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All artillery (including the manticore, which is a separate entry but has the same role) are useful. I love the manticore and the basilisk, as they are flexible and can hurt anything in the game. When I mean flexible I like the idea that they can choose to fire direct and indirect, and can also be effective on the move in direct fire mode. They can also hurt armor 14 vehicles.

The collossus and griffon are more infantry killers, although they can hurt lighter vehicles. Their only weakness is they cannot fire their main weapon on the move, but they may not need to move anyway.

The medusa is a great direct fire piece. Its weakness is that it has to fire direct, and thus HAS to expose itself to enemy fire to be effective. But it does have the best weapon to crack open heavily armored infantry and heavy tanks.

Again, all are good, as long as you use them to their strengths, and you are aware of their weakness (ie weak armor values). Hug cover as much as possible.

I have used Griffons extensively over the last couple of years. They are great against hordes naturally but also the threat of a repeated accurate S6 large template (or 2) can actually be quite distracting to some players who will chose not to ignore it and forget other more choice targets.

S6 Ordnace also makes it a threat against lightly armoured vehicles.

I have no problems with its armour as it will be sitting behind cover.

And all this for only 75 points, I tend to take 2.

DarkHound wrote:Here's a question I've never thought about: for whatever reason, could you fire one of the Basilisks directly, but the other indirectly? I don't think there is anything that prohibits it, just a thought that popped into my brain.

Yeah, I don't see why they couldn't either. I mean, if you had two missile launchers, you can shoot one in frag and one in krak against the same target. I think it's the fact that you have to shoot the same target, not in the same mode of fire that's important.

An interesting way to give basilisks cover saves will still being able to shoot both of them...

Ailaros wrote:

DarkHound wrote:Here's a question I've never thought about: for whatever reason, could you fire one of the Basilisks directly, but the other indirectly? I don't think there is anything that prohibits it, just a thought that popped into my brain.

Yeah, I don't see why they couldn't either. I mean, if you had two missile launchers, you can shoot one in frag and one in krak against the same target. I think it's the fact that you have to shoot the same target, not in the same mode of fire that's important.

An interesting way to give basilisks cover saves will still being able to shoot both of them...

Hey that's a thought. Hmmmmm...

I usually play two bassi and two medusae. The bassie shoots while the medusae waits at a designated killbox area, then shoot anything that tries to approach the bassies. The bassie may fire also at units trying to reach the medusae. The medusae need not expose themselves first turn and waste their destructive potential.

freddieyu1 wrote:

Ailaros wrote:

DarkHound wrote:Here's a question I've never thought about: for whatever reason, could you fire one of the Basilisks directly, but the other indirectly? I don't think there is anything that prohibits it, just a thought that popped into my brain.

Yeah, I don't see why they couldn't either. I mean, if you had two missile launchers, you can shoot one in frag and one in krak against the same target. I think it's the fact that you have to shoot the same target, not in the same mode of fire that's important.

An interesting way to give basilisks cover saves will still being able to shoot both of them...

Hey that's a thought. Hmmmmm...

Alairos is correct you can do it(and depending on range to your target/Intervening terrain, you may have to do it).

Say you have 2 Bassies; 1 is 33" from the target and in LOS, the other is 38" from the target and behind a building; you can fire the one out of LOS using the barrage rules, but the one in LOS is within min range and therefore must use the normal Blast rules. Also in this Case you will be rolling 2 separate scatters not using the Multiple barrage rules(since 1 is not firing as barrage at all anyway).

in the event that you can fire both as Barrage(target is a sufficient distance away) and the Closer one has LOS; remember that you get to subtract the BS of the Closer one when firing it's "ranging shot" and the second one will simply scatter off of the first(Going back to the Granting the unit Cover suggestion; you not only get cover for the 2 Bassies but also increase your barrages accuracy).

I have used a medusa quite a lot in my army (hybrid IG), always with enclosed crew compartment, because it tends to draw a lot of attention.
I think that the medusa is the only tank in the codex that it is worth paying 15 points for not getting +1 on the vehicle damage table, because of the fact that it has to fire directly and only is AV 12.
I might just take another one and make a squadron of two at some point, because two 5" STR 10 AP 2 templates would down almost everything in one round of firing.
Most of the time I don't run it with bastion breacher shells, because it decreases its anti-infantry effectiveness, which I don't see a need for since it still is able to kill tanks without BB shells and I field two squads of meltavets in chimeras already.
I always protect it with a 20-man blob squad, because a medusa is a deepstrikers prime target. I think I'll increase the squad to 30 or 40 guardsmen at larger point games if I choose to add another medusa, but so far the combo has been performing well at 1500 points.

If I give the stealth special rule to 1 out of 2 do they both gett it?

Neroku wrote:If I give the stealth special rule to 1 out of 2 do they both gett it?

Yes and no. By the GW main rulebook faq if anybody in a unit has stealth then everyone benefits. By the IG codex it's impossible to give camo nets to only part of a squadron so it's a moot point.

Oh I didn't know that meh though it's not a huge thing anyway

Not to be crass, here, but you're asking a lot of questions that are pretty clearly spelled out in both the rulebook and the codex. You actually own both of these books, right?

40k is a confusing game with lots of rules and options, but Dakka isn't a substitute for possessing the rules yourself. Just checking.

I do have both but when I read them I miss things or don't understand and ask questions is that wrong?

No, and this is a great place to ask. I was just checking.

Some people use forums as an excuse not to buy their codex/rulebook. Being confused is fine. Being lazy/cheap is another.

Lol ok I know what you meen now

I must have read the medusa info 10tines it never hit me that profile ment only that ammo

That's the thing with codecies. You can read them over and over, and still find new things...

That's very true and some times the wording dosent make sence for what the word meens untill some 1 points it out and it's like dang how didn't I see that.

Like before I use to fire the hull mounted HB of my medusa,but when I re-read the codex it should not have allowed it. So I make it clear to my opponents now that I cannot fire the hull mounted HB not unless the medusa's big gun got destroyed (which happens alot anyway, hehe)

Funny thing, you can fire both of your weapons if you upgrade the medusa with bastion breacher shells. When you take the upgrade it loses the ordnance type. It isn't every day that you'll want to do that, but it is possible.

Ohh cool idea, with the upgrade to BB then fire both weapons! Thanks.

Kommissar Kel wrote:Say you have 2 Bassies; 1 is 33" from the target and in LOS, the other is 38" from the target and behind a building; you can fire the one out of LOS using the barrage rules, but the one in LOS is within min range and therefore must use the normal Blast rules. Also in this Case you will be rolling 2 separate scatters not using the Multiple barrage rules(since 1 is not firing as barrage at all anyway).

in the event that you can fire both as Barrage(target is a sufficient distance away) and the Closer one has LOS; remember that you get to subtract the BS of the Closer one when firing it's "ranging shot" and the second one will simply scatter off of the first(Going back to the Granting the unit Cover suggestion; you not only get cover for the 2 Bassies but also increase your barrages accuracy).

I use this sometimes. It's difficult to do, but a pretty nice trick if you can pull it off. 4+ cover save for both, accurate shots, multiple barrages equating to more hits. Yep, it's pretty good when it works!

L. Wrex

Griffons are definitely capable of killing a lot of infantry. It's like, the most efficient killer of light-medium infantry out of cover in the whole book.

If that appeals to you and you're not afraid of cover saves and people spreading out on you, maybe look into proxying a pair.

Generally people that use artillery in their army are a bit stingy with the HS slots, but there's nothing wrong with the griffon itself if you're looking to fight hordes, apart from there not being a model.

Generally people that use artillery in their army are a bit stingy with the HS slots

Because they also want to pack as many manticores in there as possible?

mindfield wrote:Like before I use to fire the hull mounted HB of my medusa,but when I re-read the codex it should not have allowed it. So I make it clear to my opponents now that I cannot fire the hull mounted HB not unless the medusa's big gun got destroyed (which happens alot anyway, hehe)

Do you find the bolter useful on artillery? I must say that I prefer the flamer on all my chimera hulls (except the hydra). I find that after the main gun is gone it is better to drop a template on a squad than fire a few bolter shots.

I guess I'd rather have the flamer also except like you said the hydra


But then again by the time you lose the weapon you may not be able to get in range with the flamer

Neroku wrote:I guess I'd rather have the flamer also except like you said the hydra


But then again by the time you lose the weapon you may not be able to get in range with the flamer

Well as long as you are not playing killpoints you can just charge it forward, it is likely to at least be able to cover an objective.

Kommissar Kel wrote:

freddieyu1 wrote:

Ailaros wrote:

DarkHound wrote:Here's a question I've never thought about: for whatever reason, could you fire one of the Basilisks directly, but the other indirectly? I don't think there is anything that prohibits it, just a thought that popped into my brain.

Yeah, I don't see why they couldn't either. I mean, if you had two missile launchers, you can shoot one in frag and one in krak against the same target. I think it's the fact that you have to shoot the same target, not in the same mode of fire that's important.

An interesting way to give basilisks cover saves will still being able to shoot both of them...

Hey that's a thought. Hmmmmm...

Alairos is correct you can do it(and depending on range to your target/Intervening terrain, you may have to do it).

Say you have 2 Bassies; 1 is 33" from the target and in LOS, the other is 38" from the target and behind a building; you can fire the one out of LOS using the barrage rules, but the one in LOS is within min range and therefore must use the normal Blast rules. Also in this Case you will be rolling 2 separate scatters not using the Multiple barrage rules(since 1 is not firing as barrage at all anyway).

in the event that you can fire both as Barrage(target is a sufficient distance away) and the Closer one has LOS; remember that you get to subtract the BS of the Closer one when firing it's "ranging shot" and the second one will simply scatter off of the first(Going back to the Granting the unit Cover suggestion; you not only get cover for the 2 Bassies but also increase your barrages accuracy).

You do have to be an expert at guessing ranges in this situation, at least until the next edition where presumable we go down the road of WHFB 8th ed and get to premeasure....which was a BRILLIANT move btw by GW...solves all those arguments of "I'm sure I'm within range" and "No you were not!!!"


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Trickstick wrote:

mindfield wrote:Like before I use to fire the hull mounted HB of my medusa,but when I re-read the codex it should not have allowed it. So I make it clear to my opponents now that I cannot fire the hull mounted HB not unless the medusa's big gun got destroyed (which happens alot anyway, hehe)

Do you find the bolter useful on artillery? I must say that I prefer the flamer on all my chimera hulls (except the hydra). I find that after the main gun is gone it is better to drop a template on a squad than fire a few bolter shots.

I prefer the heavy bolter...cuz my artillery are allergic with closing in with the enemy...

I usually put the hull mounted flamers on the vet chimeras, theyre the ones who has to close with the enemy positions, otherwise I also put HB on the artillery hulls, gives me that sense of shooting them still while being a little far away, since by the time marines are in flamer range it would have been too late

Heavy Bolters on Hydras (they want to be stationary anyways), and on Manticores (so they have something to shoot if they survive to turn 5-7). Other than that, I tend to go all Heavy Flamers. Sure, the flamer on a Griffon feels out of place, but it is useful against wolf scouts, snikrot, etc.

mindfield wrote:I usually put the hull mounted flamers on the vet chimeras, theyre the ones who has to close with the enemy positions, otherwise I also put HB on the artillery hulls, gives me that sense of shooting them still while being a little far away, since by the time marines are in flamer range it would have been too late

I disagree. If marines are in flamer range then it is exactly the right time to have a flamer. A bolter will likely do nothing to help but the flamer could take down a couple. As you are not likely to use it for more than one turn, you need to get all the killing power into that turn that you can.

Besides, remembering to fire a single heavy bolter is annoying.

Trickstick wrote:

mindfield wrote:I usually put the hull mounted flamers on the vet chimeras, theyre the ones who has to close with the enemy positions, otherwise I also put HB on the artillery hulls, gives me that sense of shooting them still while being a little far away, since by the time marines are in flamer range it would have been too late

I disagree. If marines are in flamer range then it is exactly the right time to have a flamer. A bolter will likely do nothing to help but the flamer could take down a couple. As you are not likely to use it for more than one turn, you need to get all the killing power into that turn that you can.

Besides, remembering to fire a single heavy bolter is annoying.

But your not gonna fire a heavy flamer if you still have your main weapon, don't forget that you cant fire both your guns when your main gun is ordnance. If you lose your main cannon I'd could see the flamer being better but the way I set up on the board I block my opponent from being able to charge my artillery. So when I lose my gun and I'm still mobile I don't have enough turns to get to the closest unit I'd rather just fire a few heavy bolter shots and stay back

On another note how do you guys show hydras since there's no model and the forgeworld 1 is 80$ each +they miscast them a lot