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Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka




Manchester UK

LunaHound wrote:
Albatross wrote:

Meanwhile, back in the real world... We're talking about a guy whose wife is African-American, and whose kids are mixed-race. We're also talking about an employer who said vile things about African-American customers. What on earth gives you the right to act all superior and say stuff like 'I think you should hear what his reasons are'? Reasons? What possible reasons can you think of that would make such behaviour acceptable?

I'm all ears.


Well, eyes.

Albatross , im not sure if you know this or not... Im not caucasian. If anyone know racist , i have experience it myself first hand.
Im not acting superior , you are very stubborn or ignorant to say that. I have say it earlier , and i will say it again.


Yes, of course I know you're not caucasian - that's why I said if some made asian racial slurs in front of you, you probably wouldn't accept 'I'm having a bad day' as an excuse.
And you ARE acting superior, you're portraying an image of Christ-like even-handedness that no real human possesses. It's false. But hey, on the internet everyone is ten feet tall. Calling me ignorant for simply disagreeing is further evidence of your superior attitude.

 Cheesecat wrote:
 purplefood wrote:
I find myself agreeing with Albatross far too often these days...

I almost always agree with Albatross, I can't see why anyone wouldn't.


 Crazy_Carnifex wrote:

Okay, so the male version of "Cougar" is now officially "Albatross".
 
   
Made in ca
Avatar of the Bloody-Handed God





Inactive

Albatross wrote:I'm personally waiting for you to enlighten me as to when the use of the N-word by a white man to describe people of colour is acceptable.


It's got nothing to do with a 'hair-trigger' reaction to percieved racism - I have no particular desire to 'nail' anyone, racist or otherwise. All I'm saying is that if I was in FITTZ's shoes I would be SUPER pissed off. In the real world people don't encounter that situation and think to themselves 'perhaps he's just having a bad day'.

feth his bad day. You don't say that word.


Wow , you arnt reading what i said at all albatross.

1) Have i ever said Fitzz shouldnt be this mad? Nope , so stop blabbing about that

2) Have i ever said someone having a bad day can warrant the usage of racism? Nope

3) What i HAVE said many times which i will repeat again. If i want to go insane on someone , i'll atleast find out what happened first.
This has NOTHING to do with me been goodie good good , has NOTHING to do with me wanting to be superior ( w/e that means )

What it DOES mean to me is , when i want to hate someone , i want to hate them for what they deserve.
I feel like if i just go all out just because im "justified" to , then that makes me a bad person as well.

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Made in us
Lord of the Fleet





Seneca Nation of Indians

I can beat it: I reported my boss for selling the company's secrets to it's competitors.

I was fired for violating the chain of command. All complaints about this person were to go through this person.

I now read in the papers that my ex employer is suing my former boss, who, it turns out, was stealing from the company for months before I reported it, and for months after, before she was forced to resign.


Fate is in heaven, armor is on the chest, accomplishment is in the feet. - Nagao Kagetora
 
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka




Manchester UK

LunaHound wrote:
Albatross wrote:I'm personally waiting for you to enlighten me as to when the use of the N-word by a white man to describe people of colour is acceptable.


It's got nothing to do with a 'hair-trigger' reaction to percieved racism - I have no particular desire to 'nail' anyone, racist or otherwise. All I'm saying is that if I was in FITTZ's shoes I would be SUPER pissed off. In the real world people don't encounter that situation and think to themselves 'perhaps he's just having a bad day'.

feth his bad day. You don't say that word.


Wow , you arnt reading what i said at all albatross.

1) Have i ever said Fitzz shouldnt be this mad? Nope , so stop blabbing about that

2) Have i ever said someone having a bad day can warrant the usage of racism? Nope

3) What i HAVE said many times which i will repeat again. If i want to go insane on someone , i'll atleast find out what happened first.
This has NOTHING to do with me been goodie good good , has NOTHING to do with me wanting to be superior ( w/e that means )

What it DOES mean to me is , when i want to hate someone , i want to hate them for what they deserve.
I feel like if i just go all out just because im "justified" to , then that makes me a bad person as well.


Backtrack all you like. What you said was:

I think you should atleast hear out what his reasons are.

It's there in black and white. Unambiguous. You want to know his reasons for using racist language to describe black customers. Have you any idea how stupid that sounds to an adult? That you would want to know his reasons directly implies that there are circumstances under which his use of that language would be acceptable - otherwise you wouldn't care what his reasons are. That is the most basic of basic reasoning. Even a child could understand that.

Now, it is my belief that there is nothing that the guy could say which would excuse his behaviour, nothing that had happened to him that was so bad that he would get away with speaking like that. You can equivocate if you like, but all you're really doing is enabling racists if you do so.

 Cheesecat wrote:
 purplefood wrote:
I find myself agreeing with Albatross far too often these days...

I almost always agree with Albatross, I can't see why anyone wouldn't.


 Crazy_Carnifex wrote:

Okay, so the male version of "Cougar" is now officially "Albatross".
 
   
Made in ca
Avatar of the Bloody-Handed God





Inactive

Albatross wrote:Backtrack all you like. What you said was:

I think you should atleast hear out what his reasons are.

You still dont get it do you , hearing his reason have nothing to do with his boss.
I'll paste what i said to fitzz with some edit with better grammar.


" I agree , rage and hate against your boss is warranted.

However , im just concerned because We as human beings have the habit of going all out "because we can"
and sometimes that makes us the bad guys when we over do it.

Attempting to understand the situation was never about defending your boss.
Is to defend ourselves to not be consumed by hate and rage. "

Hence i told you over and over again albatross , my lack of rage has NOTHING to do with the situation.
As far as we know i might rage more than fitzz after i know the info.
But until i know the details , i rather not rage.

Now you can try to interpret I think you should atleast hear out what his reasons are. all you want ,
but its not going to help you. Because like i said since the beginning , im not you. I dont behave like you ,
i dont process my thoughts in the same order you do. This doesnt make me superior , it just makes me "me"
which is not " you "

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2010/05/28 03:20:59


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Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka




Manchester UK

Ugh. You're pointless.

I'm going to bed.

 Cheesecat wrote:
 purplefood wrote:
I find myself agreeing with Albatross far too often these days...

I almost always agree with Albatross, I can't see why anyone wouldn't.


 Crazy_Carnifex wrote:

Okay, so the male version of "Cougar" is now officially "Albatross".
 
   
Made in us
Steady Space Marine Vet Sergeant







Albatross wrote:
It's there in black and white. Unambiguous. You want to know his reasons for using racist language to describe black customers. Have you any idea how stupid that sounds to an adult? That you would want to know his reasons directly implies that there are circumstances under which his use of that language would be acceptable - otherwise you wouldn't care what his reasons are. That is the most basic of basic reasoning. Even a child could understand that.

Now, it is my belief that there is nothing that the guy could say which would excuse his behaviour, nothing that had happened to him that was so bad that he would get away with speaking like that. You can equivocate if you like, but all you're really doing is enabling racists if you do so.

I know people who i know for a fact are not racist a single bit. But when they got pushed to far by a person of a single race lost it. It is not right but i know that is not him. He could very well been at his wits end today.
Is he really racist is what we should be wondering. If he hired an african american like fitzz said could he really be racist?

-to many points to bother to count.
mattyrm wrote:i like the idea of a woman with a lobster claw for a hand touching my nuts. :-)
 
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle





Georgia,just outside Atlanta

Albatross wrote:

Now, it is my belief that there is nothing that the guy could say which would excuse his behaviour, nothing that had happened to him that was so bad that he would get away with speaking like that. You can equivocate if you like, but all you're really doing is enabling racists if you do so.



And this is my thoughts as well, it's the bosses choice of words that are at the root of my anger,nothing...no reason whatsoever justifies him saying what he said.
While I can commend Luna for her "wanting to understand the whole situation" view,it's just not aplicable in this situation.

...And BTW Albby,my Missus says if you are ever in the U.S. the first round is on her.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
garret wrote:
Albatross wrote:
It's there in black and white. Unambiguous. You want to know his reasons for using racist language to describe black customers. Have you any idea how stupid that sounds to an adult? That you would want to know his reasons directly implies that there are circumstances under which his use of that language would be acceptable - otherwise you wouldn't care what his reasons are. That is the most basic of basic reasoning. Even a child could understand that.

Now, it is my belief that there is nothing that the guy could say which would excuse his behaviour, nothing that had happened to him that was so bad that he would get away with speaking like that. You can equivocate if you like, but all you're really doing is enabling racists if you do so.

I know people who i know for a fact are not racist a single bit. But when they got pushed to far by a person of a single race lost it. It is not right but i know that is not him. He could very well been at his wits end today.
Is he really racist is what we should be wondering. If he hired an african american like fitzz said could he really be racist?


In a shop of 120+ employees ,there are exactly 2 (two) African American employees-one of wich was standing next to me and heard the bosses rant.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/05/28 03:26:54



"I'll tell you one thing that every good soldier knows! The only thing that counts in the end is power! Naked merciless force!" .-Ursus.

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Lethal Lhamean






Man legal action for saying something nasty.. OMG.

Maybe key his car or superglue the locks on his car or paint 'racist' on it if you are that upset.. legal action? man I can't believe it.

Also have you never said a racial slur in your life I'm just curious?


   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle





Georgia,just outside Atlanta

Shaman wrote:Man legal action for saying something nasty.. OMG.

Maybe key his car or superglue the locks on his car or paint 'racist' on it if you are that upset.. legal action? man I can't believe it.

Also have you never said a racial slur in your life I'm just curious?




In my much younger,and I mean MUCH younger years ( 12,13...14) of course I used racial slurs,why...becuase I was a stupid kid raised in the south,however,I am now a grown man of 40 and have experinced a great deal in life and have learned that such things are stupid.
Also,this took place in a business,one that serves the public....if my boss wants to sit his home and yell "N-word this!! N-word that!!!" until his fething head explodes...that's not my problem.
However,I (nor anyone else) should have to hear that at our workplace.
This man owns a business,has controll over peoples livelyhood,decides who gets promoted or doesn't...so if he's a racist scumbag...it matters.


"I'll tell you one thing that every good soldier knows! The only thing that counts in the end is power! Naked merciless force!" .-Ursus.

I am Red/Black
Take The Magic Dual Colour Test - Beta today!
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Lethal Lhamean






Fair enough..

I guess its a cultural thing, Australians (that I know atleast) aren't really into the who sue him thing..

Thinking about it, here I'd probably report it to the discrimination workplace watchdog thing.. You got one of those in the states? Maybe do both. But you realize if he finds out you dobbed him in you'll never get promoted or get reduced hours or even get fired..
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle





Georgia,just outside Atlanta

Shaman wrote:Fair enough..

I guess its a cultural thing, Australians (that I know atleast) aren't really into the who sue him thing..

Thinking about it, here I'd probably report it to the discrimination workplace watchdog thing.. You got one of those in the states? Maybe do both. But you realize if he finds out you dobbed him in you'll never get promoted or get reduced hours or even get fired..


Yes,I definatly realize that turning the "legal dogs" loose will most likely cost me my job.
And in a way I'd much rather beat his face in man to man...however that would most likely meen jail.

My personal dilemma is one in wich I have told my children repeatedly about how vile racism is,yet I have to walk into a shop and put money into the pockets of a man who would consider my children "lesser individules" ,in order to support my children.

And yes,we do have "anti discrimination" groups here in the states,many of wich focus on "work related issues".


"I'll tell you one thing that every good soldier knows! The only thing that counts in the end is power! Naked merciless force!" .-Ursus.

I am Red/Black
Take The Magic Dual Colour Test - Beta today!
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Made in us
Plaguelord Titan Princeps of Nurgle




Alabama

Have you actually confronted the man about it? Because the way I see it, there are a few roads and all of them end up in you not working there (or losing your job).

You can:

1.) Quit, because you can't stand to work for someone you don't respect and couldn't imagine supporting someone's lifestyle that you don't agree with.

2.) Bring legal action into it, where if he is found guilty, he could lose his shop and you lose your job.

3.) Bring legal action into it, where if he is found not guilty, he fires you for bringing legal action against him.

Like Luna, I don't know the man, but if someone said something like that that offended me so, I would ask him if I could speak to him privately and tell him how offended I was. About my ties to the race that he was insulting and how that inherently insults me. Maybe even go so far as to ask for an apology.

If he doesn't care enough to do that, then he respects you about as much as he respects the people he was talking about and it's time to start looking for another job. Maybe take an audio recorder into the conversation as well, in case you want to press charges once you actually do leave (which is what I would wait to do, if you really are thinking of pursuing this course.)

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/05/28 04:31:21


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Lethal Lhamean






Well then if I was determined to get him for it I'd get some hard evidence like a recording or something.. Don't wanna lose your job for nothing.

Edit: just realized how dumb that sounded. oops/

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/05/28 05:56:05


 
   
Made in us
Plaguelord Titan Princeps of Nurgle




Alabama

Albatross wrote:

Now, it is my belief that there is nothing that the guy could say which would excuse his behaviour, nothing that had happened to him that was so bad that he would get away with speaking like that. You can equivocate if you like, but all you're really doing is enabling racists if you do so.


And while I understand your anger toward the situation - it is just a word. How is it any different than calling them something else? Is it somehow more insulting because it is directed at a minority? I used to work in a restaurant where I would get consistently bad tips from this same minority after walking in 15 minutes until close. And it's not a service thing - it is very clearly a race thing. I don't know why, but they are notoriously bad tippers (in the fine-dining south, anyway) and they notoriously come in to eat late. It is poor etiquette, but they could care less. We're here to serve them and I would. I would stay an extra hour or two, I would have to pay 3.5% of my money to my support staff and then I would be left with just enough to cover taxes. Believe me, I wanted to use some choice words and while my coworkers would call them the word we're referring to, it had no less bite and no less intent than any of the words I was contemplating. And this goes for people no matter their race.

A word has as much power as you give it, pure and simple. I could've said the N-word, as you're referring to it, but instead I would choose mother*. And this is somehow less offensive? It serves the same purpose for me (venting at a racial group because of the way that they consitently treat me and others in my profession) and it is directed at the same group of people. How is it any different? Why am I excused for saying that word with the same intent?

And let's be clear - I'm not defending this guy. I agree with the OP that it is a business setting and that if you're going to be running a business, you should watch your mouth, especially when customers are involved. What I am trying to get to the root of is giving a word so much weight when it can be easily replaced with another word that packs as much hatred and as much malice, but is more accepted. Why wouldn't that cause you (or the OP) to fly off the handle?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/05/28 04:42:32


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Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle





Georgia,just outside Atlanta

@ Puma.

Basicly my take on why "that word" is worse to call an African American than say perhaps...Mother****.

When the Klan was hanging African Americans...they called them (N-word).

When People were being taken from their native land and sold,they were called (N-word)

When African Americans wanted decent schools,jobs and basic human rights,they were called (N-word)

When my children deal with the children raised by racist they get called (N-word.)

So yeah,calling someone Mother**** can convey hate and malice.
But IMO...it doesn't have quite the same impact as "That word".


"I'll tell you one thing that every good soldier knows! The only thing that counts in the end is power! Naked merciless force!" .-Ursus.

I am Red/Black
Take The Magic Dual Colour Test - Beta today!
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Made in us
Plaguelord Titan Princeps of Nurgle




Alabama

FITZZ wrote: @ Puma.

Basicly my take on why "that word" is worse to call an African American than say perhaps...Mother****.

When the Klan was hanging African Americans...they called them (N-word).

When People were being taken from their native land and sold,they were called (N-word)

When African Americans wanted decent schools,jobs and basic human rights,they were called (N-word)

When my children deal with the children raised by racist they get called (N-word.)

So yeah,calling someone Mother**** can convey hate and malice.
But IMO...it doesn't have quite the same impact as "That word".


I understand. But what I was getting at is that they could just as easily cover it up with another word and convey the same hatred, but you and Albatross would let that slide. In my example above, I probably meant all the malice that that word carries, but I chose not to use that word, but I'm somehow morally superior to your boss. I think hatred gets thrown around in everyone's direction and some people are better at covering it up than others. I guess what I'm trying to say is I think you should be more pissed off at the kind of person he is and the fact that you're in the position that is forcing you to make a tough decision about your future and your job, rather than giving a word all manners of power over you, your loved ones and your life. You know that your loved ones are not n*s. Because he said that does not make them so.

I think you should have a conversation with him. Explain how offended you are and ask or demand for an apology. Either way, it sounds like you need to get out of that job (unless he does sincerely apologize. But the way you've described him, it doesn't sound like he will.)

As a side note: when people were being taken from their native land and sold, it was other africans that were doing that to them and/or putting them in that position.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/05/28 05:15:32


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Fittz the only advice i can offer to you now is to not carry around hatred. It will hurt you. Hatred is nothing but a disease. Be careful not to carry it. And if you can confront him and tell him how you feel. If he aplogizes accept it. if he doesnt it is up to you.

-to many points to bother to count.
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Savage Minotaur




Chicago

Your boss is a complete piece of gak, Fitzz. With your background, I realize how you feel.

Those who are saying "Get his side of the story" are wrong. He said racist bs in the workplace, in the south no less, and should be punished.

Not sure, Fitzz, just not sure.
   
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Lethal Lhamean






What difference does being in the south mean.. cause of the KKk?
   
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Veteran ORC







Albatross wrote:'Dogs can choke on Nobz.'



You can always let him loose on your opponents side and say he "counts as" a rampaging squiggoth.

Were I you, I would start looking for another job, and then just quit. Let the bastard have to find someone to replace you, and maybe have to get his hands dirty with work. I'm kinda bigotted against bigots, but he strikes me as the kind of guy who doesn't do alot of work, amiright?

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Ollanius Pius - Savior of the Emperor






Gathering the Informations.

Karon wrote:Your boss is a complete piece of gak, Fitzz. With your background, I realize how you feel.

Those who are saying "Get his side of the story" are wrong. He said racist bs in the workplace, in the south no less, and should be punished.

Not sure, Fitzz, just not sure.

So what about blacks who say honky, cracker, etc at the workplace? Or how about anyone using Asian slurs?

That's racist crap too.

You can't punish people for saying words. Really. You can't.

The only time it even remotely comes close to being a punishable offense is if it's being used to start riots or to defame someone's character.
   
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Minnesota

Alright, I suppose the central question that should be directed at FITZZ is: what are you hoping to accomplish? What end result are you hoping to bring about?

There are a lot of different reasons to do something about the incident; personal insult, making sure that others in the workplace don't end up being insulted in the same manner, not wanting to do associate with someone who you think is so wrong (or such a jackass about it), wanting to stand by your coworker, and so forth. However, it's probably better to separate the different reasons and see how you feel about them individually than it is to just know that you're mad and combine every possible reason together.

The biggest thing seems to be: do you care if he's racist? Or just whether or not he expresses his racism while at work? You said that you wouldn't care if he shouted "[see forum posting rules]" in his own house, which seems to make me think it's the second issue. If this is the case, then you should be able to keep working with him if he apologizes keeps his racism to himself.

I'm not a legal expert in this area, but I really don't think trying to go down a legal route is a good move. It would be, frankly, quite a pain in the ass, for you and any other employees engaging in it, and I don't know that it will get you the result you desire. You would get your revenge on him, but only at a lot of personal expense yourself. The amount of stress you'd be putting him through, not to mention putting yourself through, doesn't really seem to match up with him having insulted you by accident, even if the insult was fairly grave. It would almost certainly be enough to get him to watch his mouth, which would be nice, but the process could turn out very bad for his present employees, to the point where they still might end up behind.

Going to a news station seems like it would have many of the same problems, only with even less predictability. Both ideas would also likely end up with him even more entrenched in his beliefs, despite his refusal to express them, because of a feeling of persecution, and having no recourse or ability to defend himself.

I think the best option, if you were really pissed at him, would be to get the church involved. They're probably going to do be more likely to succeed than the lawsuit or news story, and it's generally easier to deal with regular people than it is to deal with lawyers and reporters. They're going to carry a lot of weight, both social and moral, and being part of the local community - without the power of the police or broadcasting towers - will better force him to come to terms with his own opinions.

However, like puma said, I think that first and foremost you owe the guy an upfront discussion. I mean, as far as he knows you don't even have a reason to be upset with him, right? I advice would be to get him to apologize, and promise to be more careful. Will his apology be sincere? Probably not, but I actually don't think that's very important; what matters is that he retreats from his position, and doesn't come back. He takes back the insult, he won't insult anyone else there, he doesn't suffer nearly as much grief as he could have, and neither do you. It seems like the best outcome.

If you confront him, I think the way you do it is going to be important. Make sure that the black coworker is backing you up on everything, both talk to the guy sometime when he's alone (you don't want him to try and save face in front of a third party), be fairly calm and polite but show conviction, and make him see that you're mad and you think that you have good reason to be if he tries to make light of the situation or shrug it off as no big deal. He may try to weasel out of the situation; that's probably not a bad thing, as it means he's trying to distance himself from the comment, and probably won't want a confrontation to arise again. If he gets really mad, be willing to give him some space, and try and judge whether he's actually looking to escalate things with you or just covering for his own embarrassment. In the latter case you can probably leave him be after you've said your peace. You really don't want him to feel backed into a corner, he'll lash out and you'll both wind up hurt (remember Sun Tzu!).

If despite trying to handle things like a gentleman he tries to feth you over anyways, then you may have no choice but to break off employment with him and ask the church to help you get him to issue a public apology to the rest of the store/community. That would probably hurt, but hey, if you're can't handle your own mistakes then someone's going to force you to own up to them. It would be a bad place to be, employment-wise though, so I wouldn't recommend trying for it. On the plus side, you may get some sympathy (or prove some ethical clout) from prospective employers if you explain your situation, especially if the other coworker can back up your story. And it's probably a good idea to keep him close by to whatever your thoughts on the matter are. After all, he probably has even more reason to be offended, and you'd probably feel bad if you got him in way deeper than he ever wanted to go.

Anuvver fing - when they do sumfing, they try to make it look like somfink else to confuse everybody. When one of them wants to lord it over the uvvers, 'e says "I'm very speshul so'z you gotta worship me", or "I know summink wot you lot don't know, so yer better lissen good". Da funny fing is, arf of 'em believe it and da over arf don't, so 'e 'as to hit 'em all anyway or run fer it.
 
   
Made in es
Martial Arts SAS





Pamplona, Spain

My ex boss (in the job I had before the job I have now) was that kind of big mouth. Not about racist stuff, but speaking at someone's back, being rude when unnecessary and acting all day like if we was surrounded by useless people. "Luckily" his management was so lame that the enterprise lost the customer we worked for. The workers were reasigned in other projects, and he was fired.

Too bad that your big mouth is his own boss.


 
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka




Manchester UK

Orkeosaurus wrote:Alright, I suppose the central question that should be directed at FITZZ is: what are you hoping to accomplish? What end result are you hoping to bring about?

There are a lot of different reasons to do something about the incident; personal insult, making sure that others in the workplace don't end up being insulted in the same manner, not wanting to do associate with someone who you think is so wrong (or such a jackass about it), wanting to stand by your coworker, and so forth. However, it's probably better to separate the different reasons and see how you feel about them individually than it is to just know that you're mad and combine every possible reason together.

The biggest thing seems to be: do you care if he's racist? Or just whether or not he expresses his racism while at work? You said that you wouldn't care if he shouted "[see forum posting rules]" in his own house, which seems to make me think it's the second issue. If this is the case, then you should be able to keep working with him if he apologizes keeps his racism to himself.

I'm not a legal expert in this area, but I really don't think trying to go down a legal route is a good move. It would be, frankly, quite a pain in the ass, for you and any other employees engaging in it, and I don't know that it will get you the result you desire. You would get your revenge on him, but only at a lot of personal expense yourself. The amount of stress you'd be putting him through, not to mention putting yourself through, doesn't really seem to match up with him having insulted you by accident, even if the insult was fairly grave. It would almost certainly be enough to get him to watch his mouth, which would be nice, but the process could turn out very bad for his present employees, to the point where they still might end up behind.

Going to a news station seems like it would have many of the same problems, only with even less predictability. Both ideas would also likely end up with him even more entrenched in his beliefs, despite his refusal to express them, because of a feeling of persecution, and having no recourse or ability to defend himself.

I think the best option, if you were really pissed at him, would be to get the church involved. They're probably going to do be more likely to succeed than the lawsuit or news story, and it's generally easier to deal with regular people than it is to deal with lawyers and reporters. They're going to carry a lot of weight, both social and moral, and being part of the local community - without the power of the police or broadcasting towers - will better force him to come to terms with his own opinions.

However, like puma said, I think that first and foremost you owe the guy an upfront discussion. I mean, as far as he knows you don't even have a reason to be upset with him, right? I advice would be to get him to apologize, and promise to be more careful. Will his apology be sincere? Probably not, but I actually don't think that's very important; what matters is that he retreats from his position, and doesn't come back. He takes back the insult, he won't insult anyone else there, he doesn't suffer nearly as much grief as he could have, and neither do you. It seems like the best outcome.

If you confront him, I think the way you do it is going to be important. Make sure that the black coworker is backing you up on everything, both talk to the guy sometime when he's alone (you don't want him to try and save face in front of a third party), be fairly calm and polite but show conviction, and make him see that you're mad and you think that you have good reason to be if he tries to make light of the situation or shrug it off as no big deal. He may try to weasel out of the situation; that's probably not a bad thing, as it means he's trying to distance himself from the comment, and probably won't want a confrontation to arise again. If he gets really mad, be willing to give him some space, and try and judge whether he's actually looking to escalate things with you or just covering for his own embarrassment. In the latter case you can probably leave him be after you've said your peace. You really don't want him to feel backed into a corner, he'll lash out and you'll both wind up hurt (remember Sun Tzu!).

If despite trying to handle things like a gentleman he tries to feth you over anyways, then you may have no choice but to break off employment with him and ask the church to help you get him to issue a public apology to the rest of the store/community. That would probably hurt, but hey, if you're can't handle your own mistakes then someone's going to force you to own up to them. It would be a bad place to be, employment-wise though, so I wouldn't recommend trying for it. On the plus side, you may get some sympathy (or prove some ethical clout) from prospective employers if you explain your situation, especially if the other coworker can back up your story. And it's probably a good idea to keep him close by to whatever your thoughts on the matter are. After all, he probably has even more reason to be offended, and you'd probably feel bad if you got him in way deeper than he ever wanted to go.


+1

You can't 'police' his thoughts, but you can try to police his actions. As I said earlier, legally there is probably little you can do - so Orkeo is right: you and other employees should confront him about it (once you've calmed down) and let him know that what he said wasn't right.

 Cheesecat wrote:
 purplefood wrote:
I find myself agreeing with Albatross far too often these days...

I almost always agree with Albatross, I can't see why anyone wouldn't.


 Crazy_Carnifex wrote:

Okay, so the male version of "Cougar" is now officially "Albatross".
 
   
Made in us
Shas'o Commanding the Hunter Kadre




Missouri

Karon wrote:Those who are saying "Get his side of the story" are wrong. He said racist bs in the workplace, in the south no less, and should be punished.


I agree, he said some really stupid things and I really don't think you should just let it slide, FITZZ (though it's a difficult situation to be in, I would be pretty fething pissed off too, but I couldn't afford to lose my job either so I know what you mean), but why does the fact that this happened in the south really matter again? Would it somehow be less wrong if this happened in Maine?

 Desubot wrote:
Why isnt Slut Wars: The Sexpocalypse a real game dammit.


"It's easier to change the rules than to get good at the game." 
   
Made in au
Gore-Soaked Lunatic Witchhunter






Australia (Recently ravaged by the Hive Fleet Ginger Overlord)

I'm guessing it wasn't exactly a case of this...



That said, I'm Cuacasian and me and my Punjab/Indian/Canadian Friend (Yeah fethed up ancestry ) call each other '[see forum posting rules]' all the time. It's just an inside joke between us, since one of the girls in class thought he was full blown African American and asked if he knew Tupac.

I'm guessing this wasn't a case of that. How is you business organized, FITZZ? Is there someone you can report this to, preferably not within business, or is it just him?

Smacks wrote:
After the game, pack up all your miniatures, then slap the guy next to you on the ass and say.

"Good game guys, now lets hit the showers"
 
   
Made in za
Maniacal Gibbering Madboy






@ FITZZ: If I had been in your shoes I would probably have lost my cool a bit, but looking at this from the outisde it seems like there isn't much you can do. In theory, labour laws protect employees from unfair treatment, but in practice there's nothing much we can do except grin and bear it. He'll get his own eventually.
   
Made in us
Steady Space Marine Vet Sergeant







Karon wrote:Those who are saying "Get his side of the story" are wrong. He said racist bs in the workplace, in the south no less, and should be punished.

I respectufully disagree. People can say things they dont mean when pushed to far. I still say talk to the boss about it. See if he really meant it. He will say he didnt no matter what he really thought. But you should just let him know that you are all workers and you will there together and hear what he said. you should forgive him and then keep a keen eye on him. If he repeats it again knowingly then you get more serious and file a greivance.

-to many points to bother to count.
mattyrm wrote:i like the idea of a woman with a lobster claw for a hand touching my nuts. :-)
 
   
Made in us
Nigel Stillman





Austin, TX

BaronIveagh wrote:I can beat it: I reported my boss for selling the company's secrets to it's competitors.

I was fired for violating the chain of command. All complaints about this person were to go through this person.

I now read in the papers that my ex employer is suing my former boss, who, it turns out, was stealing from the company for months before I reported it, and for months after, before she was forced to resign.



Here's your problem:

You can just quit.

Or, you can blow the whistle on him. This will NOT end well for you. Not in the least. You're going to not look trustworthy and so on and so forth.

Or as much as I hate to say this, you can try and deal with the racist fether for a little while longer while you go and try and find another job. I know in a perfect world you could get another job fast, but of course if it was perfect you wouldn't have to deal with racist fethheads.

:edit:
Garret- I'm sorry, but sure you can forgive but you can't forget. That's the problem there. It's like someone robbing your house, letting them off the hook, and then they come back to rob it again. The damage has been done. Now it's time for damage control. None of the options are pretty. Unless Fitzz of course can figure something out!

:edit2: Apparently the censor didn't censor out feth when I combined it with another word. Fix'd

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2010/05/29 00:13:29


 
   
 
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