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If they're going to be so draconian, they should probably know that "malus" is a kind of apple tree. It is not synonymous with "penalty".

chaos0xomega wrote:Meh, I find the entire concept of a national team championship to be ridiculous, but maybe its just me. Am curious what the infractions were though.

As Americans the only honorable thing to do would have been to immediately take over the country at point of whippy stick.

I sense shenangians. All the competition got knockered. Won't someone think of the children!

mikhaila wrote:
- It's a tournament.
- Teams compete.
- Each team consists of 8 players. How those players get picked isn't a set thing. In some cases, it's who has money to fly to Europe for a week for warhammer. In other
countries, they have a playoff, or it's based on who you know. But in the end, you show up with a team of 8 guys who represent that country.
- Only one team is allowed from each country. Except the UK, who gets 4.
- Each team can only field each army one time.

Some people like the format, some don't. Those that go have a great time, and there are a lot of people that follow it. But there isn't any attempt to find a countries best players, or anything like that.

Sounds a lot like Beerfest.

I don't wish to sound a contrarian, what with most of you sticking up for these guys, but I'm a noob and I managed to get my list correct, lets be honest, its fething easy! The points and gak are RIGHT THERE!

These guys were purposely trying to cheat, as elitist dicks do (I stopped going to tourneys after my first one cos I thought that many of the guys there were douchebags, especially the fether with the sister of battle counts as space wolves cheeselist mother fether NERDRAGEEE)

But I digress.

They didn't make mistakes, they cheated thinking they would get away with it. Frankly I would boot them all out.

feth em!

mattyrm wrote: I don't wish to sound a contrarian, what with most of you sticking up for these guys, but I'm a noob and I managed to get my list correct, lets be honest, its fething easy! The points and gak are RIGHT THERE!

These guys were purposely trying to cheat, as elitist dicks do (I stopped going to tourneys after my first one cos I thought that many of the guys there were douchebags, especially the fether with the sister of battle counts as space wolves cheeselist mother fether NERDRAGEEE)

But I digress.

They didn't make mistakes, they cheated thinking they would get away with it. Frankly I would boot them all out.

feth em!

Actually we don't know that. For all we know the requirements were that it be in Old English and iambic pentameter to boot, and someone glitched a "verily." As noted, the safest course is invasion via whippy stick, just to be sure.

mattyrm wrote:These guys were purposely trying to cheat, as elitist dicks do

Perhaps I would have worded it differently, but there certainly does seem to be some shadiness that takes place in the list building and rules interpretations that pop up from time to time from a certain "caliber" of 40k player. Not in every case, obviously, but enough to be a noticeable trend.

DarknessEternal wrote:If they're going to be so draconian, they should probably know that "malus" is a kind of apple tree. It is not synonymous with "penalty".

Malo malo malo malo.

Anyway, isn't the point of submitting lists early to have them checked by the judges rather than to assess punishment? It gives a second check to make sure that the list-writers added everything up properly. If someone's list is wrong, the judge should let them know and give them another chance to submit a list.

Now, if they had an illegal list at the tournament, a penalty should be assessed.

biccat wrote:

DarknessEternal wrote:If they're going to be so draconian, they should probably know that "malus" is a kind of apple tree. It is not synonymous with "penalty".

Malo malo malo malo.

Anyway, isn't the point of submitting lists early to have them checked by the judges rather than to assess punishment? It gives a second check to make sure that the list-writers added everything up properly. If someone's list is wrong, the judge should let them know and give them another chance to submit a list.

Now, if they had an illegal list at the tournament, a penalty should be assessed.

Good point that.

Correct. A list with mistakes can be changed, after all we are all human and can make mistakes.

Illegal on the other hand sounds like deliberate "cheating" and I concur with the fact that some "elitist douchebags" view 40k/WHF as their personal p..is enlargement show.

Let´s get your heads adjusted. Even if you wipe your opponent from the board in round 1, you won´t get the car, $$$ or the virgin. It is a game and tomorrow no one will care.

In Germany we call this "kind" Powergamers and in every LGS you can get a list of people you don´t want to play by simply asking the shop owner - problem solved. Putting this to the tournament and international stage I would have expected players to be able to write correct lists.

If you can´t you get a penalty, if your list is deliberately "fixed" you will be excluded from the tourney - simples.

DarknessEternal wrote:If they're going to be so draconian, they should probably know that "malus" is a kind of apple tree. It is not synonymous with "penalty".

Main Entry: malus

Part of Speech: n

Definition:

the return of performance-related compensation upon the discovery of deficient performance



And FWIW, I think that if I was going to submit a list to a group of organizers, I would double and triple check it. If it was not double or triple checked, then the leader of the team didn't do his job, because it should be checked again. Then, if it is still found to be illegal, I think they are deserving of a penalty. Why? Because they were given rules, they were given guidelines, they were given time. And yet, they still came back with an illegal list. If there's no penalty, then who will enforce the actual requirements for getting your lists in on time to be checked/reviewed?



Edit: Olympia, where is your news from? Do you have a link?

Darkwynn wrote:This looks like it was for fantasy and not 40k. None of us on the 40k side know about this one.

Everyone seems to have skipped over this post from one of the USA ETC competitors on the 40k side.

puma713 wrote:
Main Entry: malus

Part of Speech: n

Definition:

the return of performance-related compensation upon the discovery of deficient performance

Ok, but that still doesn't mean penalty. It means return of something you were given prior to an act after you acted poorly.

Blackmoor wrote:

Darkwynn wrote:This looks like it was for fantasy and not 40k. None of us on the 40k side know about this one.

Everyone seems to have skipped over this post from one of the USA ETC competitors on the 40k side.

Wait....people play Fantasy?

Sarigar wrote:

Blackmoor wrote:

Darkwynn wrote:This looks like it was for fantasy and not 40k. None of us on the 40k side know about this one.

Everyone seems to have skipped over this post from one of the USA ETC competitors on the 40k side.

Wait....people play Fantasy?

win /thread

Shame with the extended process required to qualify (in Ireland anyway) that people miss out on double checking their lists.
Ah well.

notprop wrote:As for the Yellow Card phrase. A yellow card is issued on football (not the hand-football Americans use ) as a warning against an offence, a second Yellow card offence (not necessarily the same type of offence) results in a red card; which is sending off/expulsion.

I thought yellow cards were used as a defacto award for the team that has the best actors on it to fake injuries.

I'm divided; on the one hand, it seems like a harsh penalty for something so easily rectifiable, but on the other, how hard is it to make an army list? I know 10 year olds who can make legal army lists in about 5 minutes - I assume these guys have easy access to a pen, some paper, the army book, the rulebook and a calculator of some sort... if you can't make an army list and be trusted to check it's legal, then how can you be trusted to play at all?

It's these situations that call for an old fashioned game of Russian Roulette; if the organisers lose then the lists can be changed, if the players lose, then they can't; simples.

Except the UK, who gets 4.

Which suggests that England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland will be represented and not the UK


Malus punishment=pelted with crab apples which then must be eaten by the offender

Always good to see a horticultural refrence on Dakka Eternsl Darkness!

DarknessEternal wrote:If they're going to be so draconian, they should probably know that "malus" is a kind of apple tree. It is not synonymous with "penalty".

I do hope your French is as good as his English.

Point penalties for illegal lists are common on this side of the Atlantic at least. How stringently they're applied depends on how strict an organiser is being but submitting an illegal list often results in point penalties on the day; the trick is to spend 5 minutes checking your army and solve the problem ahead of time! This especially applies if the event you're going to requires flying to Switzerland

Corrode wrote:

DarknessEternal wrote:If they're going to be so draconian, they should probably know that "malus" is a kind of apple tree. It is not synonymous with "penalty".

I do hope your French is as good as his English.

Point penalties for illegal lists are common on this side of the Atlantic at least. How stringently they're applied depends on how strict an organiser is being but submitting an illegal list often results in point penalties on the day; the trick is to spend 5 minutes checking your army and solve the problem ahead of time! This especially applies if the event you're going to requires flying to Switzerland

agreed! so much cash and time to do this sort of event, I'd nail their hands to the table if they couldn't even get their list right...

This especially apples if the event you're going to requires flying to Switzerland

William tells me he needs to hit the target.

Any info on who the offender or what list was illegal and why on the usa side?

The idea of a US national team is repugnant and ridiculous.. Who is picking the team? Who is paying for it?

It seems anyone with the cheddar can create their own team. You know these dudes go around bragging that they are on the fictional "US 40k team". What a joke...

The team is made up of any US gamers who are interested enough to pay their way across to europe. I'd imagine it's a small enough pool. They pay for it themselves.

Also, Tony Kopach won his spot by winning the Adepticon 40k Championship as I did some other people.

biccat wrote:Anyway, isn't the point of submitting lists early to have them checked by the judges rather than to assess punishment? It gives a second check to make sure that the list-writers added everything up properly. If someone's list is wrong, the judge should let them know and give them another chance to submit a list.

Now, if they had an illegal list at the tournament, a penalty should be assessed.

This would be my thoughts as well. Assessing a penalty before the event seems a bit ridiculous and inappropriate, regardless the claims of how hard it is to check them (I would personally doubt that given the ability to use electronic means such as Army Builder, but whatever). I certainly would not waste my time and/or money on an event that penalized me before I even showed up.

Cheers, Gary

kinghammer wrote:The idea of a US national team is repugnant and ridiculous.. Who is picking the team? Who is paying for it?

It seems anyone with the cheddar can create their own team. You know these dudes go around bragging that they are on the fictional "US 40k team". What a joke...

You should do more reading before spouting off rudely like this. It just betrays the facts that...

A) You haven't read any of the extensive discussions about the ETC and the US team in the last year and a half, and
B) You don't know any of the guys on the team. Which you would, if you had any experience at national-level tournaments.

The ability of casual players to get amazingly angry about something which has no effect on them and which they probably wouldn't participate in even if it did is a constant source of wonder.

Corrode wrote:The ability of casual players to get amazingly angry about something which has no effect on them and which they probably wouldn't participate in even if it did is a constant source of wonder.

And this is different from sports or any other hobby the majority of people will never play professionally and/or they have little to no impact on other than paying money to go to the games?

Cheers, Gary

silashand wrote:

Corrode wrote:The ability of casual players to get amazingly angry about something which has no effect on them and which they probably wouldn't participate in even if it did is a constant source of wonder.

And this is different from sports or any other hobby the majority of people will never play professionally and/or they have little to no impact on other than paying money to go to the games?

Cheers, Gary

My favorite professional Sportsball teamsman was penalized by the referumpire for unnecessary roughness and sent to the penalty time out box unfairly! I AM OUTRAGED!