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How is "another ranged" attack used if one is not used in the first place?

I don't care for the accusation that I changed my answer when I didn't...

I think there's a massive difference between a power you use in the shooting phase which stops you from shooting and a power that replaces your shooting attack.

ETA, the designers clearly agreed since the Ork, WH, DH & Eldar FAQs all specify.

MekanobSamael wrote:

Xca|iber wrote:Lets say that a model can peform "Take Action = Shooting." The BRB states that all models in unit must perform "Take Action = Shooting" at the same time. One model has the ability to perform "Take Action = X," with the caveat that it must be used instead (this word is used specifically) of "Take Action = Shooting." Instead means "In the stead of," which means "in place of". Therefore, if the model wishes to peform "Take Action = X," it must be done in place of "Take Action = Shooting," and since all "Take Action = Shooting" happens at the same time, "Take Action = X" must happen at the same time as the rest of the shooting.

Makes sense, but still something of a stretch.

Regardless, I don't see any reason to believe that fzorgle is a Psychic shooting attack, since, despite many similarities with other psychic shooting attacks, it is not referred to as such.

Ok, let's say for the sake of your position that fzorgle isn't a PSA. It is still done in lieu of shooting. If you wish to use the Lash it is instead of the unit's normal shooting, so if he is attached to another unit (and hence a part of that unit) you must declare who is firing at that time.

'Instead of using another ranged weapon' does not mean 'I won't shoot later'. It means 'instead of shooting now I'm going to do this now '.

That said, the fact that the power says 'instead of ANOTHER ranged weapon, makes it pretty clear that the Lash is a ranged weapon that is also a psychic power.

Gwar! wrote:I don't care for the accusation that I changed my answer when I didn't...

Don't blame you in the slightest. The responses don't bear out the accusation either.

Arctik_Firangi wrote:Ok, let's say for the sake of your position that fzorgle isn't a PSA. It is still done in lieu of shooting. If you wish to use the Lash it is instead of the unit's normal shooting, so if he is attached to another unit (and hence a part of that unit) you must declare who is firing at that time.

'Instead of using another ranged weapon' does not mean 'I won't shoot later'. It means 'instead of shooting now I'm going to do this now '.

That said, the fact that the power says 'instead of ANOTHER ranged weapon, makes it pretty clear that the Lash is a ranged weapon that is also a psychic power.

I conceded the when question above. The issue remaining is other shooting considerations, such as whether or not one can use fzorgle against the same unit as the rest of a unit.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Gwar! wrote:I don't care for the accusation that I changed my answer when I didn't...

I'll tell you what I remember. I remember showing my friend your post (he is familiar with dakkadakka), and our use of fzorgle just as it is written in Codex: Chaos Space Marines, and its subsequent ban from my gaming group. So, you're right, I'm not sure exactly what it said. I only remember how we played it (i.e. as a psychic power somewhere between a shooting attack and not). But we'll never know, since you edited it so soon after I cited you, and I, thinking your response would remain the same as I remembered it, didn't think to actually quote you.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Actually, I'm not making meaningful contributions at this point. I'm gonna do some research and get back to you guys on this one.

It IS a PSA, as it is used instead of firing ANOTHER ranged weapon.

So Lash IS a ranged weapon, by that textual question. It is a psychic ranged weapon.

It is a PSA. No ifs, buts, etc.

Sanctjud wrote:Which is one reason why some use Lash on a Daemon Prince platform .

Some? I'm confused here, you aren't using the word "All"

I still have misgivings, given that a PSA isn't the same as a ranged weapon. In the context, though, that does make sense, especially given that it's worded exactly the same way as doombolt and the other ones, and that that was before there was such a subset of psychic powers as psychic shooting attacks IIRC. It's all there implicitly.

Now, what I wanna know (being *my* thread, damnit ) where the fft did "fzorgle" come from?

Link to the link to the link: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/6156.page#201334.

Xca|iber wrote:All firing is resolved simultaneously.

/Thread.