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Nocturn wrote:I think that the ST's statline should be:

Storm Trooper:
WS: 4
BS: 4
S: 3
T: 3
W: 1
I: 4
A: 1
Ld: 8
SV: 4+

Storm Trooper Sgt.:
WS: 4
BS: 4
S: 3
T: 3
W: 1
I: 4
A: 2
Ld: 9
SV: 4+

They're considered the best troops in the guard(I say troops, but not meaning in a FOC way).

And I know people will argue that they shouldn't have the same WS as marines, because of the extended training the marines have. I present 2 points:

1. Storm trooper training starts at a very young age, so it makes more sense that they have a higher WS than a guardsman, who doesn't get nearly that much training.
2. Celestians (4th ed. C:WH) have the same WS as marines, but are humans, just like the ST's.

Not to mention that you get way more for less with the Celestians. +1 to ld, a 3+ sv, and faith points. All for 13 points.

Astartes training starts at a young age, is more selective (each and every astartes would have still been a hero even unaugmented) is supercondensed in their hypno-training (i.e. a decade in a month or so) are about ten times stronger than a human, about 20 times as tough, have redundancy built into them, can adapt to just about any environment, can spit poison, are faster, more agile, live more hundreds of years, and hundreds of battles, have equipment that makes Stormtrooper's equipment look silly, don't need sleep (to any practical extent anyways [meaning more training in the same amount of time]) AND dey' be pimpin'.

What you fail to realize with the stat system of GW is that it is exponential. If a stormtrooper were WS 4, he would have to be 10-99 times more skilled in CC that a standard Imperial Guardsman.

im2randomghgh wrote:

Nocturn wrote:I think that the ST's statline should be:

Storm Trooper:
WS: 4
BS: 4
S: 3
T: 3
W: 1
I: 4
A: 1
Ld: 8
SV: 4+

Storm Trooper Sgt.:
WS: 4
BS: 4
S: 3
T: 3
W: 1
I: 4
A: 2
Ld: 9
SV: 4+

They're considered the best troops in the guard(I say troops, but not meaning in a FOC way).

And I know people will argue that they shouldn't have the same WS as marines, because of the extended training the marines have. I present 2 points:

1. Storm trooper training starts at a very young age, so it makes more sense that they have a higher WS than a guardsman, who doesn't get nearly that much training.
2. Celestians (4th ed. C:WH) have the same WS as marines, but are humans, just like the ST's.

Not to mention that you get way more for less with the Celestians. +1 to ld, a 3+ sv, and faith points. All for 13 points.

Astartes training starts at a young age, is more selective (each and every astartes would have still been a hero even unaugmented) is supercondensed in their hypno-training (i.e. a decade in a month or so) are about ten times stronger than a human, about 20 times as tough, have redundancy built into them, can adapt to just about any environment, can spit poison, are faster, more agile, live more hundreds of years, and hundreds of battles, have equipment that makes Stormtrooper's equipment look silly, don't need sleep (to any practical extent anyways [meaning more training in the same amount of time]) AND dey' be pimpin'.

What you fail to realize with the stat system of GW is that it is exponential. If a stormtrooper were WS 4, he would have to be 10-99 times more skilled in CC that a standard Imperial Guardsman.

See point 2 above.

I'm not proposing that we increase the strength or toughness of the stormies, just account for their better training. Battle sisters are regular humans in power armor. They don't have "hypno-training" like space marines do, but they still have the same WS. It's not unreasonable to believe that the IG's finest would have access to the same training.

Nocturn wrote:

im2randomghgh wrote:

Nocturn wrote:I think that the ST's statline should be:

Storm Trooper:
WS: 4
BS: 4
S: 3
T: 3
W: 1
I: 4
A: 1
Ld: 8
SV: 4+

Storm Trooper Sgt.:
WS: 4
BS: 4
S: 3
T: 3
W: 1
I: 4
A: 2
Ld: 9
SV: 4+

They're considered the best troops in the guard(I say troops, but not meaning in a FOC way).

And I know people will argue that they shouldn't have the same WS as marines, because of the extended training the marines have. I present 2 points:

1. Storm trooper training starts at a very young age, so it makes more sense that they have a higher WS than a guardsman, who doesn't get nearly that much training.
2. Celestians (4th ed. C:WH) have the same WS as marines, but are humans, just like the ST's.

Not to mention that you get way more for less with the Celestians. +1 to ld, a 3+ sv, and faith points. All for 13 points.

Astartes training starts at a young age, is more selective (each and every astartes would have still been a hero even unaugmented) is supercondensed in their hypno-training (i.e. a decade in a month or so) are about ten times stronger than a human, about 20 times as tough, have redundancy built into them, can adapt to just about any environment, can spit poison, are faster, more agile, live more hundreds of years, and hundreds of battles, have equipment that makes Stormtrooper's equipment look silly, don't need sleep (to any practical extent anyways [meaning more training in the same amount of time]) AND dey' be pimpin'.

What you fail to realize with the stat system of GW is that it is exponential. If a stormtrooper were WS 4, he would have to be 10-99 times more skilled in CC that a standard Imperial Guardsman.

See point 2 above.

I'm not proposing that we increase the strength or toughness of the stormies, just account for their better training. Battle sisters are regular humans in power armor. They don't have "hypno-training" like space marines do, but they still have the same WS. It's not unreasonable to believe that the IG's finest would have access to the same training.

Except regular SOB have the same training intensity/length as ST and are WS3.

im2randomghgh wrote:

Nocturn wrote:

im2randomghgh wrote:

Nocturn wrote:I think that the ST's statline should be:

Storm Trooper:
WS: 4
BS: 4
S: 3
T: 3
W: 1
I: 4
A: 1
Ld: 8
SV: 4+

Storm Trooper Sgt.:
WS: 4
BS: 4
S: 3
T: 3
W: 1
I: 4
A: 2
Ld: 9
SV: 4+

They're considered the best troops in the guard(I say troops, but not meaning in a FOC way).

And I know people will argue that they shouldn't have the same WS as marines, because of the extended training the marines have. I present 2 points:

1. Storm trooper training starts at a very young age, so it makes more sense that they have a higher WS than a guardsman, who doesn't get nearly that much training.
2. Celestians (4th ed. C:WH) have the same WS as marines, but are humans, just like the ST's.

Not to mention that you get way more for less with the Celestians. +1 to ld, a 3+ sv, and faith points. All for 13 points.

Astartes training starts at a young age, is more selective (each and every astartes would have still been a hero even unaugmented) is supercondensed in their hypno-training (i.e. a decade in a month or so) are about ten times stronger than a human, about 20 times as tough, have redundancy built into them, can adapt to just about any environment, can spit poison, are faster, more agile, live more hundreds of years, and hundreds of battles, have equipment that makes Stormtrooper's equipment look silly, don't need sleep (to any practical extent anyways [meaning more training in the same amount of time]) AND dey' be pimpin'.

What you fail to realize with the stat system of GW is that it is exponential. If a stormtrooper were WS 4, he would have to be 10-99 times more skilled in CC that a standard Imperial Guardsman.

See point 2 above.

I'm not proposing that we increase the strength or toughness of the stormies, just account for their better training. Battle sisters are regular humans in power armor. They don't have "hypno-training" like space marines do, but they still have the same WS. It's not unreasonable to believe that the IG's finest would have access to the same training.

Except regular SOB have the same training intensity/length as ST and are WS3.

Yes, but the point I was making was that non-space marine humans are still capable of having a WS of 4.

Nice rules!
I think they are better than the current ones