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bigfood wrote:How does he get the better job? This is the same question I asked a post above, concerning money and wealth. Doesn’t´ t he have to identify?

Ok, say you both go in for the same job. You have the real Harvard degree, he has a fake one. You both go in for an interview for the same job. Now it is entirely possible for you to get the job, but say the guy with the fake degree is older and has more experience on his CV. The company will look at you both and probably go with someone with more experience.

I know it depends on a lot of 'what if's' but you said someone pretending to have a Harvard wouldn't have a negative impact on your life, I say losing out on a job due to a cheater is a negative.

And a policeman is the wrong example, because you actually have to interact with him in public. You don´t run to a soldier saying "please save my country"

Yes but who will you go for, the skinny/fat bloke who looks like he wouldn't win a fight to a 3-year old or a man in a soldiers uniform when there are no other trained people around to help stop a crime. Last time I checked, soldiers came home from wars and walked around the streets like normal people, occasionally in uniform.

Also, wolfstan, you have a very good point. Just thought I'd add that.

But I think the point is, that the man dressed as a major didn´t have any papers prooving he was really one. When I´m a real major I can easily proove it in a job interview by showing documents. He can´t, so he isn´t a rival.


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Wolfstan wrote:

I don't the people posting against the OP have a problem with it being illegal to be impersonating a soldier, just the overkill in dealing with it. Perhaps I should stop playing Call of Duty / Airsoft / historical wargames, because in fairness (and I have seriously reflected on this) they take war and turn it in to hamless fun. How many times have you roared out loud with some hollywood style comment when you get a good kill in Call of Duty or a bloody good dice roll in a game. We are people who on a regular basis "prentend" to be something / someone else. In my eyes it's no different, in fact I see it sometimes as worse, than the guy who was in the uniform.

That´s it. I don´t critisize that it is officially a crime, I just dont think it´s a crime serious enough to get that upset about it, no matter of the circumstances. Comments about how he should die are just sadistic gak. Even though it´s a crime, I think it´s a small one and - at least to me as someone without military background - a quite funny and somewhat understandable one.

As to the games, maybe the man dressed as a major was "playing", too. Generally, I don´t see any problem with gaming/playing/playing a role, because it´s fun and just that - a game, not reality. In this case, reality and game get mixed up in a kind of way. He plays, but in real life. But because his play doesn´t really harm anybody (IMO), one can tolerate it in reality.

All no hopers in the military?

I was in for ten years, im a pretty well educated man, and i met many very well educated people during my time in.

Sure, run of the mill infantry and such have some poorly educated people, but why does that make them no hopers? What about officers?

I think thats what makes it so decent of them to join up frankly. In modern Britain you dont NEED to join the military, you can just live off the dole and get your free council house, some of the poorest people in the UK are career doleys, but if one of their kids wants to better himself and has no qualifications, then they join up. I met some pretty dumb soldiers sometimes sure (and plenty of clever ones too) and some of the less educated people would basically say "yeah im not that clever and i did gak in school so i joined the army"

Whats wrong with that?

They could sit at home and sponge off the state but they go in to try and make something of themselves without having the money or brains or motivation to go get a good education, and your slating people for doing it?

Shame on you.

People like you and Henners are seriously irritating me, its like you think young men deserve to die because they dare to want to be in the military, not everyone wants to go in to "kill people" most go in for nice normal reasons like travel, see the world, make friends.. whatever, and your very simplistic view of the people that make up the military is utterly false.

Oh but i admit joined because i desperately wanted to kill people. I think im in the minority though.

mattyrm wrote:All no hopers in the military?

I was in for ten years, im a pretty well educated man, and i met many very well educated people during my time in.

Sure, run of the mill infantry and such have some poorly educated people, but why does that make them no hopers? What about officers?

I think thats what makes it so decent of them to join up frankly. In modern Britain you dont NEED to join the military, you can just live off the dole and get your free council house, some of the poorest people in the UK are career doleys, but if one of their kids wants to better himself and has no qualifications, then they join up. I met some pretty dumb soldiers sometimes sure (and plenty of clever ones too) and some of the less educated people would basically say "yeah im not that clever and i did gak in school so i joined the army"

Whats wrong with that?

They could sit at home and sponge off the state but they go in to try and make something of themselves without having the money or brains or motivation to go get a good education, and your slating people for doing it?

Shame on you.

People like you and Henners are seriously irritating me, its like you think young men deserve to die because they dare to want to be in the military, not everyone wants to go in to "kill people" most go in for nice normal reasons like travel, see the world, make friends.. whatever, and your very simplistic view of the people that make up the military is utterly false.

Oh but i admit joined because i desperately wanted to kill people. I think im in the minority though.

Did you maybe want to post this in this thread?

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/311270.page

There are currently two military threads going on. WE are discussing the matter of people dressed up as officers. THEY are discussing if it´s ok to stay at home if you think war is gak (most reasonable option for everyone).

bigfood wrote:But I think the point is, that the man dressed as a major didn´t have any papers prooving he was really one. When I´m a real major I can easily proove it in a job interview by showing documents. He can´t, so he isn´t a rival.

Arh, I assumed that people who pretend to have a university degree generally have a fake piece of paper saying they have it. But remember, occationally people will just take your word for it, I've known a big company to do that. But I digress...

As to the games, maybe the man dressed as a major was "playing", too. Generally, I don´t see any problem with gaming/playing/playing a role, because it´s fun and just that - a game, not reality. In this case, reality and game get mixed up in a kind of way. He plays, but in real life. But because his play doesn´t really harm anybody (IMO), one can tolerate it in reality

Interesting point, yes, most people won't mind and will tolarate it in public. But if he goes and does something stupid, say he sets fire to some building while drunk, or assaults someone, or commits some other crime, it'll make the millitary and other soldiers look bad. That harms them in a way. I don't like the idea of men coming back from the horrors of war to find that the general public hates them, that would just lead into a circle of acts caused by depression which make the millitary look worse and worse, this then can lead to many political nightmares.

Unlikely but you get the picture why a government/army would want to stop people wearing their uniform.

wizard12 wrote:
Arh, I assumed that people who pretend to have a university degree generally have a fake piece of paper saying they have it. But remember, occationally people will just take your word for it, I've known a big company to do that. But I digress...



Yeah, my tactic of argumenting was a bit unfair there But I think this is the difference between acting like having a harvard degree and what he did: he isn´t really a threat.




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wizard12 wrote:Interesting point,yes,most people won´t mind and will tolerate it in public. But if he goes and does something stupid, say he sets fire to some building while drunk, or assaults someone, or commits some other crime, it'll make the millitary and other soldiers look bad. That harms them in a way. I don't like the idea of men coming back from the horrors of war to find that the general public hates them, that would just lead into a circle of acts caused by depression which make the millitary look worse and worse, this then can lead to many political nightmares.

Unlikely but you get the picture why a government/army would want to stop people wearing their uniform.

Luckily, this only works when people see one crime and judge a whole group on it.

That´s it. I don´t critisize that it is officially a crime, I just dont think it´s a crime serious enough to get that upset about it, no matter of the circumstances.

It's a matter of sensitivity. There are people who have suffered in arguably the worst possible ways. It's not going to make them happy to find some guy walking around claiming credit for things he had nothing to do with when you consider exactly what those things are and what they meant to the people who experienced them.

Maybe OP overreacted, but it is easy for me to see why he reacted the way he did and I don't hold it against him. Ultimately the impersonator was the one in the wrong in the given situation. He brought it on himself and I have little sympathy for him.

I don't the people posting against the OP have a problem with it being illegal to be impersonating a soldier, just the overkill in dealing with it. Perhaps I should stop playing Call of Duty / Airsoft / historical wargames, because in fairness (and I have seriously reflected on this) they take war and turn it in to hamless fun.

The difference is that it's a fantasy. It's like a book, or a movie, or music. So long as the contents do not exert their control into the real world, it is in fact harmless. And someone who runs around circle strafing real people and then tea bagging the bodies likely has problems that extend well beyond playing a video game too much. A man/woman impersonating a soldier on the other hand is allowing a fantasy to interfere into real life. That's never healthy. Worse yet, they are using this image and as a result obtain respect, discounts, or special treatment. That's insulting to people who actually are soldiers or have actually done the things the individual in question is claiming credit for.

It's like copyright law. It exists so that someone can gain due credit and benefit from their work. A soldier has earned any benefits society deems fit to give him/her for their service. It's a violation to allow someone who has not done those things to reap the benefits.

LordofHats wrote:
Maybe OP overreacted, but it is easy for me to see why he reacted the way he did and I don't hold it against him.

Yeah, one has to consider a person´s personal background, and I can see that some other posters too have for example experienced horrible things, like the father getting shot.


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LordofHats wrote:
The difference is that it's a fantasy. It's like a book, or a movie, or music. So long as the contents do not exert their control into the real world, it is in fact harmless. And someone who runs around circle strafing real people and then tea bagging the bodies likely has problems that extend well beyond playing a video game too much.

I think this is the point where we disagree. You say it isn´t a game anymore, but a trick/crime, that leaves a bitter taste for people who were in terrible situations.
I say it´s still a game, even if played in reality, and this man´s intentions aren´t "bad". From the OP post, I think he doesn´t sound like someone who wants to gain any material advantages, but more like a nice "showoff" who´s happy that someone starts talking to him personating his role.

Thus, I think everything has been said and the thread didn´t develop into a flamewar.

bigfood wrote:I think this is the point where we disagree. You say it isn´t a game anymore, but a trick/crime, that leaves a bitter taste for people who were in terrible situations.
I say it´s still a game, even if played in reality, and this man´s intentions aren´t "bad".

This is actually where you are wrong. The guy in question has a history of writing bad checks while "in uniform" and has gone to prison before for impersonating a military officer.. at the scene on a true emergency, no less.

http://newsok.com/topic/PERSON/William%20Clark

bigfood wrote:I think this is the point where we disagree. You say it isn´t a game anymore, but a trick/crime, that leaves a bitter taste for people who were in terrible situations.
I say it´s still a game, even if played in reality, and this man´s intentions aren´t "bad". From the OP post, I think he doesn´t sound like someone who wants to gain any material advantages, but more like a nice "showoff" who´s happy that someone starts talking to him personating his role.

Big,

That's a point, alright, along with the others about people like that using their play act to gain benifits they are not entitled to at the expense of those that really have served. There's not a lot that really riles me, but seeing someone like this douche posturing and claiming honors that should be reserved for those who have actually sacrificed or gone through Hell and back is one of those things.
To put it in other terms, suppose you put a lot of sweat and blood into a project with your friends, busting your asses day and night to get something accomplished while some fat ass just sits back and enjoys the good life. Finally,after years of sacrifice and the loss of some of your friends lives, you get the thing done. Then, when people turn out to show you the respect you deserve, fat ass barges with stories of how hard he had to work, taking the credit for what you and your friends worked so hard on, telling ridiculous stories of the project that people believe. I don't know how that would make you feel, but a lot of people would be pissed.
The example might seem like an oversimplification, but to most people that have been in combat situations, I can tell you that it's right on the money. That's why there are websites run by people like Larry Bailey who shout these peoples names from the rooftops as the pieces of gak they are.

Relapse wrote:
To put it in other terms, suppose you put a lot of sweat and blood into a project with your friends, busting your asses day and night to get something accomplished while some fat ass just sits back and enjoys the good life. Finally,after years of sacrifice and the loss of some of your friends lives, you get the thing done. Then, when people turn out to show you the respect you deserve, fat ass barges with stories of how hard he had to work, taking the credit for what you and your friends worked so hard on, telling ridiculous stories of the project that people believe. I don't know how that would make you feel, but a lot of people would be pissed.

^^ this is the best definition of 'politician' I've ever read.

The guy in the article sounds like a total nutcase. Maybe it's MKULTRA or some kind of Manchurian Candidate mind control, but I doubt it. I wonder if he actually ever tried to get into the military and was rejected because he was mentally fethed up.