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I have three WM armies, two of which were either traded for or picked up second hand. The Ret army that I built for my wife came out at just under $200 for a 35 point Rahn army (not the tier list).

Personally, I prefer the older metal jacks but those match what I already had. As was said before, I only build the new version of whichever jack is available out of the plastics if I have a metal version of the other. The main reason is the scale difference between the new plastics and the old metal jacks is noticeable when they are side by side.

Kaptajn Congoboy wrote:

skrulnik wrote:
Personally, I think the older metal jacks are worth the ~$20 price I see. I would only pick up the new plastics to make up the new jacks.

For one who is shorter on time than cash, the new, magnetizeable plastics are a godsend

ALL HAIL THE MAGNETIZED WARJACKS

no seriously my Khador heavy can now switch around, in three forms, which i have three
giving me 27 combination to go through, I believe this is also rather money efficient on trying for a new list

A la Voltron .
______________
So.... I'm gonna change my stance into One Night Stands....daily flip floppery.

I'm between Garryth and eMorghoul for that 'assassin' caster/lock I'm looking for.

I was looking at Rhyas a month ago, I do like Acrobatics, but I really didn't like her model (unless the PP site has a bad angle/color/light on her).

Another assassin I was looking at was eCaine, which seems easier to pull off due to range....but I'm not so 'hot' on the model's pose, and it looks like a pain to reposition the arms. In addition, I'm not in love with the in-faction combat units.... though no KD Boomhowler looks fun.

I recently noticed that Strakov is an 'assassiny' Khador caster. I do like the Devestator and Spriggan, both jacks that do very well with Strakov. His model is ace, though I'm hesitant because I don't think his play style matches what I want. It seems he is well known for being a jackbullet sort of caster. He can finish things himself, but it's not really on par with the 'assassination' type I'm looking for that I see in Garryth and eMorghoul.

I play cryx, and a poster did suggest eDenny, but (in my eyes) she doesn't look it.
pGoreshade looks 'somewhat' like an assassin, with stealth and generally trying to get close for feat/blight, and a tiered list with lots of stalkers but..... not really.

So back to Garryth and eMorghoul. I am likely to jump in on tiers as I reserve my cryx to be my main.
Both have a need for at least 2 boxes of the same unit (which is on par with alot of other tiers as mentioned).

Garryth is flexible in killing at range and in close combat.
He has more movement buffing available to him (out of tiers)
He offers more spell support to his army (offensive upkeep, defensive upkeep, vampiric aura)

eMorghoul is..........not so much. I may be failing to see more with him. Silence of death indirectly supports his army, but mainly vs. Trollbloods and Locks.
Ghostly is expensive and kinda redundent with his feat, elite cadre, and tier list, and has lower Fury stat.

What has eMorghoul got more than Garryth? Cool looking Cyclops. IMO, a better looking model, have you seen Mercy, dude he is soooo overcompensating. He 'can' kill people with a fan....and fan people. Seriously, he's in Hordes, which seems like a natural choice since I already play Cryx and have the Warmachine side of focus down.

ARRGG, Garryth just looks better in alot of ways game wise. If I don't go tiered list, Miraged Sentinals are full of awesome.
If I don't run a tiered list with eMorghoul............umm.........I get to take Molik Karn.... lol....seriously, I'd get access to Ferox and the Dragoon Character, but they don't offer much to eMorghoul other than being pretty self-sufficient.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that eMorghoul looks boring, even though I have narrow requirements of what I'm looking for. And, I'm pretty sure this is not knew to those that have been playing longer than I have. <--is this somewhat accurate?

Maybe insult to injury, Garryth non-tiered has many options to get him where he needs to be (Madam, Anastasia, Whip Snap, his own mirage). With mirage on Garryth they end up in combat with likely the same Foc/Fur stat.

eMorghoul goes get ahead in two ways as I see it.
His fan is good for dropping higher DEF stuff
He can have the Savage animus on him he can save his fury for boosting dmg or getting more attacks. So he's more fury efficient when he gets there and does more passing out animi as his 'support' for his army.

I don't know, I'm very torn...

Garreth is a glass cannon though. If you swing and miss, you may as well tap. I think Skorne in general have more tools overall than the Retribution in terms of supporting what you want to do. I can't comment on the tier lists for Skorne as I haven't seen the book yet.

But they both have the durability of Fine China...

Garryth can overcharge while eMorghoul can transfer.

Garryth has a feat that is likely to be used when he is committing that prevents casting spells/channelling/using focus.
eMorghoul has a feat that gives him +2Def...so so, generally popped enroute with the rest of his forces, then he can use the Brute's Animus so he can't be knocked down to retain his high DEF... but stuff like Hex Blast/Purification is stinkers.

Looking at it a bit more. Both Ming Vases (Garryth and eMorghoul) will prob. have more infantry than beast/jacks, though since it's Hordes eMorghoul is likely to have more of them and they can be a weakness due to how Fury works.

doesn't all "assasin type" warcaster have fine china durability?


they are not say.... Karchev, or Butcher, or Vlad, or Ekreoss, and especially not Terminus or Venethrax

I dunno, eButcher has a pretty mean assassination game if you do it right, as do Venethrax and Gaspy, and Ashlynn is surprisingly durable for her 15 boxes. It's just a matter of whether said caster is dependent on high defense or high armor that determines their overall durability.

There's no reason to spend MSRP for PP stuff. Way too many online retailers sell new at 20% off at the very least. I've spent almost $300, including tax and shipping, for 70pts of Menoth and three Warcasters.

Laughing Man wrote:I dunno, eButcher has a pretty mean assassination game if you do it right, as do Venethrax and Gaspy, and Ashlynn is surprisingly durable for her 15 boxes. It's just a matter of whether said caster is dependent on high defense or high armor that determines their overall durability.

Nearly all of Ebutcher method of assasination is "ME CRUSH YOUUUUU" preferably done when things near the caster is in smoking ruins or mountain of corpses, unlike say eCaine, whose modus was get in, fire as many shots as possible to kill , if you fail get out

Retrias wrote:doesn't all "assasin type" warcaster have fine china durability?


they are not say.... Karchev, or Butcher, or Vlad, or Ekreoss, and especially not Terminus or Venethrax

Vlad very much is the assassin type warcaster though and he's hard as nails. So is Darth Stryker.

Now are you looking at just armor/wounds or are you including defense in there? If so, several of the Cygnar and Cryx casters can fall into durable with stupid high defenses.

More like armor really, extra thick armor seldom fails, dodgin depends on the whimsy of the dice god

Retrias wrote:More like armor really, extra thick armor seldom fails, dodgin depends on the whimsy of the dice god

While high ARM is better than high DEF in theory, due to ARM both preventing and reducing damage, DEF actually comes out ahead in the game. Because the probability of a standard dice roll follows a bell curve, the degree difference becomes extremely important, moreso than the slight difference between how DEF and ARM function. The normal range of stats allows bigger differences between DEF(10-18) and MAT/RAT(5-10) than ARM(12-22) and P+S(10-25), making DEF the better path to go down defensively in most cases.

Khador assassin-y would be Vlad with Kayazy, Manhunters/Yuri, and widowmakers. Add in a jack with Bulldoze and Drago, and you'd be fine.