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Thanks for your posts, mattyrm and Melissia.

I think I'd be quite fine with the general orders-taking-thing. Only kind of sport I ever really liked were martial arts, started of with Karate and went to Ju Jutsu after a while...and in martial arts you learn starting by accepting that your superior is right and you should do what he tells you to, even if its 20 pushups for not listening to training instructions. Of course, there are also idiot trainers where you're wondering if you or another guy might be better off being in charge, but I guess you'll get that feeling with some superiors in the military, too. Just saying that I think the atmosphere and hierarchy probably wouldn't be an issue for me.

mattyrm wrote:
Which leads me to my next point...

Elite Special Forces Mountain Unit and she finished all of the training, and THEN left after finishing all the hard bits, after 6 months?

Trust me Melissa, she washed out.

Sounds like it, a lot of people will make excuses for either leaving or being kicked out of the military. A friend of mine who went to a military academy left and said he did because he was "tired of the corruption of the academy" when in reality he left because he had a 1.3 GPA and would be kicked out anyways.

Seriously though, the military is going to break you down and build you into an order following machine because that's what its supposed to do. No functional army is going to contain a large number of free thinkers who don't want to follow orders or are too busy making their own decisions, that would lead to chaos among the ranks afterall. Now you can still be yourself after all of the training, its just that you know how to follow orders in certain situations versus choosing what to do on your own. Its not like you will be asked what toppings you want on your pizza and be unable to give an answer unless someone tells you what to put on it, its going to be like listening to whoever is in charge when bullets are flying in your general direction. That being said the military life isn't for anyone, as several people have stated, and special forces life is exponentially not for everybody. A lot of people wash out and some make excuses for washing out.

Now as far as the OP being shorter, sometimes shorter is preferable. In the USAF their is a height limit for being a jet-pilot thanks to the size of the cockpit, not too sure about army but there may even be a height limit for crew members just so they can fit in the thing.


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Witzkatz wrote:Of course, there are also idiot trainers where you're wondering if you or another guy might be better off being in charge, but I guess you'll get that feeling with some superiors in the military, too.

Its called fragging, and it happened a lot during the Vietnam War.

halonachos wrote:
Its called fragging, and it happened a lot during the Vietnam War.

Well, at least I didn't intend to blow up my trainer at any time...that would've been a TINY bit too harsh.

Witzkatz wrote:

halonachos wrote:
Its called fragging, and it happened a lot during the Vietnam War.

Well, at least I didn't intend to blow up my trainer at any time...that would've been a TINY bit too harsh.

Sometimes they warned them with a smoke grenade under the bed while they were sleeping, usually the officer changed his ways after that.

Would you be willing to die for your Country in case of an outbreak of war if so, be in the Military.

rockerbikie wrote:Would you be willing to die for your Country in case of an outbreak of war if so, be in the Military.

He wants to be a mine clearer from what I understand, Minentaucher translates as "mine diver" in the two component words so I think it would be safe to assume that he is okay with taking a risk like that... mines do go boom after all.

You translated right, halonachos. Yeah, it'd be a dangerous job, and there are probably less dangerous jobs available, even in the military. But I always liked to be challenged, and taking up such a risky - but hopefully als rewarding - position therefore seems attractive.

From what I gathered about our Minentaucher, they are partially sent around the world to clear mines over and under water, IEDs, stuff like that. A few also stay in Germany and take care of the Eastern Sea, a place where, after decades, military ordnance from WW2 is still a danger in some places. Since I'm from the coast, this would also appeal to me.


...as a litte bit more background information: The Minentaucher company, as one of the naval special force units, is supposed to be 120 strong, but at the moment, there are only around 33 men there. Their commanding officer isn't happy about that fact and, while he says the company can still do its job, its obvious they could need a few more men...

Witzkatz wrote:You translated right, halonachos. Yeah, it'd be a dangerous job, and there are probably less dangerous jobs available, even in the military. But I always liked to be challenged, and taking up such a risky - but hopefully als rewarding - position therefore seems attractive.

From what I gathered about our Minentaucher, they are partially sent around the world to clear mines over and under water, IEDs, stuff like that. A few also stay in Germany and take care of the Eastern Sea, a place where, after decades, military ordnance from WW2 is still a danger in some places. Since I'm from the coast, this would also appeal to me.

Hmm... sounds like a specialty group though so the training may be more rigorous because its just like the US Navy's EOD which can either be land or sea.


This is at sea of course.


And on land.

Yup, our guys are quite similar, I think. Their basic PT requirements are only marginally lower than for the Kampfschwimmer, our Navy SEAL equivalent. It's a real demanding training as far as I gathered from one or two reportages - but I think I would have a chance. Might not become best graduate ever, but I think I could make it.

Basic requirements involve:

5000m / 3.1 miles of running in under 23 min (I'm not completely there yet, close, but not there)
1000m / 0.62 miles of swimming in under 24 min (probably needs some work, too)
hold your breath for 45 sek under water (easy right now, I got up to 1min38sek last Saturday; during the real training they, of course, increase this to 3mins or something like that)
25m apnoe diving (easy too)
6 pull-ups (easy too)
bench-press 50kg 15 times (haven't done that for a while, but think I should be able to)
Dive down 3 meters, get two 5kg weights that are 10m apart and get back up (Phew, haven't tried that with such heavy weights before...not sure my local swimming hall would like me to train that there)

If you are accepted, the following training includes 5 weeks of hall training where you work on apnoe diving skills and general strength and stamina. If you manage to do that, in the end you should be able to walk around a standard swimming pool (I guess 25x20m or something like that) under water with a weighted belt - so something like at least 2mins of moving without air. Following this, the real stuff outside starts...diving in winter, nice long runs through the countryside with backpacks and excercise stations...you get the drift, I'm probably not telling the military guys here anything new. The final Minentaucher "exam" is a 18km run (with three-digits pushups and stuff in between) with 18kg backpack full of diving gear, followed by an 8-10km swim in the Eastern Sea until you reach Eckernförde base, where those guys are stationed.

The physical challenge alone would be interesting to me right now after years of academic studying...but of course those guys have to pass lots of test and exams on mine knowledge, diver medicine and other stuff along the way also.

I spent 4 years as US Navy Master at Arms (MP) with a 1 year tour in the persian gulf, nothing really, just stationed in bahrain.

If you want to do it, then maybe you'd be better off joining.

I always wanted to join since I was a kid, and I did it. I never re-enlisted, but if I never did join it would have always been in the back of my mind, "What would have happened?" "Where would I be now?"

Questions like that.

Its 5 years. It may be tough/hard, but the experiences you'll get will probably be helpful, and at the end of your commission, you can always leave, and if you stayed in your field you'd have experience in your field combined with your schooling.

Don't get me wrong, the military isn't for everyone, for some its a career, others a stepping stone. For me it was a stepping stone to get ahead and it has. I enjoyed my time in, saw lots of things I never would have seen otherwise, worked with some of the best people I have ever met, I miss it some times, but other times not so much.

I suggest you do what you believe you should do, otherwise it'll be in the back of your head for the rest of your life.

I think that, on top of the experiences and training you'll get in military service, one of the things that really stick with a lot of people is the lifelong friendships that you make. And one thing that I can say about "army buddies" that i can't say about my civilian friends, is this: They know more about me than even my parents, when they say they'd die for me, it's literal, and mutually felt, and on top of everything else when you need help, they'll be the first to offer it if you ask.

I spent 10 years on active duty (and have worked for the Army since I left active duty), my wife is still active (24 years in, currently deployed), have a son on active duty, and a son in Army ROTC who will go active when he graduates in a couple of years.

The military has a lot to offer, and you can find yourself in jobs where you are making a real difference on some level daily. As Matty said, it is often a calling. Seems like you are trying to get good info on it, that is smart. Bottom line though, because you are interested in it and have been for a while, if you don't do it you will always look back and wonder 'what if' and have some regret for not having given it a shot.

Jake


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Ensis Ferrae wrote:I think that, on top of the experiences and training you'll get in military service, one of the things that really stick with a lot of people is the lifelong friendships that you make. And one thing that I can say about "army buddies" that i can't say about my civilian friends, is this: They know more about me than even my parents, when they say they'd die for me, it's literal, and mutually felt, and on top of everything else when you need help, they'll be the first to offer it if you ask.

Often you won't have to ask.

Even today, no longer on active duty, I go out of my way to help vets or active troopers.