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The British protest about things, on occasion, like having our troops pulled into a war in Iraq that was not given approval by the United Nations. We got quite pissed off about that. However due to the 'special relationship' our sons and daughters are now being brought home in bady bags due to the commitment our nation has shown the alliance on 2 warfronts. So any questioning the UK and what we contribute to our mutual agreement from anyone here should, perhaps, be directed via the greiving families of our war dead.

halonachos wrote:Bombing=Love so just give us an excuse.

Just look at that one hacker we're trying to extradite and this. I mean the hacker defaced military computer programming and we can't sentence him?

That's the proof of our "special relationship", mainly because there aren't U.S flags waving over buckingham palace.

.....................

................... .....

....I...see...

England and America are two countries separated by the same language

Is it some form of Haiku ?

Same could be said about ours since 1917 of course.

SO, lets assume that the fact America would like to exist, and flies in the face of the published evidence was true, and the guy was released as part of an Oil Deal.....

You're honestly telling me the US hasn't done far, far worse for a favourable Oil contract?

The US is just pissed they've been stood up to, like all bullies.

Ok, so if a terrorist blows up British Airways flight 237 and we catch one of them, then we'll just let them go the next time we want a cheap load of crude. Gotcha.

Nah, not enough body count. I'd suggest asking Mr CIA to organise another Coup or three. You know, Coups where hundreds if nto thousands of innocent lives are put at risk to keep 2 cents off the price of Oil? That sort of thing.

Face it. Meghari genuinely was released on compassionate grounds. His conviction has never really been considered all that safe, and having a terminal illness, his time to clear his name was running out fast. So in order to save face (should a retrial find him innocent, and he'd died incarcerated) compassionate laws were used. He still dies a guilty man, but the benefit of the doubt is exercised to allow him to die with his family.

Simple. Oil was quite seriously not a factor. Unless you're a Right Wing Rag looking to pick a fight where is this no real reason.

Nicely said Mad Doc.

Frazzled wrote:Ok, so if a terrorist blows up British Airways flight 237 and we catch one of them, then we'll just let them go the next time we want a cheap load of crude. Gotcha.

No, no, no. You simply help install them into the Govt. of Northern Ireland and help "negotiate" the freeing of any of their fellow "freedom fighters". Around Easter time sounds best.

Is that before or after england supports the enslavement of an ethnic group in order for cheap textile related supplies?

Or how about forcing a country to allow you to sell drugs inside of that country? I think that was in asia somewhere...

@Mad Doc Grotsnik
I can definatly agree to that, to both posts

Ok, comment of mine reinstated, perhaps worded alittle different:

The US Presidents were, until 9/11, dining every St Patrick's day with the de facto leader of the IRA, Gerry Adams, it was incredibly insulting to the Brits that a terrorist was treated as honoured guest by the leader of our closest ally nation. It did however allow the US to have a certain level of influence in the peace talks.

Nations must occasionally deal with the unpalatable. It is, to my mind, deeply hypocritical of the US to play the dying swan about this man who is on the verge of dying when they welcomed a terrorist of the first degree into their leader's home and he broke bread with the president.

It remains a saw point to my mind.

Edit-sorry people posted before I could reply to the intended poster and didn't have time to change yet.

Nah, not enough body count. I'd suggest asking Mr CIA to organise another Coup or three. You know, Coups where hundreds if nto thousands of innocent lives are put at risk to keep 2 cents off the price of Oil? That sort of thing.

Face it. Meghari genuinely was released on compassionate grounds. His conviction has never really been considered all that safe, and having a terminal illness, his time to clear his name was running out fast. So in order to save face (should a retrial find him innocent, and he'd died incarcerated) compassionate laws were used. He still dies a guilty man, but the benefit of the doubt is exercised to allow him to die with his family.

Simple. Oil was quite seriously not a factor. Unless you're a Right Wing Rag looking to pick a fight where is this no real reason.

I'm not replying to that email on the grounds I'd have to ban myself, and am leaving this thread to avoid that.

Oh please, while england accrues the second highest amount of muslims outside of the middle east, the only reason why you guys keep on the down low is because you messed the world over already.

Again, you guys supported slavery in the US, you started the Opium Wars in China, and not only that but you supported the right for muslims and clerics to go outside of a catholic church with signs saying "kill the pope". That breaks the first amendment laws in america because we don't tolerate inciting violence or obscene threats of violence in our "protests".

Then you are free to pm me your response Fraz.

Frazz, it's a shame you feel that way as the point of the post wasn't to play the blame game. The point was say hold on a minute here, the US isn't a virgin when it comes to this sort of stuff and for the media and some politicians to get on their high horse over it is a bit hypocritical.

Also, one thing for the geographically challenged....

This was a Scottish Decision, and had nothing to do with Engand, Wales, Northern Ireland or the UK as a whole.

So you wouldn't blame the U.S if say... Connecticut launched a nuke that landed in England?

halonachos wrote:So you wouldn't blame the U.S if say... Connecticut launched a nuke that landed in England?

Just out of curiosity, how old are you?

halonachos wrote:So you wouldn't blame the U.S if say... Connecticut launched a nuke that landed in England?

Sorry if I'm wrong here, but don't US States have to toe the Federal line when it comes to the important laws, but free to do what they want otherwise? If so then that makes them similar to a UK county, not a semi devolved country, which Scotland is.

As long as they don't secede, have slavery, or go against the constitution they can do as they please. There are laws in the constitution about declaring war being done by congress, but nothing about acts of war. Each state can have its own militia so...

@ Stompa, I'm 19, young yes, but that means I have evenmore time to look up the nice evil things done by england, scotland, ireland, etc.

halonachos wrote:
@ Stompa, I'm 19, young yes, but that means I have evenmore time to look up the nice evil things done by england, scotland, ireland, etc.

That explains much, thanks.

It's good to see another thread become a "which global hegemon did worse things with that power" pissing contest.

All Great powers have to do things that aren't pleasant or virtuous or even moral to best serve their interests. They all have to make suboptimal deals with bad people.

Likewise, all governments need to throw some meat to the wolves now and then. Britain had a chance to get a good deal while not really giving anything up of value, but that angers the US masses, who see a terrorist going free to a heroes welcome. So Obama chides the British, but nothing serious is going to happen over it.

The very aspirations that lead to the UK making this deal are the same aspirations that will keep the special relationship going. Being America's wingman isn't the same as the old Empire, but it's still a pretty sweet gig. And on the flip side, the US doesn't have enough true allies that are important to fritter them away.

halonachos wrote:As long as they don't secede, have slavery, or go against the constitution they can do as they please. There are laws in the constitution about declaring war being done by congress, but nothing about acts of war. Each state can have its own militia so...

@ Stompa, I'm 19, young yes, but that means I have evenmore time to look up the nice evil things done by england, scotland, ireland, etc.

Glass house alert...

Native American reservations perhaps?
Segregation even?

We know and fully understand our past, you perhaps don't, given the counter points you put forward. Your own country has a long way to go before it can hold itself up as a shining example of what should be. In the meantime stop acting like the prom queen whose been groped.

MeanGreenStompa wrote:

halonachos wrote:
@ Stompa, I'm 19, young yes, but that means I have evenmore time to look up the nice evil things done by england, scotland, ireland, etc.

That explains much, thanks.

Your flag explains much too, thanks .

You see, the thread started with someone saying that its crazy that "americans" are angry over this deal because we've done much worse.

However, you are complaining about sins comitted by the american government. Seeing as though you are from around the UK MGS, it is reasonable that you jump on the bandwagon of "stop complaining america you did worse things" and in truth are committing the same act that the americans are over this bombing issue.

So this whole thread is nothing but hypocrisy, complaining because another country is complaining because of what something your country did and then saying that the other country has done worse.

To put it bluntly(because even I am having issue with the above sentence) america thinks england did something bad, so england is saying that they too think america has done something bad.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
@ wolfstan, I will say India against England, Marshall plan for America, Vietnam and korea are mixed bags(built permanant roads, but it was a war zone), sending ships to england for gak pieces of land so they could fight the nazis(pro america), flying tigers in china(pro america), UN(pro america), england sending supplies to the south to perpetuate slavery and to weaken america(anti england), japanese internment camps(anti america), reserves(anti america), etc.

We agree that we're both evil a-hole countries, but that doesn't mean we can't argue about it. One likes to feel that his/her own country is superior, I know I do.

So if you stop complaining that america has done bad things then we'll stop complaining about the bad things england has doen.

halonachos wrote:

You see, the thread started with someone saying that its crazy that "americans" are angry over this deal because we've done much worse.

Hey Halonachos, if you are going to refer to my original post, do it correctly:

Apparently there are reports that the "special relationship" we have with the US is at threat due to the Lockerbie bomber release. Am I the only one to think that this is a little bit over the top considering we were at the side of the US in the 1st & 2nd Gulf Wars and we are along side them in Afghanistan. We've lost hundreds of young men in these conflicts and had to suffer grief on the international stage for our support of the US, but because a single bomber is released (who maybe actually innocent) there are threats being thrown around from across the pond.

If this is the case, shouldn't we as a nation be telling the US government (not having a pot shot at the US posters here) to go shove the special relationship up their a e?

This post started out pointing out it was a bit of a cheek this sort of thing happening due to what we've done in the past for the US and what we are still doing. It wasn't about bashing the US. Do you not see how shallow and actually worthless the "special relationship" appears to be? It's all well and good when you want us to stand by your side as allies on the world stage or the use of our armed foces, but as soon as we do something your media doesn't agree with or your politicians can make a story out of, you turn on us.

So if you stop complaining that america has done bad things then we'll stop complaining about the bad things england has doen.

Dear God this is so painful. The purpose of pointing out that the US has done bad things was to try and show you how hypocritical it is of certain parts of the US to kick off about the release of the bomber. These people are making out that the US has NEVER done anything as wrong as that. It WASN'T about starting a "you're worse than us", "no you're worse than us" p ing contest!

halonachos wrote:Is that before or after england supports the enslavement of an ethnic group in order for cheap textile related supplies?

If only there was a North American goverment that supported slavery around during that period that I could use to counter this accusation...

However, you are complaining about sins comitted by the american government.

No we're not, once again you've seen the words and missed the point.

What we are saying is that you cannot take a moral high ground point, especially with regards to "terrorism" when your country has done exactly the same thing you are complaining about.

No one, except you again, was using this thread as a chance to list the gakky things done by country X for whatever reason.

Oh..

Oh please, while england accrues the second highest amount of muslims outside of the middle east, the only reason why you guys keep on the down low is because you messed the world over already.

Can anyone explain to me what the feth this is supoosed to mean ? And why this is one sentence ? is there a bit, like some content or a point, missing ?

We're "accruing" muslims ? With a bit of luck when we get the complete set we cans end off and get the special folder to store them in as well as the limited edition holographic foil one.

We keep on the "down low" ? What does that even mean ?

I'm assuming that is supposed to be some vague attempt to suggest that Britain stays out of foreign affairs or something ? Which considering the ongoing wars we're involved in and indeed this very thread once again shows a horrific sense of irony.

Go go country stereotypes !

DING DING DING!! YOU'RE GOVERNMENT WOULD DO THE SAME!!

Sure, you wanted our help during WW2, but as soon as we did something you didn't like, you bit us.

"The lesson: Britons may not like American leadership—but the British media like it even less, to the point of being willing to skew poll results in their reporting. "

How many of your neighbors liked president bush and the invasion of Iraq? How many detested guantanamo bay?

Modquisition:
Ok threads abit flamey no?
Lets close this to avoid further embarrassment on both contintents.

Fraggle ROCKS!