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Be careful - someone who's a tactical genius will claim you've just said that 'nids are more powerful than IG, SW.

I love the new codex. I've never lost with it.


Clarification - I've lost games by points or score, sure, but I've typically had fun every time. Isn't that the point?

Aduro wrote:I love the new `Nid book. And I think the Pyrovore is really good at what it does, which is kill infantry. I just don't think you need to take non-Scoring units that only specialize in killing Infantry because the rest of the book does that so well without trying typically.

Ding we have a winner.

It isn't strictly speaking that the pyrovore is bad (although for its pts it kind of is) because it does have a niche. spod and kill infantry in cover.

Its just that a) that is a really specific niche b) lots of other things can kill infantry and are also more pts efficient/better at it/scoring and c) it competes in an elite slot with most of the best units in the dex.

Ergo a turd.

Nurglitch wrote:

Vepr wrote:Biovores. They stay around all game and don't take up an elite slot and they soften up troops in cover just fine and they are cheaper than pyrovores because you don't have to pod them. You can try to frost the turd cake that is the pyrovore all you want but in the end it is still a turd cake.

Your cunning and persuasive argument may have changed my mind, but it was your reputation for tactical genius that got my attention.

Do you want to light the candle on the cake or should I?


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nosferatu1001 wrote:Be careful - someone who's a tactical genius will claim you've just said that 'nids are more powerful than IG, SW.

On one side we have the ardent sunshine pumper. Everything is candy coated sunshine with a hug! Give them crap they will frost it and say it tastes like cheese cake. Synergy!!! Give it some more time, you are not using it right, maybe if you took 6 of them.... I love everything even cancer!

On the opposite side we have the pessimist poo stainer. The glass is not half empty, it has been smashed and the remaining liquid caught on fire so we are all going to die. Did I mention GW sets fires to orphanages with flaming kittens and they hate my army.

I just got my hate mail from GW... anyways how is your cheese cake today?

I share the thought with a lot of people that the Carnifex is still scary but only just.
A 'fex with even just 2 sets of Scything Talons and Bio-plasma will scare the crap out of my PM's (well maybe if my Daemon Princes aren't around...)
It's just that that carnifex is around 200 points and for that a Trygon can do more.
The problem I see with it is just that there's so many other good choices for around the points of a Carnifex (well maybe except Old One Eye.../puke)

I ran 2 in ard boyz, with twin devo. do you know what 24 twinlinked shots, 10 attacks at str 10 at I4, on the charge. yeah they don't suck. They work with a MC wall type lists

Gwar! wrote:Carnifexes are Hilarious. Was playing a game last night, dude was running Podding Dual Talon Carnifexes.

One Came in turn 2, it died to 15 Krak Missiles from my Fangs.

The other 2 came in turn 3. Managed to alphastrike 1 of them with a single Long Fang unit and reduce the other to 1 wound, which it lost to a heavy bolter.

I felt sorry for my opponent :(

Christ, if I were playing someone that terrible(like a clone of myself) I'd be feeling sorry for them too.

As has been pointed out many times before, it's not so much that units in the codex are bad, it's more that there is so much redundancy in roles between units that it just doesn't make sense to take em from a points/FoC efficientcy standpoint.

I’m starting to think that players who complain about the carnifex aren’t as tactically minded as they’d like to think. I suspect this response will get flamed but the issue boils down to a few simple points.

1. Sorry, the carnifex is no longer the point-and-click stomp your opponent into the ground solo superstar it was in the previous codex. Get used to it. The current Nid codex is here to stay for a long time.

2. The Tyranofex and Trygon now tend to fill the role that the carnefex used to. Individually, they tend to perform more efficiently as gun platforms or individual close combat “problem solvers”.

3. The carnefex tends to perform more efficiently as a brood. Its particular efficiencies are; AV14 killer, multi-wound model killer, and army spearhead. Its capacity to be fielded in a brood makes it both more efficient and survivable than both the Tyranofex and Trygon in the capacities I mentioned.

From an anecdotal perspective, I use a brood of 3 dual talon fexes in my list and I have yet to loose in my extremely competitive 40k environment. I use the brood as a spearhead that forces my opponent into choosing between allowing the monstrosities to have their way with the battlefield and focusing on the rest of my army or focusing on the spearhead and allowing the rest of my army to do as it pleases. This forces a commitment on behalf of my opponent that I can adapt to and exploit.

Like I mentioned before I still like the Devil Fex. I generally run one or two of them when I am not running Biovores. The full brood of scything fexs I am not as sold on though because they end up costing as much as 2 Trygon Primes. The Trygons are harder to hide but in the end they have synapse and shadow and the same amount of wounds with decent shooting attacks and the big one which is fleet. The brood of 3 scything fexs is not bad I have just found the 2 Trygon Primes better in my experience for all comers lists. I also end up playing wolves a good bit which makes the decision easier also because of the dual priests. I have not had a chance to play a brood of fex in a larger game though so that might make a difference also.