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All of the Chaos Gods were focused on that moment in time, one of the only times that has ever happened. The Chaos gods combined are certainly more powerful than the Emperor. I believe almost anything was attainable by the Chaos gods during those few moments.

From the Lexicanum:

"The Gellar field was invented along with the warp drive, allowing warp-capable ships and their occupants to actually survive the hostile environment of the warp. It protects the ship and its occupants from the hostility of the warp itself as well as from the predation of warp entities such as Daemons.

The Gellar field device emits a field called a Gellar field, essentially creating a bubble of real space around the ship. The weakening, failure, and collapse of a Gellar Field while the ship is traveling through the warp would be completely disastrous. Warp entities would tear the ship apart to reach and consume the souls of the crew."

Now, I agree that the explanation seems a tad ambiguious but when you add: "The most powerful gellar field in existence", I do not believe Ingethel can penetrate it. I also agree that the daemon telling them not to touch anything served 2 purposes:

1) Make the illusion more "real"
2) Prevent the marines from looking too closely as illusions may not stand up to minute inspection

If Argal Tal and his fellow marines remained loyal, what would probably happen is that the entire crew would be killed. Lorgar would get a message saying, "They were unworthy and not ready for the truth. Send in the next batch."

All of the Chaos Gods were focused on that moment in time, one of the only times that has ever happened. The Chaos gods combined are certainly more powerful than the Emperor. I believe almost anything was attainable by the Chaos gods during those few moments.

All agree that the 4 chaos gods reign supreme in their specific instance of the warp but are essentially powerless in real space because they cannot enter it (Why necrons why to separate real space and the warp for good). In fact, the more powerful a warp entity, the more difficult it becomes for it to manifest in our reality. Which is why the average human host wears out at an alarming clip when possessed by powerful warp entities.

Otherwise, they would have snuffed the candle that is the big E a long time ago. They were powerless, hence the need to corrupt real space entities like the space marines. They are not as powerful as they lead you to believe - at least in our reality.

I infer from the fluff that the Primarchs were essentially perfect and resistant to the predations of chaos. That was why chaos stole them away into the warp so that they become open to corruption. Even so, only 1/2 the group turned.

Lorgar in particular, was bathed in the warp for the longest time. This is so that he will serve as the catalyst for the HH.

His corruption was not easy as can be seen in his fight with Corax. He wanted to die because he could not reconcile what he had to do to bring about "enlightenment".

overkill76 wrote:
All agree that the 4 chaos gods reign supreme in their specific instance of the warp but are essentially powerless in real space because they cannot enter it (Why necrons why to separate real space and the warp for good). In fact, the more powerful a warp entity, the more difficult it becomes for it to manifest in our reality. Which is why the average human host wears out at an alarming clip when possessed by powerful warp entities.

Otherwise, they would have snuffed the candle that is the big E a long time ago. They were powerless, hence the need to corrupt real space entities like the space marines. They are not as powerful as they lead you to believe - at least in our reality.

I infer from the fluff that the Primarchs were essentially perfect and resistant to the predations of chaos. That was why chaos stole them away into the warp so that they become open to corruption. Even so, only 1/2 the group turned.

I disagree, in fact you contradict your self in the above post. You state that you believe the chaos powers are completley powerless in the material realm, but then go on to admit that they steal the Primarchs away.

An act that takes place in the material realm and right under the emperor's nose... that fact is as Canon as you can get.

And since we all know that, somehow some way, the Primarchs do indeed get stolen from "the most powerful Geller field ever," why is it so hard to believe that the way it happened is the way it was presented in the First Heretic.

I seriously doubt that the moment when the Primarchs are kidnapped will be covered again in the HH series... my money is on GW letting the actions that took place in The first Heretic speak for themselves. It seems obvious to me that they have said all they are giong to say on that.

And yes I know that for the most part the chaos gods themselves are completely powerless in the material realm... however as I stated before... this was one of the only times in history that all 4 chaos gods focused all of their power on one thing. As I said... that is why I think they were able to accomplish what they did.

Personally I wont be happy until I have seen the events in the Emperors gene labs from an imperial standpoint, I'm tired of seeing it from the POVs of weak minded dupes and spawns of chaos. Perhaps Valdor or one of the Emperors gene scientists could witness the event and lay down a testimony in a later book? Obviously seeing it from The Emperors eyes is never going to happen.

It just doesnt wash with me that the Chaos gods have gone all righteous and truthful all of a sudden, Chaos is based upon lies, falsehoods and corruption.

I am not disputing the fact that the Primarchs were stolen by the Chaos gods although the Emperor could have stopped them had he wanted to according to what we saw in Horus' vision in False Gods, Suggesting that while powerful daemonic forces were at work it was not the combined strength of all the Chaos gods as I agree with you that the Emperor probably couldnt have prevented it had that been true. All I am saying is that I dont believe the events in First Heretic make sense with what we know of Gellar fields. I believe the Gellar field was damaged or deactivated in some other way.

Ugly Green Trog wrote:
I am not disputing the fact that the Primarchs were stolen by the Chaos gods although the Emperor could have stopped them had he wanted to according to what we saw in Horus' vision in False Gods,

Horus' vision controlled completely by the forces of Chaos? You can't draw anything from that other than Horus resented his father.