Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Necrontyr40k wrote:He won't be assaulting the power blob with TH/SS terminators but with purifiers.

There is no mention of purifiers in that list and GK can't take TH/SS terminators

i know this is about grey knights but power blobs should stay away from BA dreads w/BT.like on another table,or in another game


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Grundz wrote:

Necrontyr40k wrote:He won't be assaulting the power blob with TH/SS terminators but with purifiers.

There is no mention of purifiers in that list and GK can't take TH/SS terminators

he can take daemon hammers though which are worse,not for IG but for other powerblob hoarde armys with multi wound craetures,like warbosses and hive tyrants.especially hive tyrants

The wonderful thing about blobs is that they're in a Guard army, so the units they really match up poorly against can be shot off the board instead of engaged in combat. Purifiers are not resistant to Guard shooting.

Also about the dreadnought thing... Yeah he could take a priest or krak grenades... Or, you know, one or two sergeants can take a meltabomb, which should be done in every single powerblob to prevent just this sort of thing along with tank shock.

melta bombsd are great for tank shocks because they automatically hit,but to hit a dread you need 6s

I forgot to mention that my friend is also a cruel bastard in that while he deep strikes with termies and Mordrak he sends his land raiders marching forward only to open up an unleash his purifiers on me. My crappy dice rolling fails to pop the LRs on their way across the board, mostly because Mordrak has already decimated my lascannon heavy weapons team. One attack wiped out an entire 20 man blob with extra wounds that went unassigned. I now have a vendetta which may be able to address the land raiders, at least for one turn, before I get blown out of the sky.

one or two sergeants can take a meltabomb

Depending on one or two attacks per phase that only hit on sixes (Yes, I know, you could immobilize it and only have to roll 4+, but I am assuming that since it is not.) isn't that awesome either. Guard has a lot of shooting that can reliably deal with dreads, but very little CC. So shoot the walkers until they die.

Cursed Dice wrote:I forgot to mention that my friend is also a cruel bastard in that while he deep strikes with termies and Mordrak he sends his land raiders marching forward only to open up an unleash his purifiers on me. My crappy dice rolling fails to pop the LRs on their way across the board, mostly because Mordrak has already decimated my lascannon heavy weapons team. One attack wiped out an entire 20 man blob with extra wounds that went unassigned. I now have a vendetta which may be able to address the land raiders, at least for one turn, before I get blown out of the sky.

So we still dont know what point value you are playing, but I primarily see a lack of models (do you use stand-ins until you buy the right stuff? if not, you should) and letting your opponent dictate the game. I mean, one lascannon heavy weapon team is not a core of anti tank for any army, ever.

If morty deep strikes and fires, his squad shouldn't survive that turn in anything more than broken shambles.

Land raiders are a case of suicide melta, strentch 10 ordinance, or as a last resort lascannons or missle launchers, you really want to use the first two if you can.
Once the land raider blows, it should be removed and replaced with a crator that the purifiers have to deploy into, then you fire leman russes at the clusered up squad and remove it from play.

I think it might be pudent for you to pick up vassel and get some game in

should only be replaced with a crater if you have one.besides the crater gives them a 4+ cover.

if you have the points conscripts are ideal, but only if you can afford to give them chenkov and send in the next wave, put them in a big ring around your forces to prevent DS and as soon as you think theyre gonna die just remove them and put a fresh lot on, also you can remove them in order to shoot too, i like running them as a wall around plasma chimeras and some artillery, the artillery forces your opponent to come to you, the plasma deals with heavy infantry. it doesnt matter to much what you use though the point is to have something really shooty so you can deal with anything close in one turn. i also like vendettas more than russes stick a ccs with meltas in it and outflank with it. the amount of vehicles you can pop with a vendetta that drops twin linking meltas is scary, even if you dont kill it they incapacitate practically anything, alternatley plasma can be quite effective in that setup too although you have very little chance against landraiders, getting behind anything else more or less dooms it.

Penal Legion are also quite good... depending which special rule they get.

I played a game the other day, had SM Termies in my flank but had my Legionnaires in reserve. Thanks to scout, they came in on the flank (though I wish it'd been the other flank, against a tactical squad) and held the Termies down for two turns, allowing the rest of my army to deal with the rest of the Rhino-mounted force I was up against.

I had the Psychopaths rule, so they didn't go down without a fight. They died eventually, and only killed three. However with stubborn they gave me just enough time to hold them at bay and deal with the rest of my opponent's army.

Thanks for all the advice. Hopefully I will play him again soon and do better.

You might want to grab a couple of Rough Rider Squads to for counter attacking. A Min sized squad puts out 13 I5 S5 power attacks on the charge, for only 55 pts. Admittedly after that they're not doing much, but if they kill 4 MEQ, which on average they should, they've probably made back their points. At 55 pts if they even kill one Terminator, you're rcouping your losses.

I've been meaning to grab a couple squads with melta bombs. In the even they survive their suicidal charge, they can run around throwing melta bombs at the backs of vehicles.

I have a rough rider squad. If I can keep them from being shot at and dispersing, they are usually helpful. A squad of 5 can usually take out two termies on the charge if I throw average dice, which makes up their point cost. Not to mention the moral victory of a guard unit killing a terminator in CC. I've never had them survive long enough to melta bomb a vehicle, but hopefullly one of these days. I don't mind using them because they are relatively cheap. The downside is that in annihilation they are almost a guaranteed kill point for your opponent.

So I looked at this thread, and I see some indicators that you might be just doing something wrong. How many Ghost Knights is he sending in with Mordrak? What are you firing at him that first turn he deep strikes in? How much/what AP1 and AP2 do you have in your average list?

Even without the bubble wrap, I'm kind of surprised that Mordrak is actually getting to you. However, it sounds to me like you see the land raiders and develop target priority issues. If Mordrak and his squad are within 12" of any of you turn 1, he is almost always Priority One. The land raiders don't matter, and I'll tell you why.

In a regular game on a 6'x4' table, pitched battle, troops inside a land raider shouldn't be able to threaten any further than roughly 32" from the opponent's table edge turn 1. That means that a first turn assault should be all but impossible. Turn 2, assuming he didn't disembark, he can threaten up to 44" from his table edge. This means the following:

Turn 1 - Your safe zone directly across from the Land Raider is 16".
Turn 2 - Your safe zone directly across from the Land Raider is 4".

This is assuming there's no terrain in the way for him to have to difficult terrain move through to assault you. This also means that you have time to run away from him. If you take more consideration into how terrain is set up (and you BOTH are setting up terrain together, right?) or deploy against your table edge, then you should be able to stay safe even in Turn 2. You might even be able to lure him out of his land raider with a greedy assault turn 2, and counterfire.

Assuming you do go with the bubblewrap, I recommend a 20-30 man squad with power weapons and a commissar (with power weapon). Give your PCS plasma or meltas. Line your blob around the stuff to be protected as others have described. Be sure to bury the PCS in where they can't be multiassaulted. When the blob gets hit, keep in mind the average number of powerblob deaths per enemy model left. On his turn, if it seems like you won't have enough to make it back to his turn again, then remove the commissar. You may want to consider removing the sergeants at this point also, though I enjoy getting those last couple wounds in. Depends on if he has anything going on I1. If he does, then remove them as casualties. You WANT your troops to break at this point. He is the trigger in the beartrap you've just set upon your enemy. When your guys break, have the PCS eat them with their AP1/2. Fire everything else you have at the unit. Congratulations, you traded less than 200 points of yours for a decent amount of his.

If you want, post your list and his as best you can remember, and I will make recommendations about that, but I can't abide throwing out list building suggestions without even knowing what you and he have at the present.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, who normally goes first? Does he give you turn one? Do you normally take it if you win the roll off?

This might actually be one of those situations where you going second would be more advantageous. You can deploy as far away from his land raiders as you care to, maybe giving yourself another turn's worth of time in the process, and it also forces him to play Mordrak before you do first turn firing. This is much more situational though, and I wouldn't do it every time.

Update. I just played my buddy's Grey Knights again and won. He used Mordrak and didn't kill anything with him. I bubble wrapped my basilisks with a powerblob and had a squad of rough riders nearby. I had CCS with Straken in a Chimera near an objective. He therefore deep striked Mordrak near one of my Leman Russes on the far side of the table. First round after deep strike I had a chimera with melta vets come on behind him. Multilaser and melta spam from the hatch killed off Morty's retinue. Next round he glanced my tank from behind and he suffered two wounds from the chimera. Next round, once again didn't destroy my Russ. The melta vets toasted him after that.

I did learn, much to my sorrow, the horrors of purifiers in assault. Unbeknownst to me, they have cleansing flame or something that hits everyone each turn, because my buddy never fails his rolls. The powerblob and rough riders charged into the group, which I had weakened a little by shooting. They got fried by the cleansing flame. Apparently purifiers have an iniative of 6 which trumped my rough riders I5. Thankfully the majority of the wounds went onto the powerblob so I had a few power weapon attack from the riders. End result, the squad of purifiers kicked my rough riders' and powerblob's (it was only 2 comined squads but with a Commissar and 2 sgts with power weapons) butt. I got him down to two in his squad.

My friend chuckled after the fact knowing that I was ignorant of the close combat perks of purifiers. Well, fool me once shame on you. Hopefully I'll remember and not repeat the mistake a second time. I did take great pleasure in decimating a squad of terminators with two chimeras with melta vets before they could do anything.

I seriously doubt they have Int 6.Did you check the codex or juast take his word for it?

Congrats on your win. Concerning the I6, anything in the GK army can theoretically be I6 if it has a Nemesis Force Halibred. They give +2 Init modifier. Sounds like it didn't matter at the end of the day though.

Oh,if they had halberds then yes.I thought it was base Int.

Yes he did pimp them up with Halberds.

They may not be IG, but taking three full Vanguard squads with plasma pistols and powers weapons works every time. With these bad boys leading your advances onto objectives, he'll suffer a punishing volley of plasma fire followed by SM'S with power weapons and multiple attacks and frags butchering him before he can raise a force weapon. If the Vanguards are assaulted, not only do they have a chance of surviving and winning or killing their fair share of GK's, they'll buy your guard enough time to reform their positions accordingly, so when they GK's do break from combat, they're met with yet more plasma from your Vets.etc. Sternguard Vets to a lesser degree might be worth considering, as their vengeance rounds sting like a bitch when their shot at power armoured units (although it's not a good idea to rapid fire unless urgently needed).

I understand your clever and well planned tactics,but am unsure what this has to do with the thread?

Do NOT give power blobs melta bombs. You open up a lame tactic that i've used against guardsman before.

I've sent in my venerable dread, tying up the guardsman, while forcing the squad of 50 to pile up in a nice little circle around my dreadnought. On my turn I used the dreadnought reroll to try to keep the dreadnought alive, and he got immobilized. Now that meltabomb hits on weapon skill. On the guard player's turn I used the rerolls to get vehicle exploded.

The two of us together didn't have enough dice to roll the wounds required.

Also, keep in mind that if need be, you can assign a wound to the commissar on purpose. That means it's not just a tarpit...it's a controllable tarpit. The moment the tarpit is inconvenient you can end it.

This is why i advocate power blobs of 30 or smaller. I like the craziness of 50, but you only really need to hold for a turn or two at most. Just make sure that you assign the wound to your commissar on your opponent's turn.

How many models can go in a IG unit?