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I'm still scratching my head...reading the BI Forums, Forums here, and elsewhere as to the bewilderment of all customers.

One thing for certain, at least the game came out, we will get the initial support. I'm sad we won't see Rogue Trader (at least that we know of, here's to hoping someone picks up the license and continues the game). I really don't care about the Space Marine expansion.

The book is great, and I don't regret buying it.

As to the statement the decision was made today, that is crap. Corporations don't make decisions like this and announce same day. You know full well someone up the food chain knew this was happening. Kind of plays into the sudden early release of Dark Heresy, whereas we were only used to delays :S

Anyway, I hope the people (if any) that are losing their jobs today are able to find work elsewhere. I look forward to this product and using it in a new RPG group. I also look forward to a lot of fan based web content.

GW...you guys are really scary sometimes...

That's what I needed to hear.

Buy? Don't buy?

If the book is good, I won't have any problems with owning
it and reading it. But if it's some awful RPG port, then I
don't want it at all.

Thanks, andozane.

Hey malfred,

It's a great book and pretty complete on its own. I'd recommend it if you can find a copy.

Damn, started this same board without noticing this one!

No worries.

One speculation is that GW is trimming to sell the company.

Dark Heresy sold out twice within hours of release. That's pretty hard performance to argue with.

I wonder if Specialist Games, Forge World and Sabertooth are far behind.

Games Workshop have a long history of "on again, off again" publishing.

Forge World looks like a successful prototyping house for models like Piranha and Baneblade. If it has a small staff they can be profitable designing and modest numbers of high cost resin kits. The best designs can be done in styrene for a mass market kit. I would certainly buy the Tau Tetra if it can out as a styrene model. I bet they could sell a load of adapter sprues for the Tau suits as well.

How else are they going to roll out second edition?

Asmodai wrote:No worries.

One speculation is that GW is trimming to sell the company.

Dark Heresy sold out twice within hours of release. That's pretty hard performance to argue with.

I wonder if Specialist Games, Forge World and Sabertooth are far behind.

Well, no one talks of Marauder miniatures anymore. And Specialist games has been pretty much gutted down to being a web presence and that's about it.

Yep, it's an awesome book just for the background read. It looks to be a lot like WHFRP in space, which is cool. Definitely worth the buy. If it's anything like WHFRP has been, it has a lot of fan support. Though you know the first conversions are going to be.... "This is my Space Marine".

Sigh.

From what little I've been able to read in shop (Still waiting for my preordered copy from Amazon.co.uk, which incidently still has copies available)
it worth the money. System seems quite workable, and setting is... well you know what it is

al-Majid Agandhjin bin Ahfal al-Rashid

Asmodai wrote:Hey malfred,

I'd recommend it if you can find a copy.

Ack. Okay, guess I'm heading out to the shops.

Do regular GW storefronts sell the RPG stuff, or is this
something they give to the independent retailers?

Toreador wrote:Yep, it's an awesome book just for the background read. It looks to be a lot like WHFRP in space, which is cool. Definitely worth the buy. If it's anything like WHFRP has been, it has a lot of fan support. Though you know the first conversions are going to be.... "This is my Space Marine".

Sigh.

My To-Do list (I'll post these online in a couple months once they're written and playtested):

Rules and Career Paths for Space Marines (Basic Path, splitting into Apothecary, Tech-Marine, Librarian, Chaplain, and Commander at higher levels)

Eldar race modifiers and Career Paths for Warlocks and Rangers/Outcasts.

Small-scale space combat and fighter rules (BFG scale won't come up, but it would be fun to do a Phantine game) (I'll be waiting to see the promised vehicle rules first).

NPC stats for Ork adversaries.

malfred wrote:

Asmodai wrote:Hey malfred,

I'd recommend it if you can find a copy.

Ack. Okay, guess I'm heading out to the shops.

Do regular GW storefronts sell the RPG stuff, or is this
something they give to the independent retailers?

Only independent retailers. Don't ask me to explain GW's logic there.

Asmodai wrote:

malfred wrote:

Asmodai wrote:Hey malfred,

I'd recommend it if you can find a copy.

Ack. Okay, guess I'm heading out to the shops.

Do regular GW storefronts sell the RPG stuff, or is this
something they give to the independent retailers?

Only independent retailers. Don't ask me to explain GW's logic there.

Oh but you must! To me this question would harder than "What's the freakin meaning of life?"

Here's a quick and dirty, read-in-progress review of Dark Heresy for anyone on the fence:

The corebook is gorgeous and very complete for the sort of campaign it supports. (That caveat is to indicate that no, it doesn't contain every option for 40K. No Space Marines or Ork Freebootas. It does however contain strong character options for independant teams of Inquisitorial Agents.) The character careers are handled very well to provide characterful playability while remaining true to the source material. (The way tech-priests are handled is pure genius.) It also contains a wealth of useful antagonists and NPCs right in the corebook, and the default setting is lavish in its detail. I could probably run campaigns forever just based off the basic rulebook. The suppliments that are planned sound incredibly useful, and should only support the viability of the game even in the face of publisher support being cut off. (Keep in mind that WFRP 1e survived for what, 20 years without being supported?)

I'd roughly describe starting characters at the default level as being roughly as powerful (in feel) as Necromunda gangers with one or two advances. The power then scales rapidly, with a higher rate of xp gain than WFRP. This is a good thing, as there's a ton of character customization options in the plethora of skills and talents available at each career rank. The tone of the game, from my eyeballing it, appears to be along the lines of if John Woo directed a horror movie set in the Imperium. I've heard the description 'Call of Cthulhu in space' and there are large similarities...but in Dark Heresy, shooting the gribbly in the face with a drum-fed combat shotgun is a viable option. This is not to say that an unbound daemonhost won't ruin your day, but characters are not as powerless as some have lamented. You're not going to start (at the default) as powerful as the four or five people Eisenhorn kept in his pocket as he ran around facing down rogue titans, but you're no pushover, either.

It's a good game. I've already gotten four or five adventure ideas, and I'm not even done with the book yet. That's always a auspicious sign.

I'll fifth or sixth the love for the book, t'is ace.

Vehicle rules are coming FREE on the BI site "soon", and I do take that to mean sooner rather than later.

Forgeworld should be safe, it's not much of a sign but they're recruiting staff, so I'd assume they are safe.

The "proven ability to work to deadlines" amuses me no end and I can only assume the "good eye for detail" is to exclude the person from proofreading duties.

reds8n wrote:The "proven ability to work to deadlines" amuses me no end and I can only assume the "good eye for detail" is to exclude the person from proofreading duties.

Dear Lord! That IS funny!

So... can you still buy it?

Amazon seems to have a lot of products for it, some on pre-order. Are they ever coming out?

BYE

reds8n wrote:
The "proven ability to work to deadlines" amuses me no end and I can only assume the "good eye for detail" is to exclude the person from proofreading duties.

*Snort*

They could have made the page quite shorter by simply stating "We need someone to run this business like it's a farking business".

It's office admin, not business admin. Take a look at what the role is.

BYE

Psychopomp wrote:
I'd roughly describe starting characters at the default level as being roughly as powerful (in feel) as Necromunda gangers with one or two advances. The power then scales rapidly, with a higher rate of xp gain than WFRP. This is a good thing, as there's a ton of character customization options in the plethora of skills and talents available at each career rank. The tone of the game, from my eyeballing it, appears to be along the lines of if John Woo directed a horror movie set in the Imperium. I've heard the description 'Call of Cthulhu in space' and there are large similarities...but in Dark Heresy, shooting the gribbly in the face with a drum-fed combat shotgun is a viable option. This is not to say that an unbound daemonhost won't ruin your day, but characters are not as powerless as some have lamented. You're not going to start (at the default) as powerful as the four or five people Eisenhorn kept in his pocket as he ran around facing down rogue titans, but you're no pushover, either.

It's a good game. I've already gotten four or five adventure ideas, and I'm not even done with the book yet. That's always a auspicious sign.

That's promising. What kept us for buying into it was the lack of depth we expected. Only so many times can you go lurking after a demon host before it grows stale...

Crap! Does this mean I blew my chance to get a copy of Talisman???

Pariah Press wrote: Crap! Does this mean I blew my chance to get a copy of Talisman???

Seemingly, BI themselves have no more copies in stock, presumably though there must be copies out there...... somewhere..

@ Mr. H.B.M.C. They've stated, repeatedly, that the forthcoming Purge the Unclean, Inquisitors Handbook and Disciples of the Dark Gods will all be released. the GM screen ( which is pretty funky as these things go and comes with a nice mini adventure that introduces a ) is already out and available.

Apparently vehicle rules will be on the site "soon" and they say they want to add a few other bits as well.

Of course as staff leave and/or are moved this may well have an affect on what happens.

Incidentally we wait 20 years or so for this game it comes out and we love, so GW cancel it. The name of the free downloadable adventure ? " Shattered Hopes".


There's always Ebay for the collectors edition otherwise !!!

I just ordered it and the supporting material from Amazon.

This is really stupid. I think people out there were really excited about a 40k RPG (I was and I don't even play RPG's) and for them to pull this s#@$ is beyond belief. I don't quite understand it, is BI going away completely or being rolled into BL or what?

I wonder if another company will pick up the licenses.

Ozymandias, King of Kings

I don't think GeeWee will let that happen.

I'm really trying to be not cynical with the following, but....

that would make sense, why would GW do that?

it's hard to be a fanboy

Hogshead picked up the license for WHFRPG for awhile and re-released the game. No reason that can't be done again with another company.

And btw, being generally optimistic =/= fanboy
Also, not instantly hating GW =/= fanboy.

Ozymandias, King of Kings

well, I think I hate GW but I wanna keep playing their games....

What I struggle to understand is that GW never ignores a chance to make more money, so clearly these games were somehow not making them the money they hoped for, but I can't figure out exactly how.

What resources were being diverted into making these games that somehow reduces their ability to produce novels?

I just don't get it and it really is frustrating not to have more information as to exactly why this happened.

It's very corporate Yak. Our company is doing a lot of that at the moment.

It's not exactly how profitable it is. Even if something is profitable, it can be cut, and on the books it makes things look a lot better by moving resources to other areas (or laying them off). A lot of times they do this and call it "focusing on the core business". Doesn't make sense to anyone but the people running the books.

Bleh all the same.

Toreador is exactly right.

It can be surprisingly hard for a company to know exactly what it costs to do a product and how much they are making off it. It comes down to accountancy, which is not as exact a science as it may seem.

In addition, public companies will can workers, products or divisions to demonstrate to the shareholders that they are serious about addressing problems, even if the layoffs actually cost more than they save.