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Well shoot! My brother didn't care for Warmachine, but thought Hordes looked kind of cool, and since we were torn, that's what caused us to drop it...


Going to have to get him to take another look now, do either have an advantage over the other? Since Warmachine is guns and stuff, and I haven't looked into Hordes, but it's swords mostly, isn't it?

Edit: Also, I figured it was like Warhammer; seperate games using the same basic rule set.

They're designed to play against each other, and fully compatible.

*Sorry, other poster beat me to it*

Ok, another rulesquestion: I can see that Hammerfall High Sheild Gun Corps can marshal a Rhulic Warjack, so is giving them a Groundback Gunner a good idea? The Gunners state that they are Focus Easy, and I was thinking it might give them a bit of Range for how low range the HHSGC have.

To answer your question more thoroughly: Warmachine and Hordes isn't like 40k/Fantasy, which are two separate games that play very differently. It's more like two different expansions for Magic: The Gathering: the core rule set is the same, but different sets have different signature mechanics that define them. Except that you can't put hordes models in Warmachine armies. . . unless you're Magnus or a minion or something. . .

. . .

Long story short, the two games are fully compatible, yes.

Whether one has an advantage over the other is something everyone argues over. In Warmachine, your warcaster gets focus and gives it out to their warjacks, while in Hordes, your warlock pokes their warbeasts and makes them angry, then eats their Fury and uses it to their own ends (kinda like an internet troll) while trying not to make them so angry they flip out and break things. So in Warmachine, your warcaster is like a battery, giving out power to their warjacks, while in Hordes, your warbeasts are like generators, feeding power to your warlock.

And jack marshalling a gun bunny is not really a good idea: they only get Powerful Attack if you spend a Focus, and jack marshals don't give focus to their marshalled warjacks (they give a pseudo-focus thing that does some things similar, but not everything that focus can do).

Slarg232 wrote:Well shoot! My brother didn't care for Warmachine, but thought Hordes looked kind of cool, and since we were torn, that's what caused us to drop it...


Going to have to get him to take another look now, do either have an advantage over the other? Since Warmachine is guns and stuff, and I haven't looked into Hordes, but it's swords mostly, isn't it?

Edit: Also, I figured it was like Warhammer; seperate games using the same basic rule set.

Some people will say that hordes has an advantage due to the fury mechanic but there is no evidence of that in the tournament results. As for the mostly swords comment, not really in my opinion. It's that the big things in the army are feral beasts only restrained by the warlocks, the units and such have their guns and/or swords.

Slarg232 wrote:Ok, another rulesquestion: I can see that Hammerfall High Sheild Gun Corps can marshal a Rhulic Warjack, so is giving them a Groundback Gunner a good idea? The Gunners state that they are Focus Easy, and I was thinking it might give them a bit of Range for how low range the HHSGC have.

The rules for marshalling a jack are slightly different as a jack marshall can't give a jack focus. All you can do is one per turn boost a roll, charge, run or or make an additional attack. The reason for a gunner to be focus easy is that one focus can boost both the attack and damage roll. I think the internet suggests giving the unit an Avalancher but I have no experience with that.

edit: Ninja'd :(

Slarg232 wrote:Well shoot! My brother didn't care for Warmachine, but thought Hordes looked kind of cool, and since we were torn, that's what caused us to drop it...


Going to have to get him to take another look now, do either have an advantage over the other? Since Warmachine is guns and stuff, and I haven't looked into Hordes, but it's swords mostly, isn't it?

Edit: Also, I figured it was like Warhammer; seperate games using the same basic rule set.

Just to add into what others have said, Hordes and Warmachine are completely compatible. The core rules are the same, with the difference being in how Warlocks/Warcasters work with their respective Beasts or Jacks. There are five factions plus mercs in WM and four plus minions in Hordes. Hordes is a little less filled out than WM due to it being the younger game, but their system is generally more refined with things learned through WM. Mercs and Minions can be taken by the main factions or used in their own armies, and in some cases across the game systems. Some Mercs will work for Hordes and some Minions will work for WM. Heck, epic Magnus can be taken in a Skorne army as the second caster, so you can have Jacks in a Hordes army.

They have some balance issues, but they are minor for the most part. The biggest thing is that certain abilities are useless across system. Disruption, for example, effects Warjacks so is useless against Warbeasts. Overall they work very well together and expand the game greatly as there are 9 main and two subfactions to chose from.

Or to put it a bit less snarkily, yes. Both Warmachine and Hordes use the same core rules mechanic. Their methods of managing their magic is a bit different, but they were designed to play against each other from the start. And now that MKII is nice and salty, they are actually balanced!

Iiiiiinnnteresting..... Definatley going to have him look at it again.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Ok, another quick question: Is there any Warmahorde list that is completley viable, and can be assembled under $100? 25 pts, preferably.

Slarg232 wrote:Iiiiiinnnteresting..... Definatley going to have him look at it again.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Ok, another quick question: Is there any Warmahorde list that is completley viable, and can be assembled under $100? 25 pts, preferably.

$100 bucks is cutting it close (you would probably wind up a few points down honestly). However a 25 point army shouldn't cost you more than $150.

Battlebox nets you either 11 or 14 points ($50) then add in a 10ish point unit (usually runs around $50) fill out points with Solos/Unit Attachments ($10-$25).

Man.... I hope he will find that acceptable, because I really don't want to have to buy my own army ($134) and then have to top off my dads.....

Slarg232 wrote:Man.... I hope he will find that acceptable, because I really don't want to have to buy my own army ($134) and then have to top off my dads.....

Well what armies are you guys doing. I can try to be more helpful. If money is a real issue you could just start playing 20 point games if both of you can't get to 25 (then you can expand once you get the mechanics down).

I don't know which one he's looking at.

I just cut us down to 15 pts and have based all of the armies around the starter boxes and added things to them, all of the sample armies I made are from 65 to 95 dollars.

I wouldn't necessarily look at something just because it is a cheap model. If you start playing, you are going to get addicted. You will find excuses to spend more and to continue expanding. These games are like crack. The worst thing you could do is buy something you'll regret. Get something you'll love, even if it means you need to play points short.

On the compatability thing, as an example, when I started playing, my friends mostly had the following factions:
- Cygnar x 2
- Cryx x 2
- Khador x 2
- Protectorate
- Circle (Me)

That was a lot of my local gaming group for a few years. Over time we got more Mercenaries, more Cryx, more KHador, more Protectorate, and a few people picking up Hordes as their second Faction. I, all that time, pretty much played Circle exclusively, only playing Mercenaries a couple times via borrowed stuff of friends during a couple tournaments back when they were segregated.

Nowadays there's a lot more variety (I picked up the game when my Faction had a whole two warlocks physically released) but the tournaments have some pretty good balance to them.

Also, the reason for the less "industrialized" look to Hordes is mostly where the factions are based. Most are either originating from primative, disperse tribal groups (Legion and Trollbloods), are a disperse secret society of terrorist-Cthulu-taming Illumnati Druids (Circle), or an army based on Persia/China/Japan stuff, honor code issues, and still has gas-powered needle guns.

Also, some Minion stuff has pigmen with carbines. The way I look at it more is just industrialized states versus more disperse, non-national groups.

And stuff.

Slarg232 wrote:Ok, another quick question: Is there any Warmahorde list that is completley viable, and can be assembled under $100? 25 pts, preferably.

All right, stop here. Before you go any further, I need to make a serious suggestion.

Before you go any further into Warmachine, before you start looking at lists and prices and 25 point options, pick up the battle boxes and rule book and play about ten games with only a warcaster/warlock and warjacks/warbeast. Warmahordes has a very steep learning curve if you're not careful: there's a lot to keep track of, so you need to train yourself to do the very basic parts (allocating focus / understanding fury) by rote before you go on to even 25 points.

I made the mistake of jumping into 50 point games too early, and found out that when my friends started playing, and I started playing battlebox games with them to teach them how to play, that my gameplay at the higher points level started to improve dramatically.

You'll have plenty of time to expand your army later, and I think you'll find that slowly expanding your collection over time will hurt your wallet a lot less than doing it all at once.

themocaw has it pretty much down. I would start with the battle box (always a great investment), and work on the key mechanics of the game. Units are pretty easy to add in later. (Ok, pretty much what themocaw said, but I felt like typing a little more...)