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Uncharted Seas is getting pretty popular, they just put out a 2nd edition rule book, and have thus addressed many of the problems the game originally had. Overall its a fairly cheap game to get into, between $30 and $60 for a starter fleet.

I actually just got into BFG, I like the way the final version is, though I agree that, if what I've heard is true, early versions were way unbalanced, especially with the early strike craft rules. In that kind of environment, eldar really would be broken, but eldar ships crumble under mass battery firepower.

I would like to get into a 'surface warfare' game, I have a bunch of those Wiz Kids pirate ships, but never found any opponents. :(

There a new(er) game called Federation Commander which is a somewhat streamlined version of Starfleet Battles that looks really interesting.

Production values seem to be higher than SFB and I understand you can play a game in about an hour.

According to the owner at my FLGS (Game Ogre), there's a decent number of people playing too.

My only experience with naval combat is in the video game world. Empire:Total War had pretty fun naval battles that could last for some time. I have yet to play any boardgame oriented ones because no one plays it in my area, but I have wanted to start up BFG on occasion.

Catyrpelius wrote:Uncharted Seas is getting pretty popular, they just put out a 2nd edition rule book, and have thus addressed many of the problems the game originally had. Overall its a fairly cheap game to get into, between $30 and $60 for a starter fleet.

I will give them mad props for having pdfs of some of the fleets that you can print out to try to see if you like the system before dropping the cash on a fleet http://www.spartangames.co.uk/

Magc8Ball wrote:Since this thread is here, does anybody have a quick rundown on the various Age of Sail rules available? A link to a page that discusses the pros/cons is perfectly fine, but getting a discussion going here would be ideal.

I'd love to find a fairly smooth-running Napoleonic-compatible naval system that I can mod up a bit.

There are two that I have that I enjoy (I might have more, but it'd require some digging).

The first is the aforementioned Trafalgar by Warhammer Historical. It plays similar to BFG in terms of mobility and needing to plan ahead, but also adds in the wind element, not to mention ship upgrades depending on your country. There isn't much of a campaign system, unless you want to play the Trafalgar campaign listed in the book. I've played a couple of games, and they went very nice and smooth, even with rule look-ups. The other difference is that its not an IGO/UGO system, so its a little more engaging.

The other is Beat to Quarters. It is an age of sail game, that includes a campaign system. I haven't played this game yet, and it reads as a step more complicated than Trafalgar (particularly the wind rules). I think you could probably take the campaign system from BTQ and drop it into Trafalgar with minor tweaking.

The only game my group has been able to stick with is BFG. I have Imperial, Chaos, Ork, Eldar, and Marine fleets. My friends have Dark Eldar, Necron, and Ork fleets. I would agree with the earlier poster with regard to the balance issues in the fleets. I think that the rulebook fleets aren't bad against each other, although playing against Eldar can be painful (but I have excellent success against them - go escorts!). It was the introduction of Necrons, Ork Hulks, and some of the other lists that started throwing things out of whack.

If GW was serious about BFG (which they're obviously not), then a tear-down and re-build of the core fleets would be in order, to make them all proper fleets for fleet engagements, and balance their play.

Rod Langton's Signal Close Action and Signal Close Action Fast Play are well regarded.

http://www.rodlangton.com/napoleonic/frame.htm

I would suggest trying the Fast Play set which is a simplifed version and half the price.

Has any one looked at Catylists Leviathans game? Last time I looked they were at the trials stage with simple rules for a couple of pounds downloadable. Haven't looked at the web site lately but it looked intersting for steampunk drednought ere

Free intro version of Federation Commander from the Starfleet Battles people, as mentioned earlier:

http://www.starfleetgames.com/federation/FCFirstMissions.pdf

I have Imperial, Chaos, and Eldar fleets for BFG. I like this game very much - it's clean and plays well, with good game flow. Nice, characterful models, too. Minor design issues tied to attack craft, but that's inherent in most naval games.

I also have a fairly extensive Pirates of the XXX collection, starting with Spanish Main. As far as Age of Sail naval gaming goes, this is easily my favorite. Very clean game, good tactical play. I hesitate to think how much I've spent on this. However, with Target blowing out Pirates at well below MSRP, now is easily the best time to buy in new. Highly recommended. Worst case, spend $50 to $100, throw it all in a shoebox, and keep it around as a "spare-time" game that everybody can play for fun.


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Cruentus wrote:The only game my group has been able to stick with is BFG. I have Imperial, Chaos, Ork, Eldar, and Marine fleets. My friends have Dark Eldar, Necron, and Ork fleets. I would agree with the earlier poster with regard to the balance issues in the fleets. I think that the rulebook fleets aren't bad against each other, although playing against Eldar can be painful (but I have excellent success against them - go escorts!). It was the introduction of Necrons, Ork Hulks, and some of the other lists that started throwing things out of whack.

If GW was serious about BFG (which they're obviously not), then a tear-down and re-build of the core fleets would be in order, to make them all proper fleets for fleet engagements, and balance their play.

I agree that BFG is balanced best with the Rulebook stuff, and that the later stuff isn't nearly as good. But this is common to most GW small games - look at Necromunda's Outlanders, or Mordheim's add-ons, and it's the same problem of later stuff not playing as well with the older stuff. I rate the Necrons, Ratskins, and Beastmen as the "problem" add-on factions in each of the small games. If GW were to do a proper teardown and rebalance of BFG, Necro and Mord, that'd be great.

Naval models can be generally used with any set of rules for the period.

I really like the modelling aspect and have 3 small ships scratch-built for an Empire army (WFB) I don't use anymore. Its too bad other people aren't as obsessed as me with modeling around here because the General's Compendium has some rules for usign warhammer stuff in ships.

BFG looks awesome but I've never seen a ship in person. It's like a promise of a dream...I should move to the UK after uni.

Kilkrazy wrote:Naval models can be generally used with any set of rules for the period.

That's the wonderful thing about historicals in general. Nobody in their right mind is going to require you to use Old Glory British Peninsulars when Perry British Peninsulars are better or cheaper.

Ahh, but would I be able to use Pirates ships instead of either?

JohnHwangDD wrote:Ahh, but would I be able to use Pirates ships instead of either?

Well, given that what I referred to are infantry... probably not.

LOL, I was still thinking naval. Haha!

Is there a decent se tof modern combat rules? I have harpoon for the PC and would love a modern minuture naval game that was just a *tad* less complex

This would be a good place to look.

http://theminiaturespage.com/boards/topics.mv?id=108

I used to play a lot of Harpoon, haven't played it for nearly 20 years though.

It's still going.


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JohnHwangDD wrote:LOL, I was still thinking naval. Haha!

You could use pirate ships with naval rules from between roughly 1550 to 1750. Ideally you would use rules specifically suited to the historical background.

Of course, giving up my magic treasures, sea monsters and submarines is a major downside.

Hee hee, the sea monsters and stuff in Uncharted Seas have me looking at starting that game. I'm looking at getting the Iron Dwarves, as their ships remind me of American Civil War ironclads (awesome).

And again, I have to put a plug in for Axis and Allies War at Sea. The rules are quick, easy to learn, but still fun. And if a more complex game is desired, as Killkrazy pointed out naval minis can be used for different game systems. The War at Sea minis tend to price out cheaper than the metal ones from companies such as GHQ, although it is true that the level of detail isn't as high.

My favorite naval game of all time was modified Seekrieg for WWII. I fondly recall a campaign game in the Mediterranean with the US and Brits facing off against the pride of the Italian fleet. The campaign took three battles before the Italians limped home. Oddly enough, they had been favored to win but fate dealt them some bad - though very entertaining - luck.

Our group also fought several battles in the Pacific. Night fights with the Japanese fleet were always interesting.

We also had a hunt for the Bismarck battle that had some wild moments.

It helped that the guys that hosted the games had beautifully painted and based ships and one of the guys printed off spreadsheet tracking sheets that made the damage accounting easy.