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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2008/07/31 20:03:40
Subject: Quick Thoughts on "The Flight of the Eisenstein"
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Ultramarine Land Raider Pilot on Cruise Control
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When 40k radio interviewed McNeil he said he'd like to team up with Abnett and write the Thousand Sons vs Space Wolves. He said it would be cool if one wrote the Thousand Sons point of view and the other wrote Space wolves point of view.
Sounded like a sweet idea to me.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2008/08/01 15:29:12
Subject: Quick Thoughts on "The Flight of the Eisenstein"
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Dakka Veteran
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Interesting idea they have, but really would people want to buy both books that really tell the exact same story? Unless they had large differences or revealed some secrets unknown to the other legion I don't know if it would be worth the buy
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"To be truely evil you must acknowledge the right thing to do in a situation, and then do completely the oposite" |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2008/08/01 16:20:44
Subject: Re:Quick Thoughts on "The Flight of the Eisenstein"
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Wrathful Warlord Titan Commander
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Would be more like two stories in one book I think.
Changing actors and locations maybe every 20 pages to get both stories told in a conferring timeline.
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Target locked,ready to fire
In dedicatio imperatum ultra articulo mortis.
H.B.M.C :
We were wrong. It's not the 40k End Times. It's the Trademarkening.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2008/08/01 17:40:43
Subject: Quick Thoughts on "The Flight of the Eisenstein"
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Dispassionate Imperial Judge
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I think the Descent of Angels really is crying out for a follow up - i found to be quite a good story, but it ended a bit too abruptly..
And I doubt there'll be a book concerning the formation of the Ecclesiarcy - I think think happened a few thousand years after the reorganisation...
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2008/08/02 13:13:45
Subject: Quick Thoughts on "The Flight of the Eisenstein"
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Dakka Veteran
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Really anything that happens after the Horus Heresy can't go under the same series title as the current books. It'd be like putting the Tyranid wars into the war of the heaven storyline, saying "oh, well the Eldar were involved with both so its ok." Whilst I grant Horus caused all the follow up problems for the Imperium, at some point the line has to be drawn so the Series doesn't lose pace and become a drawn out affair
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"To be truely evil you must acknowledge the right thing to do in a situation, and then do completely the oposite" |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2008/08/02 19:16:47
Subject: Quick Thoughts on "The Flight of the Eisenstein"
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Wrathful Warlord Titan Commander
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Storm Lord wrote:.....at some point the line has to be drawn so the Series doesn't lose pace and become a drawn out affair
Has it not already lost pace? I believe the beginning was a good read,but some of the newer instalments of the HH series just
don't come to a point.
To me "flight of the eisenstein" wasn't bad,but i've known the story before from the "Horus Heresy: Visions of..." books.
With two open end books ("descent of angels","legion") I hoped "Battle for the abyss" would do better.Heard not much
positive of it until now,have to read it myself
 What do you expect to come from the next novels? Regain their pace ?
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Target locked,ready to fire
In dedicatio imperatum ultra articulo mortis.
H.B.M.C :
We were wrong. It's not the 40k End Times. It's the Trademarkening.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2008/08/02 22:15:35
Subject: Quick Thoughts on "The Flight of the Eisenstein"
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[DCM]
.. .-.. .-.. ..- -- .. -. .- - ..
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I'm about 20 pages into Battle For The Abyss and its a slow start.
Only real exciting thing so far is that it describes mors about the mecanicus and their perception of the turning of Horus.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2008/08/03 12:55:59
Subject: Re:Quick Thoughts on "The Flight of the Eisenstein"
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[DCM]
Et In Arcadia Ego
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I think you might be a bit disappointed with BFTA. Nice enough story but doesn't really do anything as such towards the overal series as far as I can tell.
Did people see what Graham McNeill wrote t'other day ?
Afternoon all…it’s a glorious day and the first draft of Mechanicum has been handed to the grasping claws of the BL’s editor servitors. It’s been a long road, but I finally got it done. I won’t bore you with the how and why of it took so long, but it’s done now and I’m very happy with it. It’s not quite the book I intended to write when I started out, but I think it’s all the better for that, as it took quite different directions along the way, none of which I expected. Which brings me neatly to one of the first things I want to talk about. Expectation.
Expectation can be a blessing and a curse for those of a creative bent. On the one hand, it generates excitement and interest in what you’re writing/recording/filming so that people rush out and buy it and (hopefully) enjoy it. It becomes a curse when the person who’s read your book, listened to your album or watched your film feels that it wasn’t what they expected. Now, does that mean your endeavour was wasted? Certainly not, just because something isn’t what a person expected doesn’t make it bad, it just makes it…unexpected. Remember the vast expectation every Star Wars fan had going into their first viewing of The Phantom Menace and how, two hours later, they all marched from the cinema ready to burn George Lucas? Well, frankly, there was no way any film was going to live up to our expectation after so long, but watch it again in the cold light of hindsight and you find lots to like about it. It’s still not a particularly good film by any stretch of the imagination, but, having seen all three prequels now, it kinda works in the context it was meant to.
To look at how expectation can be manipulated, just look at the poster and trailer for the movie ‘Reign of Fire’. I remember a crowd of us GW types frothing with excitement at the prospect of this film. Dragons! Attack Helicopters! Tank! Dragons battling Attack Helicopters above the skies of London as Mankind fights for survival against a malevolent Draconic foe! Now, if you’ve seen the movie, you’ll know that’s not what it’s about at all… The war of the Dragons versus the Humans happens via newspaper headlines and a voiceover and the bulk of the movie is set in the aftermath of that war. Which, when you consider what we were expecting, is a hell of a letdown. We all left the cinema feeling slightly hoodwinked and thinking the film was terrible. Having seen it recently on the telly, I actually really enjoyed it. Again, not a film that was ever going to trouble the Oscars, but a pretty decent action movie. With Dragons.
In terms that mean anything to us BL fans, I think the same happened with the Horus Heresy novel, Descent of Angels. People bought and read that book with the expectation of it advancing the storyline and telling of the Dark Angels in the time of Horus’s betrayal. That wasn’t what they got and I remember reading posts deriding the book, which I thought a tad unfair to say the least, since most people’s criticism of the book was that it didn’t match a their expectations of what they thought it should have done. So, their expectations weren’t met, but does that mean that Descent of Angels is a bad book? Of course not. As the dust settles and those with the loudest voices go away, most people pick up the book and enjoy it, realising that it tells a piece of the Dark Angels history that needs to be told before the main event after the Heresy occurs. They also saw that the Horus Heresy isn’t just about always moving forward (though it needs to do that too), it’s about exploring the setting and telling tales of the people caught up in those momentous times.
On a personal level, I’m about to embark on a Heresy-era short story called The Last Church, which will see the light of day in the Tales of Heresy anthology. It certainly doesn’t advance the storyline and is takes place before the Great Crusade sets out from Terra. Having seen two-line précis for the other stories in the book, I wanted to do something different and unexpected so that when people read it they’d be surprised and have to perhaps shift a mental gear or two. I think it’s a good thing for readers and writers alike to challenge themselves by reading and writing things that are different from their usual fare. I’ve said before that it’s easy to mistake a rut for a groove, so every now and then we ought to break out of our comfort zone and do something that challenges us or takes us to places we weren’t expecting.
I think this applies to most things, be they books, movies, films, records…whatever. Too often we’re quick to criticise things when we haven’t heard, read or seen anything of them. It never ceases to amaze me how quick and eager some people are to assume that something’s going to be gak before it’s even been released (or in some cases, even made…). In the case of movies, Hollywood had previous when it comes to stuffing up what look like great ideas on paper (I’m looking at you Pathfinder! How hard could it be…? Indians versus Vikings, it should have been a slam-dunk, but oh how it disappointed…) but let’s not be so keen to deride things or to jump on the bandwagon of sneering.
I think a lot of it comes from the internet breeding a sense of inferiority in people, making them afraid to say they like something for fear of reprisals from the more frequent posters who look down on them and argue in largely pointless ways. It’s often seen as the done thing to criticise creative endeavours, because if someone hates Thing X, but you quite liked Thing X, you often find yourself thinking that maybe this person is cleverer than I am and knows more than I do, I’d better agree with him… Stop! Stop, I say! Stick to your guns, defend your point of view and don’t be too quick to abandon it, just because the person saying you’re wrong has a high post count. Just because some people post a lot on the net, this – contrary to their own deluded belief – does not give them some enlightened, god-like status, where everything they say comes loaded with gravitas and wisdom. One person’s post is just as valid as another’s and this assumption of status based on their post count is nonsense. Of course, none of this is meant to stop reasoned debate and constructive criticism, far from it, such things are the lifeblood of any creative type, but the keywords here are ‘reasoned’ and ‘constructive’. If a thing is bad, there’s nothing wrong with saying so, as long as you say why.
Anyway, enough of my rants on the net. I like the net and if everyone behaved with common decency and played nice then it would be a wonderful place, where ideas and constructive discussions were held, but we all know that’s not the case. I live in hope that one day folk will realise that there’s really no need to be unpleasant just because you can’t see the person you’re insulting. I’m an optimist, I know
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The poor man really has a stake in the country. The rich man hasn't; he can go away to New Guinea in a yacht. The poor have sometimes objected to being governed badly; the rich have always objected to being governed at all
We love our superheroes because they refuse to give up on us. We can analyze them out of existence, kill them, ban them, mock them, and still they return, patiently reminding us of who we are and what we wish we could be.
"the play's the thing wherein I'll catch the conscience of the king, |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2008/08/03 18:51:55
Subject: Quick Thoughts on "The Flight of the Eisenstein"
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Dakka Veteran
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I don't disagree with what Graham says their, especially about Decent of Angels-in it's self its not a bad read. I just don't see that it fitted intot he Horus Heresy in many ways. More it fitted into a 'what the Primarchs did before thier dad came along' series of books. Which in itself might be a good series.
But surely the Horus Heresy should do what it says on the tin: actually be about Horus's heresy, not the lead up to Luthers rebellion?
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"To be truely evil you must acknowledge the right thing to do in a situation, and then do completely the oposite" |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2008/08/03 19:57:11
Subject: Re:Quick Thoughts on "The Flight of the Eisenstein"
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Wrathful Warlord Titan Commander
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I also agree that mr mcneill had a point,a artistic point.No point at expectation.
The title suggests a "descent of angels",but was not true to his name. :(
Other books in the series had a connection to their title,this one had not.
I've waited until the last page,hoped to get something about DA and their first steps as
space marines,but in reality it was a pre-space marine story.The end came to me as if
this book lacked 10 pages. :S
It will be what many wanted to read if black library makes a second part to show the lion
and his comrades at the emperors service.
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Target locked,ready to fire
In dedicatio imperatum ultra articulo mortis.
H.B.M.C :
We were wrong. It's not the 40k End Times. It's the Trademarkening.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2008/08/04 19:34:45
Subject: Quick Thoughts on "The Flight of the Eisenstein"
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Dakka Veteran
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The problem was it was trying to hard to explain 'why' Luther became corrupt-mainly to tie in with the release of Codex: Dark Angels (correct me if my grasp of time is way out) What little was actually of Space marines, or at least half marines in some cases felt like it could have been nearly any other legion in the theatre of war. It had nothing to show why the dark Angels are a Legion of legend or particular fame
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2008/08/06 16:04:57
"To be truely evil you must acknowledge the right thing to do in a situation, and then do completely the oposite" |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2008/08/04 20:35:58
Subject: Re:Quick Thoughts on "The Flight of the Eisenstein"
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Wrathful Warlord Titan Commander
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@ stormlord:
I agree that Descent of angels is a fine background-book for DA's history before they become a SM-Legion.
It had to much non-sm in it to belong to the HH-series,when every other book had already active SM-legions as actors.
This book had to be a DA-story for release dex DA ->
The HH-series deserved a book about DA acting before/at/after heresy ->
Please BL, give us only books already fitting into a series as HH.... books! Release others as pure fluff for ...-players books!
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Target locked,ready to fire
In dedicatio imperatum ultra articulo mortis.
H.B.M.C :
We were wrong. It's not the 40k End Times. It's the Trademarkening.
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