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Daniel Moszkowicz wrote:As mentioned, I'm trying to piece together what I have in my 40K box, and would appreciate any assistance you guys can offer. I've uploaded three photos I wish for you to comment on. The questions are with the photos. Which are here:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/91895-Terminator%3F.html

Those look like some fairly old models, indeed.

That is a very old Terminator space marine, and those are indeed his arms. Maybe from the old Space Crusade board game? He is still a game-legal model, with current weapons (a storm bolter and power fist), which is not the case with all models of that vintage. He is probably mounted on a 25mm diameter base, which is still legal for use under the 5th edition rules, but modern terminator models come on 40mm bases, so some players choose to swap/update for consistency with the current game environment.

The second model is a basic Tactical Marine, a two-part model commonly acquired in the 2nd ed boxed set, IIRC (I didn't start until 3rd). He's missing his Bolter, the standard basic SM gun. As you can see, with this particular model design, the hands are molded onto the bolter, so you really need to find a bolter FOR this kind of model for best ease of assembly if you want to use it. You could get a current bolter instead, but you'd need to convert hands onto it. If you like this style of easy-to-assemble two-part model, you may want to pick up the 5th edition starter set, Assault on Black Reach, which has newer, more-detailed versions of the same concept.

The third is another very old model. I'm not actually sure if that's a Space Marine or Imperial Guard bike, though I suspect it's the former. Space Marines still have bike-mounted units and characters, though IG don't.

Bishop of the Blackrose wrote:Well played Troll-King but I must confess that it was my liege who answerd your challenge with such posh and miscreant behavior. Forgive him, his impertinence and youth seem to give way to logical solutions. Allow me to introduce myself, I am Bishop of the Blackrose and Bishop of the Blackrose am I. Father to the House of Ministry and native son to Gothikadia, a most beloved of lands. I hence accept the challenge you present before me and must say with all the honesty that resides in all that is good that I shall rise to the occasion well and proper. Such beads as you mention will not be needed for I strike with wicked tounge and slay with but a whisper. Lay your gauntlet for I present myself before you humble and true for my proverbial itch needs scratching.

Oh! There you are Bishop of Blackrose, indeed.

In all honesty, I must admit that I thought you to be female in gender for the term "Blackrose" refers more to the "opposite sex". But I understand that your House must have once been ruled by woman and that the men were in servitude back then, having little say in the naming rights of their House and place in the order of things.

That your liege could have "answered" my challenge before your eyes had a chance to absorb the contents, perhaps suggests that your family and House continues to be more of service than free, and as such continues a proud tradition which began with the females on your family tree. It must be a "most beloved of lands" indeed, that you would continue to remain there and in that position?

I find it difficult to believe that you will rise to anything with any "well and proper" intentions when you have failed to rise beyond the grasp of your master, Bishop of Blackrose. So, reside with all that is good, all you like, but you will find no mercy from me, dear friend.

Also, you seem to be forgetting - or perhaps just not grasping - that Glass Beads is all that you can use in this contest I have brought to you with my entry. You may have Glass Bleads to strike with your "wicked tongue" and even your "whisper" -- but it is always Glass beads that you will be using in this kind of contest. You have Glass Beads to attack, and you have Glass beads to deflect my own Glass Beads of conquest, but - remember please - always it is Glass beads you are using. Not guns, nor swords. Nothing so evil in nature as characterized in our society.

Therefore, I may lay down my "gauntlet" if I feel so inclined, but it would only be to sweep the table clean in a - CanvasShake - manoeuvre (Australian spelling) -- and in so doing rendering this contest over, won in my favour, by pointing to the well-targeted and executed countless shots of mine, taking your Glass Beads out of contention, and leaving little room for you to continue your "proverbial" scratching.

You may be "humble and true" and as such a worthy combatant of mine, but your rising in "The Game" will not come at the expense of my celebrated title and position in this beautiful contest.

In conclusion, your inovative tricks concerning notices not be being passed to whom they are addressed, may work for you for a time; but they will not work on I, The Troll-King of Chatsitea, in this instance. And, in me remaining as such, it can only mean that even with your desperate workings you continue to remain my underling.

Thank you for finally appearing before me in my arena, in my place of business, Bishop of Blackrose. Alas, most of your shots have been deflected and you are quickly running out of... Glass Beads to continue in this particular contest.

Daniel Moszkowicz. (The Troll-King of Chatsitea.)


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Ketara wrote:My friend, you appear to be playing not The Game, but rather the Glass Bead Game. To think that you are not aware of the true name of the game in which you lay claim to the title of highest ranked player is somewhat disturbing. As it would be foolish to boast of such honours in ignorance, one must but assume that this misdirection is obvious and deliberate.

You may be playing the Glass Bead Game, but when it comes to The Game, Chuck Norris is the Master, and cannot be defeated. Should you not happen to see him in your vicinity, then he is probably behind you. As such, I would advise treading with caution when laying claim to your title, whether it resides in a different game or no.

Please re-read this entire post, before you enter my place of business with your pompous ways and deluded imaginings.

The question of what 'The Game' is was posed by Vindicator #9 some five days ago, and answered by me suitably and in proper time.
I have named it 'The Game' in honour of Hesse himself as - in my view - it is the only and true game which will live on and be played into eternity by the world. I like to use this title as it is not as threatening to some people who have never heard of it before.

So, 'The Game' is 'The Game' as intended and as I understand it on Castalia. You may take your Chuck Norris and continue with your violent ways in his Martial Arts theatre, you are not clever enough to get a second invitation.

Please, therefore, ignore my "disturbing" behaviour and continue with your Chuck Norris shadow-boxing. I'll certainly get out of your way.

D.M.

Is that a little glass pipe, a lighter and a small unassuming rock i see laying on your single bed?

Nonetheless Welcome.

Mannahnin wrote:

Daniel Moszkowicz wrote:As mentioned, I'm trying to piece together what I have in my 40K box, and would appreciate any assistance you guys can offer. I've uploaded three photos I wish for you to comment on. The questions are with the photos. Which are here:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/91895-Terminator%3F.html

Those look like some fairly old models, indeed.

That is a very old Terminator space marine, and those are indeed his arms. Maybe from the old Space Crusade board game? He is still a game-legal model, with current weapons (a storm bolter and power fist), which is not the case with all models of that vintage. He is probably mounted on a 25mm diameter base, which is still legal for use under the 5th edition rules, but modern terminator models come on 40mm bases, so some players choose to swap/update for consistency with the current game environment.

The second model is a basic Tactical Marine, a two-part model commonly acquired in the 2nd ed boxed set, IIRC (I didn't start until 3rd). He's missing his Bolter, the standard basic SM gun. As you can see, with this particular model design, the hands are molded onto the bolter, so you really need to find a bolter FOR this kind of model for best ease of assembly if you want to use it. You could get a current bolter instead, but you'd need to convert hands onto it. If you like this style of easy-to-assemble two-part model, you may want to pick up the 5th edition starter set, Assault on Black Reach, which has newer, more-detailed versions of the same concept.

The third is another very old model. I'm not actually sure if that's a Space Marine or Imperial Guard bike, though I suspect it's the former. Space Marines still have bike-mounted units and characters, though IG don't.

Twenty years of knowledge to re-absorb I must, and you just cannot help yourself to stick the knife in a little deeper, Mannahnin.

Seriously, I am very grateful for your information, you strike me as a master of the 40K game, to know its history of detail so authoritatively. Thank you for bringing your authority to me with these details. I now have a good starting-point for further research and search&rescue missions into said "box".

I'm not sure about "Space Crusade" but I have some memory of a Space Hulk board-game. Perhaps that's it, or perhaps that is its
other or regional and as such pertinent name. I don't know. In any case, it's a moot point as they're game-legal as you state.

I will use the 25mm base, unless the 40mm comes into my possession easily. Nevertheless, I understand that I should probably update - sooner or later - as that sounds like the proper thing to do. That he is game-legal makes for pleasant news as he looks pretty awesome. I can't wait to stick his arms on and get painting.

My rulebook is titled, "Rogue Trader". Which would confirm your view that the Tactical Marine is from around that time (2nd Ed). I understand that I am looking for a bolter with hands. I'll know it's his because it'll have his hands in place. Excellent! That makes my mission much easier. Right now, I don't want to spend too much money and am endeavouring to get an army onto the table by foraging for what I largely (don't know) have. This type of model is a little generic for my liking, in all honesty. I prefer the weight of lead, like I think you do also. I've looked at your army photos and am very impressed. I especially liked your use of the travelling, pavilion-style tent used to house one of your armies. Very nice use of a grand-style of theatre. Well done! I think I'll eventually borrow the concept and name the tent after your good title-name, Mannahnin.

I'm definitely consistent. It's all old, all right. I understand that I should probably look for a Space Marine with legs in such a position that he would suggest being capable of stradling or bestriding. I think I saw something like that, but I'll appreciate if you confirm that that is the leg position I should find him in.

Also, I have a unit of Imperial Guard Human Bombs. No doubt, more old models. I found that out just yesterday. I understand that IG and SM - as you have shortened them suitably - can be included in the same army, but do you think they're worth it? I certainly like the look of them, with their dynamite-style bombs attached to their chests. I think they'll be fun to paint. I could probably come up with a good story about why they're attached to - what is looking like - my SM army. (Simply because I have the most of these kind of models.) And as I mentioned, I want to start playing soon.

Thank you very much for the assistance you have given me so far, Mannahnin. Very much appreciated. You have made my task a lot easier, and chatting with you has been very pleasurable.

Best Regards,
Daniel Moszkowicz.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

Mr-_-Flidd wrote:Is that a little glass pipe, a lighter and a small unassuming rock i see laying on your single bed?

Nonetheless Welcome.

Thanks for the welcome, sir.

You are wrong!

The connection between your eyes and brain seems to be faulty somehow, for I would suggest that what you see are the contents within your own den of miscreant thought and ways of seeing.

Daniel Moszkowicz. (The Troll-King of Chatsitea.)

We Gothikadians of the House on Ministry are not that of servitude but of true freedom from this physical realm. We dwell in the metaphysical, where rhyme and reason are the only logical approach to life. To clarify you interpritation of my most blessed of houses, the name Blackrose is translated (in simplest of forms) beauty in the dark. That which mere men (or trolls in this matter) deem trivial or equivocal, hard to understand. To further clarify, in my understanding that you believed me a female is a statement of jest and I shall take it as such. For in any other matter, I would be lead to believe you've tried to insult me, a definite undertaking for such whose footing in it's own palace is unsure. And if you mean we have been, at one time ruled by women, you are infact correct for love rules all were I'm from, a concept I am to understand is foreign to such as you. Further more, these glass beads you constantly need to refer to are unecessery, for I play not your game. I am that of the quip,my way of life, be the written word or expressed with all the emotion I can muster. Or if you prefer a counter balance, invite the Sarcastic donkey-cave Monster for a beautiful ballad, he who feeds upon the egos and false claims of those self believed to be kings. And for stepping upon your arena, you must give me a moment for I have sullied my bare feet with ignorant dirt. And to your reference of attacking, one does not attack when there is no posing of a threat, but lays at leisure until such need arises. And from what I've seen so far, I believe I shall take a nap. Wake me when you have something, and not the mere pebbles you constitute and boulders.

Hi again, Daniel.

Glad to be of help. It’s always nice chatting with a new or returning player. I don’t think I’d call myself a master, but I have been playing the game and participating in this forum pretty close to continually since 1999, so have absorbed a good bit of knowledge.

Thank you for the compliments on my models! Quick clarification on the photos- many of those are taken at tournaments I’ve attended, and are shots of other people’s models and armies. Including the fantasy army in the pavilion. The armies of mine I have photos of on here are these:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2633-1500pt%20Fallen.html
http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1569-Baltimore%2007%20Army%20Display.html
(bigger version of the above, different unit mix)
http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2419-Children%20of%20Degradation.html
http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2232-My%20Wood%20Elves.html


The Rogue Trader rulebook is, as I recall, the first edition of 40k. The current edition is the 5th, and came out fairly recently. The nature of the game has changed a bit. It’s overall much simplified, and the rules more clearly written. Point costs of units overall are lower, too, allowing players to use more of their models at once in a typical game, but the simplified rules prevent this from taking all day. For example, last night I played a game with a friend at 1850pts per side, in about two hours, using the following armies:

Him, Space Marines:

Librarian, leading a squad of 10 elite veteran Sternguard marines, transported in a Drop Pod
Chaplain, leading a squad of 5 assault terminators, transported in a Land Raider Redeemer (recent variant)
10 Tactical Marines with Lascannon, Flamer, sgt with power fist, and Razorback transport
10 Tactical Marines with Multimelta, Meltagun, sgt with power fist & combi-meltagun, in a Drop Pod
10 Tactical Marines with Lascannon, Plasmagun, sgt with power fist & combi-plasmagun
Thunderfire Cannon operated by a Techmarine

Me, with Chaos Space Marines:

Daemon Prince with mark of slaanesh, wings and psychic power
Sorcerer with mark of slaanesh, jump pack and psychic power
5 Terminators with Icon of Chaos Glory, power fist, chain fist, three power weapons, heavy flamer, combi-flamer, two combi-meltaguns, and a twin-linked bolter
Dreadnought with Plasmacannon
8 Khorne Berserkers with an icon-bearer, led by an Aspiring Champion with power fist, transported in a Rhino with smoke, searchlight, Combi-meltagun
10 Chaos Space Marines with 2 meltaguns, icon of chaos glory, led by an Aspiring Champion with power fist, transported in a Rhino with smoke, searchlight, Combi-meltagun
5 Chaos Space Marines with meltagun, icon of chaos glory, transported in a Rhino with smoke, searchlight, havoc launcher
7 Lesser Daemons
Chaos Vindicator with Daemonic Possession
2 Obliterators
6 Chaos Space Marine Havocs with 4 Missile Launchers, Icon of Chaos Glory

To my understanding Rogue Trader usually involved somewhat smaller skirmishes, and games mostly took a bit longer, particularly if you needed to generate random equipment, chaos mutations, (etc.) at the beginning. I think there are still people out there who play it, though, if you prefer it. They are likely to be a bit more challenging to find. Some players certainly miss some of the elements which have been removed, like most applications of the old Allies rules.

The most cost-effective way to get caught up is probably to buy the aforementioned Assault on Black Reach boxed set, which gets you the current rules (in a handy, reduced-size format rulebook), templates, some dice, and quite a few nice new models, which as I mentioned are designed for easy assembly. Not that I’m a salesman for GW, but it’s genuinely a nice bargain price for what you get. Of course if you’ve got enough old models to make a playable army, using those is a perfectly respectable option too.

Regarding your additional questions about the models:

With most bikes you’re exactly right that that there should be a set of space marine legs spread to stride the bike, which came with it. However, I did a little digging, and I think I may have found the model in question. I’m not sure how many parts the rider comes in, but this may be him:

http://solegends.com/citrt/rt106medicbike.htm

This may be a helpful reference page for your models in general, BTW:
http://solegends.com/citrt/index.htm

Regarding the human bombs, this is a unit which has no modern equivalent, anymore. I saw a playtest version of the Witchhunters (Inquisitorial army, including Sisters of Battle) codex about ten years ago which included rules for them, but they were removed prior to publication. I think the increased modern relevance of this concept has made a company of GW’s current size less willing to feature that particular unit. I’m not sure what the best unit to have them count as would be. Perhaps conscripts, in an IG army. Or in a SM army, maybe servitors for a Techmarine? I’m pretty sure these are rare models now, and if you aren’t too attached to them you might also be able to get a nice price for them on ebay.

The only way to use allies under the present 40k rules are to use the Witchhunters or Daemonhunters codices, which are rules for inquisitorial forces, which have the authority to mix units from their own codex with those from the Imperial Guard and/or Space Marines codices. The other “official” way to mix armies is to play Apocalypse, which is a supplement GW came out with a couple of years ago specifically for large (3000+ pts per side) epic battles. Of course you can always mix armies/change the rules with friends who agree.

[quote

Please re-read this entire post, before you enter my place of business with your pompous ways and deluded imaginings.

The question of what 'The Game' is was posed by Vindicator #9 some five days ago, and answered by me suitably and in proper time.
I have named it 'The Game' in honour of Hesse himself as - in my view - it is the only and true game which will live on and be played into eternity by the world. I like to use this title as it is not as threatening to some people who have never heard of it before.

So, 'The Game' is 'The Game' as intended and as I understand it on Castalia. You may take your Chuck Norris and continue with your violent ways in his Martial Arts theatre, you are not clever enough to get a second invitation.

Please, therefore, ignore my "disturbing" behaviour and continue with your Chuck Norris shadow-boxing. I'll certainly get out of your way.

D.M.

So to summarise, you have renamed the Glass Bead Game 'The Game' to suit your own intentions? To issue the accusation of pompousness appears to be the height of hypocrisy from someone who not only mutilates the original name of the works of Hermann Hesse, but self proclaims himself the highest ranking player.

Claiming that the original title would be 'threatening' almost spurs me to to enquire as to the kind of company you keep, whereby they are threatened by mere words. However, one is more inclined to believe this to be nothing more than a deliberate ploy to confuse the unwary as to exactly what you refer to, and make them think of the White Bear phenomenon known as 'The Game'.

Whilst I realise you have titled yourself the Troll King of Chatsitea, I would advise you to refrain from passing written judgement on the intellectual capacities and personalities of other forum members as you have so spuriously done so. Regardless of the articulation involved, Rule 1# of this board is to maintain polite civility, and refrain from attacking other members directly. Adherence to this rule is not optional.

Oh, and a second welcome to Dakka!

Round #1 : Ketara.

Ding ding, seconds away round #2!

Ketara wrote:[quote

Please re-read this entire post, before you enter my place of business with your pompous ways and deluded imaginings.

The question of what 'The Game' is was posed by Vindicator #9 some five days ago, and answered by me suitably and in proper time.
I have named it 'The Game' in honour of Hesse himself as - in my view - it is the only and true game which will live on and be played into eternity by the world. I like to use this title as it is not as threatening to some people who have never heard of it before.

So, 'The Game' is 'The Game' as intended and as I understand it on Castalia. You may take your Chuck Norris and continue with your violent ways in his Martial Arts theatre, you are not clever enough to get a second invitation.

Please, therefore, ignore my "disturbing" behaviour and continue with your Chuck Norris shadow-boxing. I'll certainly get out of your way.

D.M.

So to summarise, you have renamed the Glass Bead Game 'The Game' to suit your own intentions? To issue the accusation of pompousness appears to be the height of hypocrisy from someone who not only mutilates the original name of the works of Hermann Hesse, but self proclaims himself the highest ranking player.

Claiming that the original title would be 'threatening' almost spurs me to to enquire as to the kind of company you keep, whereby they are threatened by mere words. However, one is more inclined to believe this to be nothing more than a deliberate ploy to confuse the unwary as to exactly what you refer to, and make them think of the White Bear phenomenon known as 'The Game'.

Whilst I realise you have titled yourself the Troll King of Chatsitea, I would advise you to refrain from passing written judgement on the intellectual capacities and personalities of other forum members as you have so spuriously done so. Regardless of the articulation involved, Rule 1# of this board is to maintain polite civility, and refrain from attacking other members directly. Adherence to this rule is not optional.

Oh, and a second welcome to Dakka!

Dear Ketara,

Firstly, if there is going to be any summary or review of any symbolic measure taking place than it will be authorized by me, only.

As you would be aware, "The Glass Bead Game" has also been called the "Divine Lila" "(Play or Game of Life)". With such noble, lofty, and high ideals 'The Game' instills and inspires - in the those of use who want to take it further than it has ever been before - grand visions and perceptions. "The Glass Bead Game" is so powerful a composition that it demands an attention worthy of some momentus disclosure and genesis of modern understanding. A genesis of further development, if you will. Precisely because it is also a metaphor which "has been expressed by every great Wisdom Tradition known to man" - that it deserves to be known as 'The One Game', 'The Game', the only game which will be played into perpetuity. It is an age-old game, but now, right here right now, it continues to be played and imagined in new and evolving ways and as such it is, 'The Game'. The "The". The one and only. Used to indicate uniqueness, Ketara.

So, what intentions do I have to name it, 'The Game', except to bring a level of respect and honour to the masters before me, the masters of the said game? You apparently have already made your conclusion.

As previously stated by me, I am the 'highest-ranked player' because I have developed the ranking system, amongst other aspects. What's more is that I've invited you to participate in this proces if you so wished. (Have you really finally re-read this entire post or are you just pretending?) I am developing this game like it has never been done before, and yes, I do believe Hesse is smiling on me and my work, from some lofty perch, if I may be so bold as to fancy. I have never stopped someone from claiming their own title or challenging me over mine. But please remember that it is I, Daniel Moszkowicz, The Troll-King of Chatsitea that has brought 'The Game' to its present position in history. I have a grand vision for it in the present-future, and how it can be played on the internet, but alas you are not the kind of person to share this vision with me. I am nothing but a butcher or mutilater to you.

I never have any ploys of any sort, until someone stands before me who is aware of who I am and whom is willing to draw glass beads randomly from a felt bag held by Hesse himself.

The company I keep is wide and varied when I'm on the internet. In the form of a different persona and username on a bicycling website which invites members to comment on the bicycles in the gallery, I have been attacked as a kind of mental slayer or torturer who hurts peoples minds by the use of my large vocabulary and overall intelligence. There are people who will never understand things in this world no matter how much time you employ with them. This comes down to education, primarily.

Your 'White Bear phenomenon" reference is simply a jerrymandering move which fails to find its mark with any precision. As such I will conclude that you continue to think that, I have some form of agenda - with my use of the title being discussed - beyond that which I have mentioned. This shouldn't detract from the fact that you have finally brought - at least - some intelligence to the discussion so far. Alas, you have failed to make a point-score of any real and actual significance. (Trust me, if you had, I would not only have identified it, but I would have given it a name and therefore your place in its genesis and/or history.)

One thing I have found about playing like this is that I must be honest, and be as honest with myself as I would expect from my opposition. If you are deserving you will get your due respect and honour with me, I always start from.

"Regardless of the articulation involved, Rule 1# of this board is to maintain polite civility, and refrain from attacking other members directly. Adherence to this rule is not optional."

This is nothing new, Ketara. You only have to type in: "Troll-King of Chatsitea" into the preeminent "Google" to find some order of my history and pages which are unable to be loaded through their disappearance, and so I come here with a long hisotry of banishments from a large number of websites, and as such I have learnt this all to well. I have also learnt that Moderators are the biggest hypocrites in the business, and will often say one thing and then claim to know nothing of it at a time which suits them in the future. Feeble minds in a low position in society, and of the kind I hope to not find here at "Dakka Dakka". Although, I suppose that I will eventually come across it regardless. After all it's a part of the human condition.

You can take your "Rule #1" and interpret it all you like, for I have learnt a thing or two about website registration and am ready for any hypocritical manoeverings by pompous Moderators whose only authority in life is to play a God-like figure in cyberspace with members' participation. (I am in no way passing judgement on you, in this instance, by the way, Ketara.) [Then again, you will do what you feel you must, when you feel you must do it, I'm sure.) {Just to let you know that I won't be surprised.}

I will take your "second welcome" as you just imposing some kind of authority on me in your pseudo-intellectual manner.

Cheers,
Daniel Moszkowicz. (The Troll-King of Chatsitea.)

Mannahnin wrote:Hi again, Daniel.

Glad to be of help. It’s always nice chatting with a new or returning player. I don’t think I’d call myself a master, but I have been playing the game and participating in this forum pretty close to continually since 1999, so have absorbed a good bit of knowledge.

Thank you for the compliments on my models! Quick clarification on the photos- many of those are taken at tournaments I’ve attended, and are shots of other people’s models and armies. Including the fantasy army in the pavilion. The armies of mine I have photos of on here are these:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2633-1500pt%20Fallen.html
http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1569-Baltimore%2007%20Army%20Display.html
(bigger version of the above, different unit mix)
http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2419-Children%20of%20Degradation.html
http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2232-My%20Wood%20Elves.html

The Rogue Trader rulebook is, as I recall, the first edition of 40k.

The current edition is the 5th, and came out fairly recently. The nature of the game has changed a bit. It’s overall much simplified, and the rules more clearly written. Point costs of units overall are lower, too, allowing players to use more of their models at once in a typical game, but the simplified rules prevent this from taking all day. For example, last night I played a game with a friend at 1850pts per side, in about two hours, using the following armies:

Him, Space Marines:

Librarian, leading a squad of 10 elite veteran Sternguard marines, transported in a Drop Pod
Chaplain, leading a squad of 5 assault terminators, transported in a Land Raider Redeemer (recent variant)
10 Tactical Marines with Lascannon, Flamer, sgt with power fist, and Razorback transport
10 Tactical Marines with Multimelta, Meltagun, sgt with power fist & combi-meltagun, in a Drop Pod
10 Tactical Marines with Lascannon, Plasmagun, sgt with power fist & combi-plasmagun
Thunderfire Cannon operated by a Techmarine

Me, with Chaos Space Marines:

Daemon Prince with mark of slaanesh, wings and psychic power
Sorcerer with mark of slaanesh, jump pack and psychic power
5 Terminators with Icon of Chaos Glory, power fist, chain fist, three power weapons, heavy flamer, combi-flamer, two combi-meltaguns, and a twin-linked bolter
Dreadnought with Plasmacannon
8 Khorne Berserkers with an icon-bearer, led by an Aspiring Champion with power fist, transported in a Rhino with smoke, searchlight, Combi-meltagun
10 Chaos Space Marines with 2 meltaguns, icon of chaos glory, led by an Aspiring Champion with power fist, transported in a Rhino with smoke, searchlight, Combi-meltagun
5 Chaos Space Marines with meltagun, icon of chaos glory, transported in a Rhino with smoke, searchlight, havoc launcher
7 Lesser Daemons
Chaos Vindicator with Daemonic Possession
2 Obliterators
6 Chaos Space Marine Havocs with 4 Missile Launchers, Icon of Chaos Glory

To my understanding Rogue Trader usually involved somewhat smaller skirmishes, and games mostly took a bit longer, particularly if you needed to generate random equipment, chaos mutations, (etc.) at the beginning. I think there are still people out there who play it, though, if you prefer it. They are likely to be a bit more challenging to find. Some players certainly miss some of the elements which have been removed, like most applications of the old Allies rules.

The most cost-effective way to get caught up is probably to buy the aforementioned Assault on Black Reach boxed set, which gets you the current rules (in a handy, reduced-size format rulebook), templates, some dice, and quite a few nice new models, which as I mentioned are designed for easy assembly. Not that I’m a salesman for GW, but it’s genuinely a nice bargain price for what you get. Of course if you’ve got enough old models to make a playable army, using those is a perfectly respectable option too.

Regarding your additional questions about the models:

With most bikes you’re exactly right that that there should be a set of space marine legs spread to stride the bike, which came with it. However, I did a little digging, and I think I may have found the model in question. I’m not sure how many parts the rider comes in, but this may be him:

http://solegends.com/citrt/rt106medicbike.htm

This may be a helpful reference page for your models in general, BTW:
http://solegends.com/citrt/index.htm

Regarding the human bombs, this is a unit which has no modern equivalent, anymore. I saw a playtest version of the Witchhunters (Inquisitorial army, including Sisters of Battle) codex about ten years ago which included rules for them, but they were removed prior to publication. I think the increased modern relevance of this concept has made a company of GW’s current size less willing to feature that particular unit. I’m not sure what the best unit to have them count as would be. Perhaps conscripts, in an IG army. Or in a SM army, maybe servitors for a Techmarine? I’m pretty sure these are rare models now, and if you aren’t too attached to them you might also be able to get a nice price for them on ebay.

The only way to use allies under the present 40k rules are to use the Witchhunters or Daemonhunters codices, which are rules for inquisitorial forces, which have the authority to mix units from their own codex with those from the Imperial Guard and/or Space Marines codices. The other “official” way to mix armies is to play Apocalypse, which is a supplement GW came out with a couple of years ago specifically for large (3000+ pts per side) epic battles. Of course you can always mix armies/change the rules with friends who agree.

You are a master, Mannahnin.

No doubt in my mind. Anyone with even a fragment of intelligence (and you need to have an above-average level of intelligence to even attempt to play 40K and FB consistently, in my opinion) would identify your mastership of 40K by reading your entertaining and informative posts on the subject. I'll therefore understand that you are just being humble, further lifting my view of you as a person of very high regard.

I figured some of the photos were taken at tournaments with all the activity in the background. I haven't had a chance to follow your links as yet, as the filter on this computer is preventing me from doing so for some unexplained reason. I want to, but I'll have to do so later. I'll let you know what I think. (Not that I am any authority on the matter, but I would offer any comment from a friendly, social standpoint or point-of-view. As is the custom, here.)

Rogue Trader: It is, I also believe the first edition. On the inside cover it says 2nd print or something like that, so it would not beyond us to think of it as the 2nd Edition, even though perhaps nothing really changed of any great significance between these early re-prints.

Your game last night: That sounds and looks very impressive. However, starting out again I'm going to find my feet - so to speak - with what I already have, and what I can find for free on the internet. (I'm a struggling writer on a fixed income.) I'm fairly versatile and resourceful so I'll continue to make my small cut&paste efforts to get an army on the table with what I presently have. I see the advantages of what you have outlined, and see myself going that way in the future, if need be. So it's not so much about me preferring what I have, but accepting that what I have is the fastest way for me to start playing with a serviceable army. I've got some old brushes in all the smallest sizes, but I need a fair amount of paint as some of my old tubs have pretty-much dried out.

As mentioned I am unable to access some pages. I wanted to reply to you forthwith, in order to let you know how much your links and information means to me -- as I'm replying to others now too, and didn't want you to think you are somehow being ignored when you are doing so much good for me with your helpful correspondence.

I will reply in a manner you deserve as soon as I change computers. Which will be soon, Mannahnin. Thanks.

Hear from me soon,
Daniel Moszkowicz.


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Bishop of the Blackrose wrote:We Gothikadians of the House on Ministry are not that of servitude but of true freedom from this physical realm. We dwell in the metaphysical, where rhyme and reason are the only logical approach to life. To clarify you interpritation of my most blessed of houses, the name Blackrose is translated (in simplest of forms) beauty in the dark. That which mere men (or trolls in this matter) deem trivial or equivocal, hard to understand. To further clarify, in my understanding that you believed me a female is a statement of jest and I shall take it as such. For in any other matter, I would be lead to believe you've tried to insult me, a definite undertaking for such whose footing in it's own palace is unsure. And if you mean we have been, at one time ruled by women, you are infact correct for love rules all were I'm from, a concept I am to understand is foreign to such as you. Further more, these glass beads you constantly need to refer to are unecessery, for I play not your game. I am that of the quip,my way of life, be the written word or expressed with all the emotion I can muster. Or if you prefer a counter balance, invite the Sarcastic donkey-cave Monster for a beautiful ballad, he who feeds upon the egos and false claims of those self believed to be kings. And for stepping upon your arena, you must give me a moment for I have sullied my bare feet with ignorant dirt. And to your reference of attacking, one does not attack when there is no posing of a threat, but lays at leisure until such need arises. And from what I've seen so far, I believe I shall take a nap. Wake me when you have something, and not the mere pebbles you constitute and boulders.

With no reputable Umpire present but me, to determine the outcome of this contest, and with your apparent failure to draw the logical conclusion from my previous, lengthy reply to you sir... I deem this contest now over and drawn to a satisfactory conclusion.

A "CanvasShake" manoeuvre by the Troll-King of Chatsitea was performed, and with a tentative grasp on his few remaining Glass Beads, and with no real evidence of any kind of shots (Certainly no Flipshots, Spinshots, or Crgshots) having been performed to any warranted noteworthiness -- the Bishop of Blackrose has lost the contest and the victory is The Troll-King of Chatsitea's to claim if he so wishes. What say, I?

I do so - now - claim my victory! Thank you. And thank you for the appearance and some light and little stretches, Bishop of the Blackrose. You have done your House proud, I'm sure.

Point of order: No points will be awarded. No censure will be dealt. No protest or right of reply can be given and as such no objections will be heard. The conclusion of this contest has been satisfactorily and organically found, and now ended!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
To Moderator:

Please notice that member Mr Flidd has brought a level of discussion - or topic - which has no benefit, and as such has no belonging on this forum.

He should therefore be given a warning or reprimand for speaking about something I would have thought wasn't welcome in this polite company.

Thank you for your attention, Mod.

Daniel Moszkowicz.

You can take your "Rule #1" and interpret it all you like, for I have learnt a thing or two about website registration and am ready for any hypocritical manoeverings by pompous Moderators whose only authority in life is to play a God-like figure in cyberspace with members' participation. (I am in no way passing judgement on you, in this instance, by the way, Ketara.) [Then again, you will do what you feel you must, when you feel you must do it, I'm sure.) {Just to let you know that I won't be surprised.}

I'm afraid I was only making a simple friendly recommendation here. I personally couldn't care less what an anonymous person over this invention called the internet makes of me. As a new member, I was making a simple reference to the rules, as others may not be so readily forgiving as I, and politeness is always a boon to those who use it, and is held in much esteem here. Not only by I, but by all members of Dakka-dom, so to speak. 'Be polite' is really not all that interpetational, when you get down to it. At least, not around these parts.

I will take your "second welcome" as you just imposing some kind of authority on me in your pseudo-intellectual manner.

Tsk. And you were doing so well up to this point. Like most of my motives here, you appear to have misread this one as well. I was attempting to subtly reinforce the fact that this area is for the welcome of new dakka-ites. If you wish to play internet games with the other members of Dakka, I suggest making a new post in Off Topic. Not only would that be appropriate for the topic in question(bearing in mind this is a 40K discussion board), you would be far more likely to find opponents to spend your time playing against. Not many of Dakka's intellectuals frequent the welcome board. However, again, in the light of a friendly recommendation, I would advise less snap judgements of other users, and more politeness conducive to friendly forum relations. With such rules do we here at Dakka, and indeed, society at large, rub along better.

To Moderator:

Please notice that member Mr Flidd has brought a level of discussion - or topic - which has no benefit, and as such has no belonging on this forum.

He should therefore be given a warning or reprimand for speaking about something I would have thought wasn't welcome in this polite company.

Thank you for your attention, Mod.

Daniel Moszkowicz.

You think too highly of yourself Daniel.

Lock this, so the real trolls can find this self appointed "King" and send back to the drawing board.

As polite as I try to be, I must withdraw my welcome.

Ah, after reading this thread I do believe and appreciate your meaning. First, I happily welcome you to Dakkadakka and welcome you back to this most amazing of hobbies. In addition I look forward to you familiarizing yourself with the 5th edition rules of Warhammer 40k, primarily because I am eagerly awaiting, and slightly loathing, your future contributions to the YMDC threads.
Entertainment is unfortunately sparse within my work environs.

Is "The Game" like "The Secret"?

If so, I scoff in your general direction...

Intriguing.

Mr-_-Flidd wrote:

To Moderator:

Please notice that member Mr Flidd has brought a level of discussion - or topic - which has no benefit, and as such has no belonging on this forum.

He should therefore be given a warning or reprimand for speaking about something I would have thought wasn't welcome in this polite company.

Thank you for your attention, Mod.

Daniel Moszkowicz.

You think too highly of yourself Daniel.

Lock this, so the real trolls can find this self appointed "King" and send back to the drawing board.

As polite as I try to be, I must withdraw my welcome.

Mr Flidd,

What I think of myself is beside the point as it was you who was being crude.

I found an objection within your pipsqueak attitude which warranted my displeasure, and thus the calling for the Moderator.

You strike me as someone who isn't very welcoming in the first place and you may "withdraw" your welcome all you like, however by so doing you only confirm to me that you are an individual who does this often...Takes things back after giving them freely.

There are names for such as you, but I won't mention them here as I truly am a person of good manners.

Cheers,
Daniel Moszkowicz. (The Troll-King of Chatsitea.)


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Orkestra wrote:Intriguing.

Very good!

But perhaps I sense you could have gone with this: Intriguing...

A little different, but I understood your intention.


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Alpharius wrote:Is "The Game" like "The Secret"?

If so, I scoff in your general direction...

What do you think, Alpharius? I mean honestly, I drew attention to it and then Vindicator #9 asked specifically about it.

Is it a secret, or even after knowing what it is do you think it continues to remain as such?

...Well no, it's no secret in my opinion, however you will think what you may, and do all the "scoffing" you need too, to vanquish me somehow in your mind.

Might I suggest though, that beyond just "scoffing" - if you do decide to go that way -- might you simply ask yourself questions and then challenge me over certain aspects of my posts. Like, you be the challenger and I the master, for instance. You know, the way it's going now.

Anyway, I will respect whatever you decide. And, may I say that you did a splendid job with finally getting my flag properly attributed to my place on the globe. Thank you, Alpharius.

Daniel Moszkowicz. (The Troll-King of Chatsitea.)


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Lunchmoney wrote:Ah, after reading this thread I do believe and appreciate your meaning. First, I happily welcome you to Dakkadakka and welcome you back to this most amazing of hobbies. In addition I look forward to you familiarizing yourself with the 5th edition rules of Warhammer 40k, primarily because I am eagerly awaiting, and slightly loathing, your future contributions to the YMDC threads.
Entertainment is unfortunately sparse within my work environs.

Thank you for your welcome, Lunchmoney. And thank you for getting my meaning. There's really not that much to it. As I say, it is only by such confident efforts that it may be explored and understood further.

I'm really happy and glad to have returned to these games. Mannahnin's assistance so far has reinforced my early enthusiasm and I agree that it is a most amazing of hobbies. "5th Edition rules", I must confess, are still a way off in the distance, unfortunately. Simply because I am refamiliarizing myself with the old rules first.

That you are both "eagerly awaiting" and "slightly loathing" what future contributions I may bring to the discussion in the place you have referenced, perhaps suggests that this state of stasis - if you will - is a frequent occurence with you and therefore limits your time for entertainment within your working day. Perhaps, your job is so important in our society that by taking prominence in your life, other people can - by being allowed to - function properly, safely, or someway other which is just as important.

I take it from your speak that this kind of discourse is de rigueur at this YMDC, shortened. I will have to investigate further.

Again, thanks for your welcome and understanding.

Daniel Moszkowicz.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

Ketara wrote:

You can take your "Rule #1" and interpret it all you like, for I have learnt a thing or two about website registration and am ready for any hypocritical manoeverings by pompous Moderators whose only authority in life is to play a God-like figure in cyberspace with members' participation. (I am in no way passing judgement on you, in this instance, by the way, Ketara.) [Then again, you will do what you feel you must, when you feel you must do it, I'm sure.) {Just to let you know that I won't be surprised.}

I'm afraid I was only making a simple friendly recommendation here. I personally couldn't care less what an anonymous person over this invention called the internet makes of me. As a new member, I was making a simple reference to the rules, as others may not be so readily forgiving as I, and politeness is always a boon to those who use it, and is held in much esteem here. Not only by I, but by all members of Dakka-dom, so to speak. 'Be polite' is really not all that interpetational, when you get down to it. At least, not around these parts.

I will take your "second welcome" as you just imposing some kind of authority on me in your pseudo-intellectual manner.

Tsk. And you were doing so well up to this point. Like most of my motives here, you appear to have misread this one as well. I was attempting to subtly reinforce the fact that this area is for the welcome of new dakka-ites. If you wish to play internet games with the other members of Dakka, I suggest making a new post in Off Topic. Not only would that be appropriate for the topic in question(bearing in mind this is a 40K discussion board), you would be far more likely to find opponents to spend your time playing against. Not many of Dakka's intellectuals frequent the welcome board. However, again, in the light of a friendly recommendation, I would advise less snap judgements of other users, and more politeness conducive to friendly forum relations. With such rules do we here at Dakka, and indeed, society at large, rub along better.

Dear Ketara,

That you have finally decided to dissect my comments - to you - to this extent, only confirms - to me - that I have gotten out of your way like I said I would, and you are just shadow-boxing with the Chuck Norris character you so much favour.

Good day,
Daniel Moszkowicz. (The Troll-King of Chatsitea.)

Dear Ketara,

That you have finally decided to dissect my comments - to you - to this extent, only confirms - to me - that I have gotten out of your way like I said I would, and you are just shadow-boxing with the Chuck Norris character you so much favour.

*shrugs*

I was but trying to aid your integration into our delightful community here with some friendly advice. But, as you will sir. You will doubtless find few new opponents in the depths of the welcome board.


*dons cap and leaves*

Ketara wrote:

Dear Ketara,

That you have finally decided to dissect my comments - to you - to this extent, only confirms - to me - that I have gotten out of your way like I said I would, and you are just shadow-boxing with the Chuck Norris character you so much favour.

*shrugs*

I was but trying to aid your integration into our delightful community here with some friendly advice. But, as you will sir. You will doubtless find few new opponents in the depths of the welcome board.


*dons cap and leaves*

..."Shrugs, dons cap and leaves". Yeah, and walks toward a place which serves alcohol.

To become a worthy opponent in my eyes, Ketara; you must first bring something to the contest which warrants a follow-up intriguing machination of psychological or philosophical proportions, and not just this performing of some lab-rat experiment of cutting.

Thank you for leaving after replacing a cap you must have initially taken off in my company. An honourable and well-mannered thing to do, by the way. May you enjoy your alcoholic beverage, and perhaps raise a toast to...

Daniel Moszkowicz. (The Troll-King of Chatsitea.)

Hi Mannahnin,

Your own armies:
"Baltimore 07 Army Display"... I really enjoyed looking at this particular army. The lighting in the photo was really good and that allowed me to get up-close and personal with a fine army which was painted and displayed in a proud and imposing manner; like they're ready for the coming slaughter they're going to unleash on any and all opposition. Very tight and very sophisticated. They looked the real business to me. I voted and gave you a 7 and an 8, respectively. Although I probably should have gone one point higher on each, now that I remeber them.

"1500pt Fallen"... I found a little less imposing as they're overall structure or grouping wasn't right compared to your "Baltimore 07 Army Display."

"Children of degradation"... I could not vote for as the lighting of the phtoto was quite poor. Putting so much effort into painting and displaying an army it is easy to overlook such fundamental things such as lighting of the photograph. I'm responsible for such failures, also. (As you may witness with my offerings in the gallery.)

"Wood Elves"... likewise, I could not vote for on the grounds of lighting issues.

Anyway, who won the most recent battle? Your own Chaos Space Marines or your opponent's Space Marines?

I'm willing to wager that with the combination of your Prince and Sorcerer's psychic powers you got the better of him early by way of a kind of “Black Crusade”, and ended-up winning the contest. Although, since he is your friend it could be that he was ready for what were likely to be your intelligent surprises and tricks, and so he held his Librarian Squad close to his chest after probably drawing a lot of your attention with his Chaplain Squad.

Looking at your army list compared to his, I find it difficult to accept that they both total 1850pts each, which makes me suddenly think to myself that I want a Chaos Space Marine army if I'm going to get all that for 1850pts. Very impressive army, Mannahnin! No wonder you have improved consistently over the last few years of competition. Although, your start to this year suggests – to me – that either you were experimenting with a new army, or with it being a “GT” competition it was somehow larger and more prestigious, and as such a fair result in the end?

In regard to what I remember of playing with the "Rogue Trader" rulebook, you are correct to think that the battles involved “smaller skirmishes”. In those days (early-nineties) we were more interested in arena-style battles between two-to-four players presenting Heroes or favoured monsters. Like cage-fights on a Blood-Bowl platform with a pastiche of rules from a number of different games. (I'm sure I have a reference to point too, somewhere in a copy of White Dwarf, if you are interested?) "Smaller skirmishes" is certainly the way I remember it, in any case, as the concept of small battles was the accepted and favoured one in those days across a range of different games. And yeah, games of 40K usually took a long time. I'm not sure I would prefer it though as I don't know what the alternative - 5th Edition - is like. However, I hope to find some players locally, who will be understanding of my rusty-ways and accommodating in relation to finding the common ground around the rules I'm refreshing myself with, and what will likely to be these newer rules you have mentioned. I don't really mind how difficult it'll be to find to some players locally, so long as they are decent...normal people whom play with good manners. You know what I mean?

http://www.dakkadakka.com/core/gallery-viewimage.jsp?i=92924

Perhaps, I can use your understanding of what some players “miss” in “some of the elements which have been removed” in my post or notice for seeking such players. Sydney University once had a gaming club and I'm just across the Harbour Bridge from the grounds so perhaps I'll see if I can start out there. Uni students - or College students as you would know them in the UsofA - are usually fairly decent and good people in general.

The most “cost-effective” way to get playing with an army on the table is to not spend any money, Mannahnin. Although, I appreciate you saying that my going with enough “models to make a playable army” is a “perfectly respectable option.” I hope my eventual understanding of the old rules again, is sufficient enough to gain respect from my eventual opponents.

I appreciate you researching the bike very much, Mannahnin. Also, the link you provided nearly rocked me as I was suddenly overcome with sheer enjoyment and happiness. “The stuff of legends” is a fantastic site for reference purposes, and I appreciate very much you pointing me in that direction. It inspired me, and I remembered that I had some White Dwarf magazines which I should search for and find to track more things down.

The bike is turning out to be a real problem for two reasons. Firstly, I found a Space Marine with chainsaw upraised whom had his legs apart appropriately, and he actually sat in the seat of the bike fairly well and comfortably, if a little strangely as neither of his hands are in a position that they may be placed on the handlebars -- as in the image you referenced. Turns out he is a "Marine 03 Medic" -- again thanks to you for linking me with that database of information. So, a Medic, just not the right one.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/92926-Medic%20on%20Bike%3F.html
http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/92927-Medic%20beside%20Medi%27c%20bike%21.html

Now, the light on the front windshield-like screen looks a little larger on the "Marine Medic 02's" bike if I am not mistaken, (could be an illusion caused by the way it was painted) and I found this item and it definitely looks – to me – to be suitable enough to suggest that it could be the one to belong as you suspected, when you said, “Space Marines still have bike-mounted units and characters, though IG don't.”

http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/92930-Different%20angle.html

However, the matter is complicated a little further, for I have an Imperial Guard which sits and therefore fits perfectly with his lower-half, but whose torso - and as such his head - doesn't match the "Imperial Army Medic 01". Certainly, being a two-part model I can glue him in such a way as to give him a suitably aggressive and low-profile position on the bike. It could turn out that it is the "Imperial Army Medic 01's" lower-half only, but the boots are difficult to distinguish to reach an authoritive conclusion. Also, I could probably convert the "Marine 03 Medic" -- to become a bastardized form of the "Marine Medic 02". Not sure what's going to happen with this one. The bike and rider, just from reading the caption above them on the same page, suggests that this "Medic on Bike" has a decent profile, which makes me pretty-sure that I'll definitely want to include this model in my army, one way or another.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/92928-IG%20Medic%20on%20bike%3F.html
http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/92929-Semi-complete%20bike.html

Human Bombs...Wow! ...Is what I thought when I read what you had to say, initially. They certainly have some history. Shame that the rules for them, "were removed prior to publication" for the "playtest version" of the codex you mentioned. Your suggestions on how to include them are two options, but I think you are not certain or perhaps unsure, and if I can find a way to include them than they could prove to be quite a thorn against my opponents, if I play them correctly. I'm not that interested in selling them in all honesty for as you say, they're rare, and who doesn't want a unique army? However, I think I am missing a complete squad for there are ten sets of arms – which I think belong to them?? - and I have so far found only three models. I'm hoping to find more...

http://www.dakkadakka.com/core/gallery-viewimage.jsp?i=92925

Mixing units in the form of allies, I would never have known without your information, so – yet again – thanks, Mannahnin. Inquisitorial Forces sound pretty versatile, and I like that about them, so this may very-well be the way to go for me (+ 50% chance of psychic powers = fair lethality if I roll well). Yeah, that is likely to be the way I'll go, Mannahnin. I'm further impressed! A great and fitting suggestion. Or are they not regarded as very cool nowadays? I don't care if they aren't, just curious after I saw something on the forum suggesting they weren't. Perhaps I'm reading too much into it.

The Goblin is one of three models I own, which are my oldest. They're "citadel minatures," I remember, and as you can see the bases were also made from lead. I guess that's why I have an affinity for lead models. They were the first, and plastic feels so generic in comparison. You also feel like you're getting what you paid for. A currency by weight, if you will.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/92931-Goblin.html

Which leads me to yet another two questions: What's on offer nowadays with respect to Inquisitorial Forces models', Mannahnin? Is there anything I should keep an eye-out for, or try and somehow order from somewhere, when I w'll eventually have to do so in order to join my armies under current rules? I've looked at the GW site and the Deamonhunters have caught my attention, suitably. Are they overated or underated?

Best Wishes,
Daniel Moszkowicz.

...

Velkommen to Dakka.

Beware the Bear Cavalry that sweeps through Dakka every so often, it makes dozens of users never come to this site ever again.

Karon wrote:Velkommen to Dakka.

Beware the Bear Cavalry that sweeps through Dakka every so often, it makes dozens of users never come to this site ever again.

Hi Karon,

Thank you for your Norwegian welcome, and thank you for the warning.

The "Bear Cavalry", whether those who jokingly have the right to "bear arms" or those present in an "infamous demotivational poster" -- hardly frightens me at all, in all honesty. (The more likely reason I would not return to this website is if the Moderators like to submit to their inner desire to play cyber-gods.) In fact, if the "Bear Cavalry" do "sweep" down I would hope they drop their weapons and instead select Glass Beads from the felt bag Hesse is holding to warrant any attention by me, and my wise reckoning.

Therefore, I can only conclude that I welcome the appearance of the welcoming, "Bear Cavalry".

Cheers,
Daniel Moszkowicz. (The Troll-King of Chatsitea.)

...

Hi Daniel,

Sorry about the delay replying. I was away at Adepticon and then busy catching up at work and with the wife once I got back.

Thank you for the comments on my figures. I’m far from an adept painter, but I’m always proud to field a fully painted force, and to field the best looking one I can. In my opinion the visual aspect of the game is a critical component of its appeal. I’m sorry some of the pictures aren’t better-lit. As I mentioned, many of my photos are taken at tournaments, where gamers are at the mercy of the lighting in the hotel or other venue. Once you start reading tournament reports or discussions about venues, you may occasionally see references to the lighting, as it definitely impacts our ability to properly appreciate people’s painting, and for judges to give proper credit to people’s efforts in the painting/army appearance portion of the competition. You may also see discussion among tournament players of the value of choosing a bright-colored paint scheme, which catches the eye and in which details are harder to miss. My own armies are generally on the darker/more realistic end of the spectrum, with colors which appeal to me, but certainly don’t show to best advantage in poorer light. I definitely make an effort to light better when photographing at home, though I don’t do that much. There are one or two great guides to that in the Modeling & Painting forum, and in the Articles section of the site.

In my recent practice game I managed to win, through the usual combination of careful play and reasonable luck. You are correct that we were both experimenting with new army lists (for Adepticon) as well, and I think mine was less of a break from my past ones, whereas my friend was trying more new options, which gives me a bit of an experience advantage in regards to what I was using. My list does look a bit more numerous initially, though when you break it down, the armies are actually of similar size- mine coming out to 50 total models including 5 vehicles, and Jamie’s being 53 models including 4 vehicles (or 5 if you count the Thunderfire cannon, which uses somewhat similar rules). Space Marines also have a special rule which allows them to split squads of 10 men into units of 5 at the start of the game which operate independently thereafter, and this gives them additional flexibility depending on the mission/scenario, which we normally determine randomly at the start of the game. So we were pretty evely-matched.

The way you describe playing Rogue Trader does seem familiar to me as similar to how many people started, or at least how veterans of the earlier rules describe playing it, as I did not start until later. I did read admiringly about the game in White Dwarf magazine at the time, though, when I was a young gamer with the interest but not the funds or interested friends to participate. I have an old issue with the rules for Human Bombs, for example, which is why I’m mildly familiar with them.

As you have accurately surmised, the key element in what rules, size of game, and style of play you use is going to be the local availability of pleasant and like-minded gamers. Joining an existing group is usually easiest, but will normally require accommodating to their play preferences and existing choice of game/s. I suspect that at a college or university you’re more likely to find players who use more current rules, whereas if you make connections with an older group of wargamers who play multiple games, and have prior experience with Rogue Trader, that they are more likely to be either actively playing it or interested in giving it another go. But both are good options, and that is certainly not a complete or exhaustive list of possible gaming partners or circumstances.

I’m glad you like Stuff of Legends. It engendered similar feelings of joy for me when I first discovered it.

As far as your bike conundrum goes, I’m afraid I can’t be of much more help, as I’m really unfamiliar with the Rogue Trader rules in general, and those for medics on bikes or Imperial Guard models on bikes specifically. If you do at some point decide to try using it in some capacity in the current rules, I’d be happy to offer suggestions to that end.

Likewise with the human bombs. If you’re using the Rogue Trader rules, obviously they still have a place. If you decide to try the new rules, the models would either be used to represent some current unit (using the “counts-as” rule), or you could conceivably make new rules for them if your opponents were inclined to be open to such experimentation. One point on that- a big virtue of GW games is their wide presence and knowledge among gamers. The ability to meet a potential opponent at a gaming store or other venue and the relatively high likelihood that they play 40k, as opposed to most other wargames which aren’t as universally-popular, and play a pickup game immediately, with minimal preparation or negotiation. Of course to maximize the ability to do this, many players prefer to stick as close to the official rules as possible, so as to have as much compatibility as possible with strangers. This can lead to a sometimes-regrettable closed-mindedness about experimentation with new rules/units a player has created. I also think they’re a really neat unit, with some great history, but obviously the concept is a potentially-controversial one, especially for a company which does also cater to younger gamers.

Regarding allies, to my understanding this was a standard and accepted feature of the older editions of the game like Rogue Trader. As evinced by your earlier comment about understanding that IG and SM could be included in the same army, which is usually not the case currently. Under the current official rules it is almost exclusively confined to Inquisitorial armies and Apocalypse games.

I do think that an Inquisitorial force (either Witchhunters or Daemonhunters, though you can mix the two as well) would be a great choice for you if you were to try playing the current rules. Both of those codices were actually released a few years back, when GW was designing codices in a somewhat more customizable mold, with more interesting and odd pieces of wargear and options than they’re presently doing. Though both books are still compatible with the newer edition, the army lists have a flexibility and degree of customization that harkens back a bit to the older rules, even referencing some old concepts from Rogue Trader. If you saw something negative about them on a forum it may be related to the fact that it’s been some time since they were updated, and many players get restive or discontented with GW when their army goes some years without such an update. Sometimes parts of their rules become outmoded, or seem outmatched against newer and shinier books and models, which may have been given impressive new rules. That said, they’re both certainly competitive armies, and both have some really excellent options and units.

As far as currently-available models for them, you’re on exactly the right track checking the GW site. Both the Daemonhunters and Witchhunters sections have models specifically for those inquisitorial armies. Though with the use of their rules for allies, specific units from either Space Marine or Imperial Guard armies can also be incorporated, giving you access to an even wider range. I don’t think I can recommend anything specifically to keep an eye out for at this point. There are a lot of nice models and units, and often the preference lies in one’s own aesthetic sense and/or preferred style of play. For example, I love the Grey Knight Terminator models in the Daemonhunters list. But they are fairly expensive both in terms of real money and in terms of points, and I often find myself preferring more, individually-cheaper units in competitive play. I think if I were making a Daemonhunters army I’d definitely try them, but I’d design the rest of the army to compensate a bit for the points cost of that elite unit. Once you are playing some games, or have bought a current codex and are experimenting with army lists, we can get more specific.

That old lead goblin’s a great little figure. Definitely a very old one if it is GW (which it appears to be, though I’m not an expert on the old 80s stuff), since it doesn’t have a tab under the feet to go into a slotted plastic base. The “pre-slotta” models are some of the oldest, from what I understand. I know a lot of older gamers who have the same affinity for metal models. I’m not immune to it myself, though as a player and painter I prefer the customizability and durability of plastic models. Which are easier to cut and convert, and tend to bounce better and have their paint chip less when dropped onto or from the table top.

Hi Mannahnin,

You do me great favour and honor by responding with such impressive authoritativeness.

One's primary interest in life should always be the family. Work...not so much! (Ha-ha!) I appreciate that you apologized for the delay in replying but it wasn't necessary. Nevertheless, I am grateful that you did. Thanks.

I agree that having a painted army is a "critical component" of the game's "appeal". In my younger days, we usually played with unpainted armies yet admired the painted armies we saw in publications such as 'White Dwarf' almost obsessively. It absolutely doesn't have to be the best painted army in the world, but to have a consistent colour scheme throughout an army completed down to the last man should be the aim of every serious player. I'll be sure to check-out the "one or two great guides in the Modeling & Painting forum, and in the Articles section of the site." Thanks.

You won, I knew it.

"Space Marines also have a special rule which allows them to split squads of 10 men into units of 5 at the start of the game which operate independently thereafter, and this gives them additional flexibility depending on the mission/scenario".

I remember reading this somewhere recently too, and now that you confirm it to me, it strikes me as a suitable option to - what will be - my old-style of play. I guess 40K has been so finely tuned by rules revisions up till now, that Jamie's and your armies can be so different, yet similar in points value; even down to the amount of models facing-off at table's eye-level. Incidentally, I was looking over, what has happened with Mordheim over the years, and this game has gone in the opposite direction to 40K after GW dropped it from their business-interests. That is survives at all is only down to a fairly small fan base of hardcore gamers. And still the rules aren't what they should be, I think.

Looking for local players is still a while off, but as you infer there is a lot of possibilites and opportunities available now, whether that be with the 5th Ed or old rules. A pick-up game at my local hobby-game store under new rules, may very well be the easiest way for me to dive in. Though, I see myself playing against myself at home a few times, before making a fool out of myself in front of strangers.

I see now, that due to the fact that I have some really fine SM minatures I'll probably be going with them as my first army. The bike will just have to be the SM bike if and when I find the correct and necessary profile for it. So, I may still request the particular number of that "White Dwarf" edition with the 'Human Bomb' rules in it, from you -- however it just won't be any time soon.

From what I've investigated so far, the Daemonhunters may indeed be incorporated into an allied army but not with multiple allies. So it's either Daemonhunters with SM or IG. Not both, I think?? Daemonhunters with SM is giving me goosbumps just imagining them together, in any case. I'm really excited. This should definitely be my first fully-painted and itemised army. The Grey Knights sound awesome, I'll make sure to study them closely. Codex next, got it. I'm sure we'll be continuing to chat here about those details.

I understand that the plastic models bounce better as they do not chip and the paint therefore doesn't fleck, and eventually flake off. An important factor when so much time has gone into the painstaking efforts of painting. An important point, no doubt.

I hope I haven't missed anything. I don't think you need me to repeat how appreciative I am of your replies with assistance to me. You have truly made me feel very welcome here at Dakka Dakka, and again I wish to thank you for it. No doubt we'll be chatting again soon. I won't be at an internet terminal over the coming holiday, so if I don't reply, please know that I am not ignoring you.

I look forward to seeing your Adepticon10 result on your siganture line, soon. I'm sure you improved again.

Thanks for your words on the Goblin. I thought you'd like him.

Have a happy and peaceful Easter holiday, Mannahnin.

Best Wishes,
Daniel M.

P.S. Obama is great for you guys. Well done with your democracy, again.

Ketara wrote:To my knowledge, Chuck Norris is the highest ranked player of the game.

Welcome to Dakka.

Chuck Norris is the highest ranked player in the game!

Welcome to Dakka!

The Acolyte wrote:

Ketara wrote:To my knowledge, Chuck Norris is the highest ranked player of the game.

Welcome to Dakka.

Chuck Norris is the highest ranked player in the game!

Welcome to Dakka!

Yeah, we've been down that road already.

This thread's already far enough out there.

No need to lead it further astray.

Huh. I thought I had posted a response last night, but I must have lost it due to a computer issue I had.

Anyway, to summarize, I had a great time and did fairly well at Adepticon. Dropped a couple of places from last year in the Championship, did only middling in the Gladiator (my first year in that event), but gained about a dozen places in the Team Tournament, which was great, as I put a good deal of effort into organizing and coordinating the team. It was a great time. Over a thousand gamers hanging out and playing a large number of fun games in a nice hotel. One of my favorite ways to spend a weekend.

I think your thoughts on starting points for reentering the game are good ones. Playing games against yourself at home is often a good way to get a better feel for the rules and the interactions of units on the table, and helps organize the models you’ve got. Picking up a codex or two which interests you, to allow you to familiarize yourself with the rules and (again) organize the models you have into a usable force. And potentially starting with pickup games with strangers, if you don’t immediately find a welcoming local wargaming club. I think you’ll really like the Daemonhunters codex. It has lots of flavor and options.

As for the bike, if you have at least three, you could field them as a unit of bikers under the Space Marine rules. If you only have one, you can still field it, as an HQ character mounted on a bike. The bike gives improved mobility and Toughness, which are great for a close combat-inclined character. Space Marine Chaplains, or Captains (often armed with a Relic Blade) are likely options.

I’ll be happy to give more advice here, though I don’t often check the Introductions forum, so feel free to shoot me a PM if I don’t respond to something within a day or two.

If you want opinions, suggestions, and feedback from other members as well, good likely spots to post are the 40k Tactics forum (for on-table strategies and use & configuration of particular units), the 40k Army Lists forum (for discussions of a complete army list, once you get one together), and 40k Discussions (for more general inquiries about playing and miniatures). While the large majority of 40k discussion on this site is about the current game and models, there are more than a few members who are familiar with older editions and models and who would no doubt be happy to give feedback related to your use of them as well.

Hello!

The Acolyte wrote:

Ketara wrote:To my knowledge, Chuck Norris is the highest ranked player of the game.

Welcome to Dakka.

Chuck Norris is the highest ranked player in the game!

Welcome to Dakka!

Please re-read this thread to gain an idea or ideas of how this discussion has proceeded.

Daniel Moszkowicz. (The Troll-King of Chatsitea.)


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Alpharius wrote:

The Acolyte wrote:

Ketara wrote:To my knowledge, Chuck Norris is the highest ranked player of the game.

Welcome to Dakka.

Chuck Norris is the highest ranked player in the game!

Welcome to Dakka!

Yeah, we've been down that road already.

This thread's already far enough out there.

No need to lead it further astray.

A valid point. Thank you!

Daniel Moszkowicz. (The Troll-King of Chatsitea.)



Automatically Appended Next Post:

Hi Mannahnin,

Thanks for getting back to me. I hope you had an enjoyable Easter Holiday period.

I must say I expected better from you at Adepticon. Never mind, you had fun and attributed success in other areas which is good.

"Over a thousand gamers hanging out and playing a large number of fun games in a nice hotel." You Yanks know how to do it, that's for sure. I am looking at "Lords of Terra 2010" here in Sydney as a possible return event for me, but the Anzac Club - whilst just down the road from me - is hardly the kind of event you participated in recently.

The codices are just around the corner, I'm thinking next 'pay-day': SM and Daemonhunters, for sure!

The bike has been put into reserves, for now (Backburner if you will). I have found a nice amount of SM Chaplains, a Dreadnought, another figure I cannot place -- and started experimenting with color (USA spelling, thank you) schemes. Very excited with the fact that I can begin to see the outlines of a formidable army. Many thanks go to you, but you know that already. Thanks for pointing-out the other forums on this site and for offering to give feedback in the future, and the option of welcoming to give you a P.M.

You are a man of high regard in my view, and this website is very lucky to have you as a member and Mod (I only just noticed that.)

Best Wishes,
Daniel M.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

Byte wrote:Hello!

Hell-o!

Daniel Moszkowicz. (The Troll-King of Chatsitea.)