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Well, Night Lords, your enthusiasm is welcomed.

As Uszaty has pointed out...there are a few issue with running Vindis.

And I will repeat again, all heavies have pros and cons, it's a taste issue of what you want in the list.
Vindis work for you, but they don't mesh with everyone.

Sanctjud wrote:
Vindis work for you, but they don't mesh with everyone.

Agreed. But going back to the OP, the list of Bikes-speeders-assault marines, who would take a Vindi? I would for the instant-death of Biker teams/piles of assault marines at a time, but on the other hand, a MM attack bike/biker with a melta/speeder with a multi/melta can shut down a Vindi pretty damn quick, and nastily too due to the vindi's 24" range.

Always give you vindicator a havoc launcher, that way it has a 2nd weapon, and now has a 48" range, str 5 twin linked blast for after it's killed everything within 24".

Well...

There is an issue with that.
It's an expensive secondary gun.

You won't be maximizing the range (wasted) as you would have already advanced to get into optimal Demo Cannon range.

In which case, a weaponless Vindi can do a variety of other things that are useful (that you'd do with a empty rhino) that doesn't involve shooting.

Now that is a taste issue/an option, but I think the weaponless Vindi will help the army more ways without using the secondary weapon rather than a questionable blast template.

For taking the vindi or not i'd ask the guy whether he's taking a MM attack bike or a Heavy Bolter one Zack. because depending on his choice can alter your choice. (but this only works if he's willing to tell you or not)

Well, a different way of saying that MOzzyfuzzy would be to ask if the gaming group is an open list environment or note.

But in my experience, I usually get side armor shots with Hvy Bolter Attack bikes, and with a high rate of fire, those 6's turn up eventually/frequently...

But yea, if he goes Melta hvy on fast platforms, quality of tank may be a bad route.

We're just going round in circle's here.... someone says to take havocs then nxt person says bad idea take obi's then it's vindicator/defiler (usally from me) and back to hvocs/oblits. Any of them are a good choice, can we discuss pro's and con's of say ...... CSM fast attack? for this army of course!

Mozzyfuzzy wrote:For taking the vindi or not i'd ask the guy whether he's taking a MM attack bike or a Heavy Bolter one Zack. because depending on his choice can alter your choice. (but this only works if he's willing to tell you or not)

Yeah... I don't know how anyone else's group does it, but in my casual-but-want-to-win gaming group, we write up our lists and show the opponent either 1) as we are setting up the table or 2) before rolling for edge/scenario.

And come on... "depending on his choice, you can alter your choice", so player A changes because of B's choice which makes B rethink his army and realize he doesn't have the troops to repel the assault army hes about to play. So he changes his list to make sure he can stop players A's game breaking unit, who realizes his gamebreakers are going to get smashed! so he makes a few adjustments...

I reckon you/your circle of gamers will have alot more fun and better lists if you whip them out a few minutes before playing... unless you're like my friends and this will turn into a 10-20 minute yarn about what works and what doesn't in the list

Raptors: 7 Raptors is 35 points more expensive than 7 CSM. 35 points is the cost of a rhino which is why I've been fielding my raptors as a squad of 7. The ability to get over obstacles and tarpit/speedbump units is something i value quite alot, worth paying a rhino's value in points IMO. With meltaguns they can be quite good at stopping a speeder getting behind your armour. With a Lash sorcerer you can "pull" units into you're charge range. Really though, its a YMMV unit. I find them valuable mainly for the going over objects factor: what's everyones thoughts?

Meh.
I prefer to go through them with Uber Grit and rhino.

Now... if the icon system didn't exist and there were true marks...that's a whole different story.

I tend to use them like my terminators..... stall the enemy with meltagun and plasma pistol fire while my Zerkers just walk up to an enemy unit while this distraction is going on and tear them to peices.

Mozzyfuzzy wrote:I tend to use them like my terminators..... stall the enemy with meltagun and plasma pistol fire while my Zerkers just walk up to an enemy unit while this distraction is going on and tear them to peices.

*raises eyebrow*


Do you...happen to have a shrine to the dice gods around your house?

I may do..... or it's just nobody can roll the right numbers on dice it's probably just my luck. (or maybe it's those weighted dice HA HA HA HAAAA)