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Thank you for that example, it is a much better way to prove your point than the "I'm right because I just am" attitude.

Regarding the Farseer, you've clearly missed what I wanted to say, so let's just call it a failed attempt at making a point on my side.

And I play Eldar, but Orks are one of the armies I regularly face and have followed my friend through various army builds, from entirely footslogging horde to a slowly building mech, have studied their codex and tactics online, so I can confidently say I know a bit about them.

And if statistics really meant so little in 40k, then none of us would bother putting our lists on forums for others to comment, we'd just put together a list with our favourite models and hope luck favours us. There are always extreme cases, and they can be quite humorous. My Avatar once died to a single space marine(regular marine, not a sarge), against any and all odds I kept rolling 1s and 2s to hit for 2 or 3 rounds. But those are just that. Extremes. What I'm saying is, you can't give sound advice based on the off-chance the dice favour you and not your opponent.

And I apologize to the OP for this derailment.

I didn't say I'm right because I am at all. I given you that example several times, I just didn't go into detail. I said at least twice Big Mek gets blown out and then assaulted Big Mek fights them off.

Lists aren't for statistics, though they can help make minds up. As I said it's a dice game. Can scream all the tactics you want but if you keep rolling 1's it ain't happening. The point in putting a list up is to make it better, to suggest better units, combos synergy etc etc not to bark mathshammer. I guess your example proves my point about mathshammer

I disagree... Yes, you have to think of synergy... It is very important in the list... But final combo you will bring must be backed by probabilities... You will not take horde of e.g. ml to take care of your heavy armor problem... Why? Because in most cases, it won't... Because with bs 4 ml has only 1,8% chance to immobilise av14... So you won't use it for that... You will have to use your units to do what they do best... And math can show you what... But ofc, you will not rely only on mathhammer... Because even if you take units which can do the job in theory will have some practical problem...

So all in all, I think it is as important as the rest of the process of making in-game decisions as well as in creating army...

As for big mek... Power weapon does not help him not get killed... It helps him not to lose battle and die in sweeping advance...But if you charge with chaos marines into him, with or without power weapon, he would take same number of wounds... So it will not save him... 'Eavy armour and cybork body may do the trick... Power weapon will allow him to retaliate.... Not saying it is bad, not saying it is good, just that it has nothing to do with him living longer once blasted out... I can tell you that in all my games against orks, not once mek survived more than one round when outside... And spending 20pts for burna + 10pts on eavy armor only to increase by little survivability is in my opinion waste... But ymmv... And there is no need for discussion...

But the good part of burna is that it doesn't have to be only power weapon in cc... And not a single soul tried to look at it that way... I play SM and I love flamers... When dealing with infantry, there is nothing better (except ordance )... So 20pts on big mek to improve your overall anti-horde capabilities, and not to forget that most ork lists have problem with it, is not too bad investment...

uggg OMG!
number one, iff Big MEk is in cc, then he HAS ALREADY DONE HIS JOB!!!!

second, a unit of plague marines kills the mek, burna or not.....

Chinchilla wrote: And there is no need for discussion...

is not too bad investment...

Sigh, if there's no need for discussion why you carrying on then? Also, if it's not a too bad investment why you arguing against it?

stompydakka wrote:uggg OMG!
number one, iff Big MEk is in cc, then he HAS ALREADY DONE HIS JOB!!!!

second, a unit of plague marines kills the mek, burna or not.....

No he hasn't! If vehicles are round he still has a job! FFS! His job remains until all vehicles are gone, he's only use after if infantry cover but like that's massive importance when you get 4+ cover.

Just one more question... Why don't you give him PK then? It's 5pts more...

I've given him a power klaw, it's alright, but that burna allows you to get those attacks in before any fists could possibly I.D your Mek. The burna, of course is best when charging which the Mek is I4 S5 and got plenty of attacks, works well when running behind a rolla-wagon (because has been busted) giving the wagon the 4+ still thanks to the KFF and then charging in to the unit the rolla just busted open.

put him INSIDE the wagon then! just let the unit inside wreck whatever pops the bus!

HOw can you when it's full? Don't you think would have put him in if could?

You can always put 19 boyz instead of 20 in your list

Could. But do that in every squad in a just in case? Big Mek will be with a unit on foot still gives the KFF protection only issue is weaknesses to assaults.