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I don't think making any monster W7 is really a good idea, though. Aside from the weird things wizards sometimes turn into and the Great Unclean One, everyone's got six wounds.

On one side, I don't want to take that uniqueness from those monsters (the 'morphed wizards will probably just get poofed back into men or elves or whatever, and the Unclean One needs all the love he can get).

On the other, I think the potential to be instantly dropped by a cannon is a universal risk you take when you grab a big ol' monster. The odds are low, of course. For a number of reasons.

But, proportionally, I'd guess it would be like a dude (a crazy, cut dude hopped up on PCP in some cases, but still a dude) getting shot with a gun that fires base-ball sized rounds. When you look at it that way, getting hit and not dying pretty much all the time is a pretty sweet deal.

The uniqueness of beastmen is that they die in droves and run away like little bitches.

Beastmen are a middle of the road army. They do well against WS3 armies, because they are just a bit better.
They do well against WS4 armies, because they are on even ground.
They do poorly against WS5 armies, because they are priced as better than bottom rung, but gain no real advantage the top. Middle of the road means that beast armies will have to have units work together, more so than elite armies.

As for the poison discussion; outside of skinks, what are you worried about? One army has a stupid amount of poison shooting. You know what I say? Take Harpies.
Skirmish + Range + Stand and Fire = no poison. You strike before the skinks, with twice as many attacks, hitting on 3's and killing on 3's.
Harpies are the sweepers that clear the path for your monster(s).


-Matt

Other Poison problems? Jungle Swarms, I suppose. Kind of. But also Gutter Runners. How do you poison a sling? I don't know. I just pay for the upgrade and poison cannons to death.

I guess the only problem with the Harpy thing is that they can have way more Skinks than you. But that's an arms-race.

You bring up a good point, and one that I think is a nearly unavoidable flaw in Warhammer; there's not enough variation.

Example: T4 is better than T3, but against S6, who cares? You're paying for an advantage that doesn't always come up. It's only a d6, and there's just not enough on that lil' die to represent all the variety in the game.

In, say, a role-playing game, you get bonuses/penalties because of special abilities, which means you've always got a different % chance than those without them. I mean, sometimes the target numbers in those games are so high or low that those bonus don't matter either, but that happens a lot less.

I don't like all this armor-save nonsense. I don't want that, I don't want to be the same as Orcs.

The main problem is that we are plagued by overcosted units.

Gors, Minotaurs, Bestigors, and a gakload of our magical items.

Gors were a huge letdown for me. The center of my army is just too fething expensive for me to take enough of them that they become effective. Like, seriously, just one point off on a PPM basis would make them excellent. I'd be free another 90-100 point. Or even make the AHW/shield option free would do the same thing.

Bestigors as well. They really needed the option to go HW/Shield, and be given a shield as default for a better save. At 12 points, those buffs would make them very well-priced. Right now, they should be 10 PPM.

Seriously, tell Mr. Hoare and Mr. Kelly to keep their hands off my Beasts of the East.

Another 3 years until my beasts might be a "high tier" or even "middle tier" army.

Well, that is the corrolary of the "Extra T isn't as good as some armor after a point": each point of T above 4 or 5 isn't as valuable as an extra point of armor, so they should be cheaper. Of course, a 6+ save isn't as valuable as T4 usually, so it is tricky. I could theoretically work out Utility Functions for the two stats and provide Indifference curves that describe points of equal value for the price.

But I finished that exam 2 hours ago, and I don't feel like revisiting it. :-P

Well we can always hope that all other armies is in for a nerf

Warpsolution wrote:Other Poison problems? Jungle Swarms, I suppose. Kind of. But also Gutter Runners. How do you poison a sling? I don't know. I just pay for the upgrade and poison cannons to death.

Swarms aren't exactly sneaking up and peppering you to death; those are easy enough to deal with, and low enough init that any rank and file unit should chew them up.
Gutter runners... I forgot about those.
But at 18 points each for those poisoned slings, it's not exactly comparable to a skink issue. You'd be looking at ~300 points of shooting to drop a monster in 1 turn, and you still have to make it within range; you're Ld7 (no ranks). Jabberscythe loves these guys.
I'd worry more about warplightning cannons and doom wheels.

-Matt

Goblin BSBs can get the banner that gives a unit poison attacks. I lost a vermin lord to a hail of poison short bows :(