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Howard A Treesong wrote:

Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:Well the problem is that the resulting hybrid offspring, eg hinny or an ass for example are sterile.

if the Beastmen's physically get chaotically warped together then it is hard to see that the DNA didn't get screwed up
Even if they are fertile, it is not normal for cross species breeding to take place.

While not all hybrids are sterile I'm not sure that considering real world genetics is particularly useful in this case. I imagine that chaotic magic more that solves problems with genetics and fertility, it's my impression that when you mutate to chaos you become something different in your own right, far more than a mere hybrid of other things. Typical chaos mutations are things like claws for hands and growth of spikes or tentacles or a second head or acidic blood and real-world mutations are never like this.

Agreed, in a world where it's not uncommon for people to grow extra arms, have skin that drips with toxins and develop giant tusks it's not in the least hard to consider that hybrid births could be still fertile, there's motation all over the place, a half human half goatman could easily still be fertile.


Oh and if anyone was thinking of making dwarf beastmen hybrids you should make them so hairy that you can hardly see where their face, arms and legs are.

Oh and also, in response to the response to my previous post, you can't stop rule 34, even if you leave the beastwoman as completely unnatractive. And I was mostly saying that because female beastmen could concievably be comparible in appearance to harpies, who are thought to be easy to mistake for beautifull at a distance.

Also that's an alternate option for what female beastmen are, though I sort of don't think so except in rare cases (Malagor for instance?) though it raises a seperate question, what does a male harpy look like? Wait never mind that question, just reread the armybook entry, doubt that there are any male harpies.

you should make them so hairy that you can hardly see where their face, arms and legs are

At first glance I mistook the last word for another body part
Then again, I suppose they would have hairy a...nyway moving swiftly on.

Warboss Imbad Ironskull wrote:Also the mutated birth scenario dosen't just result in Ungors (if it does) considering in the fluff these individuals are usually destined for great things and ungors aren't that high in Beastmen society (if it can be called that). Also Morghur was born that way, well at least the first time he was born anyway.

The destiny of foundlings is varied, it probably depends on a lot of things, like their mutations, personality and how well he fits in with the tribe will influence how far they get living among the beastmen.
Slaangor will favour a foundling hermaphrodite over a foundling with a hound's head, as the hermaphrodite is "marked by slaanesh", for Khorngor it will be the houndhead kid that gets all the love (eek! what am I writing?! )

And ungors are indeed their own kind of beastmen, rather than foundlings (or not necessarily foundlings)... ungor just appears like, ehm, "un-beastman" or "not-really-beastman-but-beastman-anyway-because-no-one-else-likes-this-little-freak"

Ungors are fairly beatmeny, they're generally furry enough with hooves and horns, and I agree that they're only the most common form of human bred beastmen and not the only sort.

As for hero hammer's comments I don't think that since the new army book there are really beastmen tribed out under different gods, the vast majority, if not all tribes are servents of chaos undivided and their specific influence from the chaos gods varies from the standards established with demons and chaos northmen, for instance beastmen heavily touched by khorne wont neccisarily turn red and almost certainly wont go around chanting "blood for the blood god" but instead are more known as slathering berzerkers who think of nothing but slaughter.

You really just have to read about beastmen in some black library stuff to figure this one out, there are female beastmen who are mated with a few of the males for the purposes of keeping the herds strong, and there is one night of debauchery a year where the herd meets and the males mate as much as possible in an rampant attempt to expand the herd exponentially and as a way to show who is real good in the herd at producing.

So I assume beastmen don't have military campaigns and only fight defensive wars?

I'm sure along with the pillaging aspect of their remit goes a rape the livestock and capture the women policy (or is it the other way around?)

Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:So I assume beastmen don't have military campaigns and only fight defensive wars?

Are you kidding me? Just look at Gorthor, who ruined both Ostland and Lochland back in his days. Khazrak the One Eye will throw assault after assault if he thinks it is worth it. Malagor spreads his schemes and more and more Beastmen gathers in the attacks against men, elves and dwarves alike. And Taurox... Sigmar help us all! O_O

@chibi: How do you come to this assumption that creatures with womenfolk only fight defensively? the German tribes the Beastmen are modelled on raided and warred all the time, even conquered parts of Gaul... and they had wives and children.

They're not wood elves, they're Chaos Beastmen!

I was just wondering that the rutting season surley gets in the way of a military campaign.
Sure you can organise your way around it to a certain extent.
But if things go awry, which let's face it they are often wont to do in the fug of war, then you can't suddenly say to the Empire, "Right chaps, that's it for now, got to get back to tupp the missus!"

Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:I was just wondering that the rutting season surley gets in the way of a military campaign.
Sure you can organise your way around it to a certain extent.
But if things go awry, which let's face it they are often wont to do in the fug of war, then you can't suddenly say to the Empire, "Right chaps, that's it for now, got to get back to tupp the missus!"

Hey, multitasking... <,<

I wouldn't put it past the beasties to bring their hayleaping with them to war. Even the Empire keeps some Imperial Brothels around...

Vargtass wrote:

Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:So I assume beastmen don't have military campaigns and only fight defensive wars?

Are you kidding me? Just look at Gorthor, who ruined both Ostland and Lochland back in his days. Khazrak the One Eye will throw assault after assault if he thinks it is worth it. Malagor spreads his schemes and more and more Beastmen gathers in the attacks against men, elves and dwarves alike. And Taurox... Sigmar help us all! O_O

Agreed that's a ridiculous statement, the beastmen fight teritorial wars but not defensive ones, they don't really have anything to defend. All the rest is completely offensive attempts to kill as many people as they can and snag some loot as a result.

Vargtass wrote:

Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:I was just wondering that the rutting season surley gets in the way of a military campaign.
Sure you can organise your way around it to a certain extent.
But if things go awry, which let's face it they are often wont to do in the fug of war, then you can't suddenly say to the Empire, "Right chaps, that's it for now, got to get back to tupp the missus!"

Hey, multitasking... <,<

I wouldn't put it past the beasties to bring their hayleaping with them to war. Even the Empire keeps some Imperial Brothels around...

I doubt the beastmen would use brothels, they don't collect gold man!

As for the rutting season overlapping with war, well the first day of rutting season is the day they win, nothing motivates a man more then knowing he's got a sittle something something waiting for him back home

It was clearly stated above that there is an annual rut.
Call it an orgy if you will but a rut is what it amounts to.

This suggests that unlike human breeding, the Beastmen have to be around at the annual rut!
I saw that as meaning the Beastmen are too busy with the rut to fight apart from each other.
You know, rounding up the females, fighting off rival suitors etc You've seen the Discovery Channel, you know the pack drill. It's a busy time of year!

How they supposed to run a military campaign under those conditions, when at the same time you are trying to avoid tripping over naturalists and camera crews that are all over the place recording the mating?
btw your observations that they are just raiders contradict this:

@chibi: How do you come to this assumption that creatures with womenfolk only fight defensively? the German tribes the Beastmen are modelled on raided and warred all the time, even conquered parts of Gaul... and they had wives and children.

They're not wood elves, they're Chaos Beastmen

so are they just local raiders or do they have campaigns.
If the former then that is not exclusive to what I suggested in the first place.
If the latter how does that tally with the rut?

Beastmen do participate in massive invasions from time to time, but most of the time they simply raid nearby cities and villages.


the would imagine a large invasion to be similer to a migration. there are too many for theforest to sustain and so the huge numbers begin a migration/landseizure/invasion.

As stated they do sometimes mount massive incursions into the empire from time to time. But such invasions are only as strong as the individual leading the assault. Luckily for the empire individuals with enough power/fear/respect come along very rarely that have the ability to gather enough tribes together and stop them bickering long enough to invade other races lands. Remember beastmen dont have permanent settlements really. The closest to such things are herdstones and places so saturated with magic they are drawn to such places. These usually being well concealed or in the depth of forests away from prying eyes of other races. I can imagine though the rutting to repopulate numbers season likely comes during the winter when fighting is less common. If a massive invasion is happening though its likely they might move the herds main camp with the horde. Along with their possessions and womenfolk.

Edit: Yes as templar said. A mass migration once they reach critical numbers. Suitable perversion of nature. Which is what beastmen are all about!

Also keep in mind that animals that do rut become more agressive during the time period and considering that Beastmen have no problem raping women on campaign it owuld probably just be even more agressive during that time period. Plus they aren't completly beasts and are part man.

As far as the whole campaign thing it is the same as every other evil based army, they usually raid and pillage untill a strong enough leader joins them together and keeps them together by force of his will they will then usually destroy a couple armies/provinces etc etc.

In the end there are a number of ways that Beastmen reproduce and fill their numbers and I highly doubt that they are limited to just one method or that one method stands out above the rest. They're Beastmen of Chaos after all, they'd make love to a tree if they where drunk enough

And even, on occassions, when sober

Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:And even, on occassions, when sober

Why that is the sickest thing I ever heard... O_O

Vargtass wrote:

Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:And even, on occassions, when sober

Why that is the sickest thing I ever heard... O_O

You Haven't heard enough then!


Also Imbad touched on the point I was trying to make about increased violence and aggression during the mating season.

And I for one think campaign is the wrong word as it implys a sort of organization and planning, I think the heights of beastmen planning is what village to attack first. Though I do very much like that mass migration idea.

and one more comment about the annual rut, in general a mating season is when the females of a species are at their most fertile state which doesn't disclude mating at other times of the year though it may make it less likely for the females to be interested in it at other times, possibly leading the beastmen to commit more raids against the humans, they are as much beasts as men after all and even if a beast can wait a whole year a man isn't likely to.

Well, at least I know that we can pat ourselves on the back. I imagined that this thread would derail significantly but it haven't! Congratz, gentlemen, we behaved on the internet!

So, if the Modquisition would be som kind, we could lock this one and bury it before it is defiled by the trolls lurking out there. Let it be an example for us all!

Well so as not to disappoint

why can't female beastmen be Space Marines?

ONLY JOKIN' !!

ps must do some drawings of dwarf beasties at some point

hold on, I thought moghur was born from human parents, does that mean that they are capable of cross breeding with humans?

Renbags wrote:hold on, I thought moghur was born from human parents, does that mean that they are capable of cross breeding with humans?

Not specifically it's uncommon but it does happen that two human parents will have a beastmen child (possibly due to redundant genes or maybe just intervention from the chaos gods or warpstone exposure.) these children usuallly become nothing more then ungors but on occasion are somehow marked for a greater destiny.

I for one find the idea of a female beastman army udderly amazing

Eidolon wrote:I for one find the idea of a female beastman army udderly amazing

that pun is so bad

I for one find the idea of a female beastman army udderly amazing

Eidolon wrote:I for one find the idea of a female beastman army udderly amazing

Modquisition... now would be a good time to unexpectedly lock this! O_O

Before it's too late...

Ignoring GW's poor record for putting female miniatures into their ranges (I'm looking at you Imperial Guard). Smaller female Gor Beast(wo)men amongst the ungors and women Sorcerers and Centaurs would be pretty cool and still fit with existing warrior tribe themes.

No beastmen amazons though thank you, that particular cliche can die.

GW has been moving their model range to be more friendly to kids younger then 12(who comprise a large portion of their customers)

no decent parent would let their kid play with over-sexualized models(something GW has done a very good job of avoiding)

i agree that the IG could do with some female guardsmen(prehaps a 2:1 ratio of male to female heads)

Grey Templar wrote:no decent parent would let their kid play with over-sexualized models(something GW has done a very good job of avoiding)

Nobody wants that (ok, some people do.) what we want is some attempt to reflect demographics in modern human society in a natural, logical way.