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The other way to play Demons is to spam Nurgle everything. You won't kill much, but they won't kill you either. That's not really what the OP was after I think...

TheBloodGod wrote:
Apparently Daemons seem to be a one-trick pony relying on nothing but spamming BloodCrushers.)

Not really. Daemons are just the epitome of the saying that everything counts in large numbers. The trick with the Daemons codex is not to get seduced by the wide variety of unit types available, and take whatever units you want in large numbers. My usual army involves 8 Bloodcrushers, but I've seen successful builds around lots of horrors, lots of bloodletters, lots of fiends...whatever.

Centurian99 wrote:

TheBloodGod wrote:
Apparently Daemons seem to be a one-trick pony relying on nothing but spamming BloodCrushers.)

Not really. Daemons are just the epitome of the saying that everything counts in large numbers. The trick with the Daemons codex is not to get seduced by the wide variety of unit types available, and take whatever units you want in large numbers. My usual army involves 8 Bloodcrushers, but I've seen successful builds around lots of horrors, lots of bloodletters, lots of fiends...whatever.

QFT. Bloodcrushers are the most painfully obvious example, but many people forget that Walkers end them utterly. The real framework seems to be 2-3 Soulgrinders and 4 Heralds of Tzeentch or Khorne. From there you can fill in with any of the power units and do well.

TheBloodGod wrote:
Khorne CSM aren't really up there anymore.

They used to be able to move an extra d6" then charge.

They lost that, making them slow, and orks get Waagh making them fast.

Khorne troops are also off-the-charts expensive, which combined with how slow they are at assault, means someone shoots your rhino, you foot slog berserkers across table, they get shot to death and die like normal tactical marines, then they take out maybe one unit in CC then get finished off.

If I was serious about a CC-army, I would go with one that has cost-effective melee stuff and speed (such as Fleet of Claw for tyranids, or Waaagh for Orks. Khorne Daemons might also count as speed because of deep-striking an entire army, but I haven't played against them. Apparently Daemons seem to be a one-trick pony relying on nothing but spamming BloodCrushers.)

i disagree completely! i love my fiends and tweaked out DP's.

First of all, daemons are not one trick ponies, !%#^.
I don't play with khorne at all and win 90% of the time, not very often tying and almost never losing.

Anyways, for a guy transitioning to an assault army that still wants to be Imperial, you got nothin' stronger than Grey Knights and their superior badassness.

LR Spam with a crap ton of Incinerators (S5 AP4) in PAGK, they are really good at assaulting, especially up against other assaulting armies.
They can always stay back and shoot, forcing your enemy to come in range because of shrouding. Oh, what? those LRs also have Assault ramps and can move 12"? Thats like fleet of foot for GKs, and they can shoot all their weapons because they're all assault weapons? that's CRAZY! 0.o
(inb4 250 pts fleet of foot, its much more than that, I'm simply mocking other armies.)

For an imperial HTH army, Black Templars are the kings right now. Preferred enemy for your entire army is just silly-good.

Berzerkers don't get an extra d6" movement, but they also don't get lead around the table anymore either. Most seasoned players are letting 10 Berzerkers come out of a Land Raider or Lashing the enemy into the Berzerkers. If you take the Lash's 2d6" movement into account, Berzerkers have actually gotten faster since the last edition.

PKed biker nobs + cybork
Ghalkhull + PK nobz + cybork

Nenya97 wrote:
LR Spam with a crap ton of Incinerators (S5 AP4) in PAGK, they are really good at assaulting, especially up against other assaulting armies.
They can always stay back and shoot, forcing your enemy to come in range because of shrouding. Oh, what? those LRs also have Assault ramps and can move 12"? Thats like fleet of foot for GKs, and they can shoot all their weapons because they're all assault weapons? that's CRAZY!

You can't spam both Land Raiders and PAGKs unless you're playing crazy points.

3 Land Raiders: 750 points
3 squads of PAGKS: 825 points

1600 points to get 30 MEQs in 3 transports. They'll kill shooty units, but assaulty units will deal so many casualties they'll run out of steam very quickly. I4 kills them. Model for model, PAGK are a good assault unit. But point for point, they're medium-bad.

Well here's a really fun army that I run and most people don't know their true melee power. The Space Wolves are barbaric in melee case and point, their troop choice get more power weapons then average, they have great staying power and armor

They also have the counter-attack ability so they get +1 attack for charging or being charged

the most fun thing about them though is the blood claws, you can take a squad of 15 and arm them with 3 power weapons and 2 cc weapons so they get +1 atack for those, but they get a +2 attack bonus for charging or counter-attack giving you 60 melee attacks with 12 of them from power weapons, what's not to love?

WS 3. hitting on 5s on my DPs.

Nids, heaps of em!

HtH Nidzilla has tons of potential (at least on paper). 8 super choppy TMCs (with the odd barbed strangler thrown in) and without number gaunts to do your scoring. Using the good old gaunts-tyrant guard-TMCs phalanx gets you cover saves the whole way across the board too.