasma guns is. And for 30 points less.
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