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**JEB_Stuart**

Like I said its Orwellian, and quite disconcerting...

**Kilkrazy**

We were talking about this at work today. I just don't see how it can be done with any degree of realism.

My assistant producer was drinking Volvic. I pointed out she would be charged some carbon for that, as opposed to my preferred tipple of tap water.

Another colleague cycles the two miles to work every day, so he would save a lot of carbon that way, but he often flies to Glasgow to see his mother.

What's the difference between eating lunch in the staff canteen, or going next door to buy a sandwich at Marks & Spencers, or going round the corner to buy a toasted sandwich at the Italian sandwich shop?

Is everyone going to have to carry a card and get Carbon points added whenever they do any kind of transaction? How is it ever going to work?

**Mad Doc Grotsnik**

Now, the idea of a monthly statement informing me of my Carbon Usage I quite like. I try to be environmentally friendly, so a tangible way of seeing how well I'm doing would be welcome.

But this system is flawed from the outset.

For instance, I am a Taxi Driver. I drive for a living. And I get through a lot of Diesel. But in doing so, I am actually being environmentally friendly, as I am driving 20ish different people or groups of people to their destinations, thus taking 20ish other vehicles off the road each day.

How would this be reflected? Or would I, once again, have to bear the brunt of a taxation aimed at achieving the very thing I am enabling?

**Kilkrazy**

Pay a higher fuel tax, and charge your customers more.

Alternatively, have a card reader in your cab which allows the passenger to transfer some of their carbon credits to your carbon card.

**Mad Doc Grotsnik**

I think I'm going to write to my MP (Greg Clark) and suggest a Private Members bill offering Tax Relief on Fuel Tax to those provably providing Public Transport.

The higher taxation of fuel is meant to be about discouraging frivolous use of Cars, but when like me you very much depend on your wheels for your living, and in doing so enable others to not use their wheels as much, it seems an incredibly unjust tax to have to pay.

Apply it to Hackney Drivers, Private Hire Drivers, and Public Transport Drivers, and boom, our profits go up, and the same number of Cars are off the road. Plus, with a little technical jiggery pokery (say a swipe card type affair) it can help the Taxman clamp down on us drivers, as they have a hell of a time proving how much money I've actually taken, as easily 95% of my earnings are cash in hand.

By keeping tabs on my fuel consumption (they need to know how much Tax Exempt Fuel I've used in a year) they can extrapolate and estimate the number of miles driven. Compare this to the local price structure, and what I declared, and boom, you can catch piss takers very easily.

**Waaagh_Gonads**

Perhaps Mad Doc Grotsnik you should write to your local member and ask them to just cut taxes.

Perhaps with less tax income, the government can become more focused on how to spend it, and spend it in (more) productive ways.

**Mad Doc Grotsnik**

I don;t mind high taxes as long as I see some results.

Which beyond the NHS and State Education systems, I really don't see much evidence of.

**Orkeosaurus**

Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:I think I'm going to write to my MP (Greg Clark) and suggest a Private Members bill offering Tax Relief on Fuel Tax to those provably providing Public Transport.

The higher taxation of fuel is meant to be about discouraging frivolous use of Cars, but when like me you very much depend on your wheels for your living, and in doing so enable others to not use their wheels as much, it seems an incredibly unjust tax to have to pay.

Why? I mean, if fuel becomes more expensive around the board, then people will take whatever steps they can to reduce the amount of fuel they use up. If a taxi service is a better usage of fuel than using a car of their own, people should use the taxi more. Yes, your rates should go up in response to increased prices, but so should the rate of ever alternative, and the rate of the alternative will go up according to how much more or less fuel they use up.

Thus, if fuel prices rise universally, you will gain customers (or, if driving a taxi cab uses up more fuel than people driving their own cars, you will lose customers. But that's still what the goal of the tax is).

**Mad Doc Grotsnik**

But thats the thing. My minimum fare, in Tunbridge Wells, is £3.80. This is quite high for the UK, and means the majority of our customers are the elderly, disabled, or those without cars. Thanks to sky high fuel, I cannot voluntarily drop the price (I would make even less than I right now, and half of feth all is not good) to the level that Car owners would regularly use me, at least not to the degree it would offset things.

Giving us Taxi Drivers a Tax Break on fuel however, would work wonders. Cheaper to run means cheaper fares possible. Cheaper Fares means more people willing to take a Taxi. Bingo, job done.

**Orkeosaurus**

But shouldn't car owners be suffering more than you as a result of the tax if they burn through fuel faster?

**Mad Doc Grotsnik**

Yup, but in order to use more fuel than I do in a week (averaging £15 a day in a Diesel engine) you'd be driving for work purposes, all of which are generally reclaimed or already paid for by your company.

I provide a valuable public service, and have to foot the bill myself. It's unjust I tells ya!

**Orkeosaurus**

Ah, I see. But that sounds like more of an issue with inefficiencies in the companies offering the compensation for commuting; after all, if they cut that out and gave that money to their employees to spend in whatever manner they thought was best, they could choose a more efficient method of transportation.

**Albatross**

Never. Gonna. Happen.

**Mad Doc Grotsnik**

Indeed not. Companies in the UK tend to pay something like, 28p per mile for using your own car, covering Fuel, Wear and Tear, Insurance etc.

And if it's a company car, you pay a higher tax band in Income Tax. Which is why most people with half a brain that have a company car, instead opt for a Wages Top Up to cover the cost of buying/leasing one, and still have the company pay Insurance, MOT, Tax etc.