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Ahtman wrote:
I think many would agree, but I also think we can agree that it isn't surprising that people would lol when a 14 year old uses hyperbole and insults because he sees free speech as intolerance and wants to crack down on it for that sake of freedom.

Oh, I'm not saying I didn't chuckle, that would be lying and lying is wrong. Unless you're in a relationship, a politician, or a parent.

avantgarde wrote:That asst. AG is obviously a closeted gay. I'm talking sucking dick in a major airport bathroom gay. Sending texts to congressional pages gay. Inviting teenage parishioners to your cabin in the mountains so you can be their "spiritual father" gay.

He is by far the gayest of the two people taking part in that interview.

Definitely a major closet case.

Nurglitch wrote:Considering the hyberbole and insults that typically get thrown around here by people renowned for their advanced years, I'd say that it's very mature of the original poster and laud him for following in the august footsteps of his biggers and betters.

Indeed, I also think people would have tromped on an elder that made the same remarks.

The way I understood it, in calling for Athenian democracy, Chowderhead is wanting a limited franchise democratic theocracy, the re-institution of slavery (though not race based, we want to be fair), and the the barring of females from education. I think he may be on to something. Oh, and older men will have to take on a younger man as a 'mentor'. Say, when the boy is about 12-14.

I think he was calling for Athenian Democracy, not Athenian sexual hijinks. They aren't always the same thing.

Come on guys, the kid is 14. Let he amongst you who didn't subscribe to some poorly thought out bad ideas at 14 throw the first stone.

Ahtman wrote:

Nurglitch wrote:Considering the hyberbole and insults that typically get thrown around here by people renowned for their advanced years, I'd say that it's very mature of the original poster and laud him for following in the august footsteps of his biggers and betters.

Indeed, I also think people would have tromped on an elder that made the same remarks.

The way I understood it, in calling for Athenian democracy, Chowderhead is wanting a limited franchise democratic theocracy, the re-institution of slavery (though not race based, we want to be fair), and the the barring of females from education. I think he may be on to something. Oh, and older men will have to take on a younger man as a 'mentor'. Say, when the boy is about 12-14.

If this isn't sarcasm, I think I'll blow a gasket.

Well, I'm old enough that the only people that heard my thoughts when I was 14 were my friends.

BTW, that was hilarious Nugrlitch. I've felt that the words "gay agenda" have a pretty horrible meaning to the christian right, but damned if I know what it is.

@Nurglitch: No time booked for playing 40k? Posting on Dakka?

Manchu wrote:@Nurglitch: No time booked for playing 40k? Posting on Dakka?

Well obviously, everyone knows Malifaux is SO hawt right now! Only brutes play such a mainstream game or post on mainstream forums.

I can't believe how this guy can still defend himself... he is really attached to his idea... truly a troll caught on camera

Gailbraithe wrote:Come on guys, the kid is 14. Let he amongst you who didn't subscribe to some poorly thought out bad ideas at 14 throw the first stone.

I would have but I was too busy dodging Egyptian arrows. Oh what a day that was.

Hittites Rule! Egyptian Mamma boys drool!

Eh, once again. Free speech...I'm willing to bet that this Assistant Attorny General is probably a major troll on several websites. But still...his opinions are his opinion, and he's not breaking a law unless he's actively calling for an illegal act to be performed. We may not like it, but it doesn't mean we have the right to censor it.

On the Athenian democracy debate...no. Just, no. We think that our decision making process is slow now with making some 400 odd members of Congress trying to come to agree? Imagine how much harder it would be to get anything done if for any decision you had to take a general election involving all 300 million Americans? There's a reason we moved away from pure direct democracy, and that reason is it is far too inefficient and slow when it comes to running a large country. That's why we elect people to represent our interests in higher government, and it is my opinion that the republic is a far superior system of government. Heck, in an ideal world I'd vote for a benevolent dictatorship (not necessarily, but hopefully, ruled by an Anatolian calling himself 'the Emperor' ) Of course, what with humans being humans and all a benevolent dictatorship will never work......ah well, I can dream can't I?

OP - dont take the age attack too personal. It just happens. My niece is 17 and is easily the most immature person Ive ever had the pleasure of knowing. Most teens are the same way. Im honestly surprised that at 14 you show interests in politics. It shows a bit a maturity, but your still young mate. Older people hark on you because young = inexperience. You wont get experience until your older thats just how life works. One of my cousins is just about to turn 15, and she might be more mature in life then I am at 26. The girl wakes upself up for school, makes herself breakfast, wakes her younger brother up, makes HIM breakfast, is a strait A student, has cheer leading after school, walks across town to actually TEACH gymnastics and then home for the night to wash her clothing and do home work. BUT...... I still have seen her pull the teenager thing and completely lose track of what she is suppose to do. Again, age brings experience.....usually.


I have to say about the VID, that guy is a serious asshat. Way to look like a total Ahole on TV buddy

ChrisWWII wrote:Eh, once again. Free speech...I'm willing to bet that this Assistant Attorny General is probably a major troll on several websites. But still...his opinions are his opinion, and he's not breaking a law unless he's actively calling for an illegal act to be performed. We may not like it, but it doesn't mean we have the right to censor it.

Yeah, but free speech ends well before you end up getting barred from a university campus for stalking the object of your speechifying, and showing up at his residence at weird hours of the night. The guy is either completely nuts, or completely gay but so deep in the closet that the only thing he can do about his gay crush is go completely stalker about it.

He's on leave now pending getting fired.
EDIT: I'd say so much for free speech, but I support the right of public employers (ie tax paid for supporters) terminating people who are abhorrent to the public.

Bookwrack wrote:
Yeah, but free speech ends well before you end up getting barred from a university campus for stalking the object of your speechifying, and showing up at his residence at weird hours of the night. The guy is either completely nuts, or completely gay but so deep in the closet that the only thing he can do about his gay crush is go completely stalker about it.

....Yeah. Good point. I was more referring to his blog postings. The stalker part? Camping outside the guys house? Ok, I'm fairly sure there's a law against that.

Frazzled: Good to know then.....I'm in agreement. He's entitled to his opinions, but...the way he's going about expressing them, and the immaturity of said expression? I'd call that grounds for termination.

Free Speech does not imply any obligation on the part of employers, government or private, to continue in positions of responsibility people who are obviously morons. He can continue to picket this guy if he wants, but he'll probably be too busy looking for a job.

chowderhead13 wrote:If this isn't sarcasm, I think I'll blow a gasket.

Athenian democracy just doesn't work today. Sure it used to when you were dealing with a city state with a population of maybe a quarter million and territory you could walk across in a day at a brisk pace. When your population is pretty static, your laws half set because the gods say so, and your budget can be done on the back of a napkin you can work things directly.

You can't do it today. 300+ million people, a country you need a car and the better part of a week to get across, far flung trade and military interests with constant interaction and integration of new peoples and cultures.

The shear volume of legislation working its way through Congress at any given time would mean the only way you could stay on top of it would be to have nothing at all to do every day, all day, but read legislation. Forget doing research, talking to other people, or even really thinking it out and debating it. Just keeping up with everything would be a full time job. Then you've got to vote on it, tweak it if it doesn't pass, revote, etc. Budgeting by a committee of 300 million? Are you kidding me? Forget things like scheduling votes, determining what needs to be put forth as a bill or just trying to coral all the bills people would be putting in for consideration.

To refer to such a situation as pure chaos would be an understatement of epic proportions.

No, a representative republic is a good compromise. The key is making sure you elect good representatives.

Tyyr wrote:The key is making sure you elect good representatives.

I knew there was something we were forgetting to do!

I've got Alan-fething-Grayson as my representative. There are a LOT of people forgetting that step.

Frankly the amount of legislation passed by some parliaments is beyond anyone's capacity to keep track of.

For example, the UK parliament created something like 6,000 new criminal offences in the past 10 years -- this is on top of everything that already existed. The Solicitor General himself said he had no idea what they all might be and didn't think anyone else would either.

I think it was Frank Herbert who wrote a short story about a society that employed professional saboteurs to prevent legislation from overwhelming society.

Tyyr wrote:I've got Alan-fething-Grayson as my representative. There are a LOT of people forgetting that step.

I will raise you one Scott Brown.

I have Barbara Boxer. YMMV.

Tyyr wrote:

chowderhead13 wrote:If this isn't sarcasm, I think I'll blow a gasket.

Athenian democracy just doesn't work today. Sure it used to when you were dealing with a city state with a population of maybe a quarter million and territory you could walk across in a day at a brisk pace. When your population is pretty static, your laws half set because the gods say so, and your budget can be done on the back of a napkin you can work things directly.

You can't do it today. 300+ million people, a country you need a car and the better part of a week to get across, far flung trade and military interests with constant interaction and integration of new peoples and cultures.

The shear volume of legislation working its way through Congress at any given time would mean the only way you could stay on top of it would be to have nothing at all to do every day, all day, but read legislation. Forget doing research, talking to other people, or even really thinking it out and debating it. Just keeping up with everything would be a full time job. Then you've got to vote on it, tweak it if it doesn't pass, revote, etc. Budgeting by a committee of 300 million? Are you kidding me? Forget things like scheduling votes, determining what needs to be put forth as a bill or just trying to coral all the bills people would be putting in for consideration.

To refer to such a situation as pure chaos would be an understatement of epic proportions.

No, a representative republic is a good compromise. The key is making sure you elect good representatives.

You could just set up the votes as a twitter account and make everyone tweet yes or no on every decision. The real problem with something like this is if you had 51% of people who had some crazy idea like gay people can't get married, or slavery is good or anything that would violate basic rights of a group that isn't bigger than 51% of the people. With the speed technology is progressing a direct democracy would be doable, but it wouldn't be good.

Polonius wrote:BTW, that was hilarious Nugrlitch. I've felt that the words "gay agenda" have a pretty horrible meaning to the christian right, but damned if I know what it is.

Yeah, that was awesome Nurglitch. And I think the 'gay agenda' basically means people being openly gay, and going about their lives without shame. Seeing other people going about healthy, satisfying, openly gay lives when you're deep in the closet must be pretty confronting.

Not that this Asst Attorney General would be fighting any gay urges. No siree. Not at all.

BrockRitcey wrote:Athenian democracy just doesn't work today. Sure it used to when you were dealing with a city state with a population of maybe a quarter million and territory you could walk across in a day at a brisk pace. When your population is pretty static, your laws half set because the gods say so, and your budget can be done on the back of a napkin you can work things directly.

True. What's more, even at the scale of Athens they couldn't produce have direct democracy - it was only accessible to the top tiers of society.

Frazzled wrote:He's on leave now pending getting fired.
EDIT: I'd say so much for free speech, but I support the right of public employers (ie tax paid for supporters) terminating people who are abhorrent to the public.

Maybe - sort of. I think it matters when the abhorrent opinions relate to their job. I think if it was a machinist then they should be quite welcome to spend their weekends complaining about the takeover

But if the job involves a level of professional judgement relating to the issue he's completely nuts about, it's a different matter. The law plays a key role in protecting the rights of gay people, so when an Asst Attorney General is completely bonkers about the issue, it throws into doubt his willingness to use his offce to properly protect their rights. As such there's a decent case to be made that he isn't fit for office.

Of course, it may be possible he's executed his role admirably in protecting homosexuals, stranger things have happened. If that's true, and such cases can be provided, then he really should be entitled to keep his position.

this is true.

I think another point here is that his 1-man-crusade directly relates to his competence, not just to enforce the laws, but in a more general sense. The man is a political apointee and he's running around embarrassing his boss, who is an elected official. It speaks to his intelligence that, given the nature of his employment, he doesn't have the good sense to keep his stone age opinions to himself. So..... I guess to me the broader principle here is that he might be too dumb to fulfill the essential functions of his job, if he doesnt have the good sense to not do this kind of thing.

I encourage free speech as a basic tool of good governance however. It makes the wackos so much easier to identify and remove
AF


Automatically Appended Next Post:
That being said I don't think that asking the taxpayers to subsidize trans-gendered housing on campus was a particularly helpful suggestion on the part of this student activist. I mean suppose he carries the idea - what next? will the govt be paying for special dorms for midgets? super-stable, super-serene nurseries for autistic students? what about on-campus psychiatric wards so crazy people can go to school? At some level people have to be able to cope with their..... peculiarities.... and overcome the awkwardness it might cause them, or else they can't participate. It's not the government's job to babysit people.

The assistant AG is obviously a closet Gay. You can tell from the lip smack......and he has Gay eyes.

GG

AbaddonFidelis wrote:
That being said I don't think that asking the taxpayers to subsidize trans-gendered housing on campus was a particularly helpful suggestion on the part of this student activist. I mean suppose he carries the idea - what next? will the govt be paying for special dorms for midgets? super-stable, super-serene nurseries for autistic students? what about on-campus psychiatric wards so crazy people can go to school? At some level people have to be able to cope with their..... peculiarities.... and overcome the awkwardness it might cause them, or else they can't participate. It's not the government's job to babysit people.

As I understand it the student was campaigning for gender-blind housing, which means that students can cohabitate regardless of sex or gender identification. It also means that, in dorms where bathrooms are shared, at least some of the facilities will be open to all people, regardless of sexual or gender identification.

BrockRitcey wrote:You could just set up the votes as a twitter account and make everyone tweet yes or no on every decision. The real problem with something like this is if you had 51% of people who had some crazy idea like gay people can't get married, or slavery is good or anything that would violate basic rights of a group that isn't bigger than 51% of the people. With the speed technology is progressing a direct democracy would be doable, but it wouldn't be good.

...you think that's the biggest problem with that idea? No, the problem isn't allowing everyone to vote, that's simple. So simple I didn't even address it. The entire problem is that there is simply not enough time for anyone to keep up with all the legislation working its way through Congress, do research on it, formulate an opinion, debate about it, consider it some more, then cast an intelligent vote. We have an entire class of jobs called Congressmen who that's their only job and even they can't do it. They have to employ staffs, have other people write position papers, etc. to even have a hope of keeping up with a small fraction of it. There is no way direct democracy can work in a country of any size. There's just too much to do.

sebster wrote:

Tyyr wrote:Athenian democracy just doesn't work today. Sure it used to when you were dealing with a city state with a population of maybe a quarter million and territory you could walk across in a day at a brisk pace. When your population is pretty static, your laws half set because the gods say so, and your budget can be done on the back of a napkin you can work things directly.

True. What's more, even at the scale of Athens they couldn't produce have direct democracy - it was only accessible to the top tiers of society.

Only about one in four men actually qualified to vote and if memory serves most of them didn't. At some points they had to pay people to show up for votes because without it they couldn't reach a quorum.