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Never had an issue with metals.

i had my Carnivean fall off my table, bounced 3-4 times down the hall and nothing broke or bent.


A good pinning job goes a long ways :p

not to forget.. replace bendy spears with brass rods etc.

Platuan4th wrote:PP is a game company that happens to make models vs GW being a model company that happens to make games.

Well that about sums it all up! Excellent statement.

I haven't been in need of pinning my models. Glue and greenstuff always does the job for me. My problem with metal models is that I and others I've spoken to experience that parts don't fit properly. I haven't seen similar bad fit with GW models in years (now they're almost all plastic anyways).

I was rather shocked seeing the new Dark Eldar with duplicate sculpts. However, if the models are plastic, they can be converted differently, something which is a hundred times harder with metal.

I tend to pin out of habit, depending on how fiddly the join between parts is. I love the modeling and painting aspect of our hobby anyways, so I take it as par for the course that miniatures will take some work. After all, they are "assembly required". As for converting plastics, that again depends on how focused you are on game vs. miniatures - I've seen some awesome conversions using the new plastic warjack kits on the PP boards, but I'm sure tons of people also just do the stock model and are happy with it.

Personally I love the Warmahoards rule set far more then 40K. As for the models it is kind of a toss up. I like the conversion and possability of the GW plastics but I also love most of the PP metal models. But then again the rule set does kind of affect my choice as well. I'd rather spend time working on the PP models which I am going to get way more play out of then working on the 40K models which are not going to played as much. As far as the pinning debate it all really depends on the model and the builders skill level and preference. I've pinned some and green stuffed others and still others I've just straight scored and glued kind of depends on the model and how I'm feeling that day. But most of the time I like PP models more then GW models. You also need to take into account that more of the PP models tend to be characters rather then just a ton of nameless Joe Blows that are found in 40K.

I do agree that it's easier to form an emotional attachment to a big, key PP model like a character warnoun or a specific, well-performing solo or go-to-guy model than in 40k.

I really enjoyed painting my Earthborn Dire Troll, Mulg, and my Dire Troll Bomber. Far moreso than Space Marine Squad #3.

I Pin all questionable parts. While this makes the assembly process much longer, I have had my behemoth fall off the table and not break. PP has some really hard models to assemble, I don't think they take Assembly in to consideration when producing thier sculpts, they just put out what they think look cool. Take for example the circle bloodtrakers, I love the look of the models, but they were the hardest models i have ever had to assemble.\

Regarding PP learning curve. I don't think you have to know all your opponent models to be competitive. I have always just focused on learning how to play my army really well. Occasionally you will receive a lesson from your opponent that you wont forget, that is how i learn other army's ability's, by playing against them. Trying to learn all the models in the games ability's is extremely hard and i always try to discourage new players from thinking that this is necessary to win.

My take on the learning curve is I expect to lose the first time I play against something I haven't seen before. I'll ask to see the units card or what their special rules are (ie Doomies are immune to magic is an important bit of information to have). Most of the time though, after I see it once or twice I can work around it.

sourclams wrote:I do agree that it's easier to form an emotional attachment to a big, key PP model like a character warnoun or a specific, well-performing solo or go-to-guy model than in 40k.

I really enjoyed painting my Earthborn Dire Troll, Mulg, and my Dire Troll Bomber. Far moreso than Space Marine Squad #3.

Yep;

I spend 3 hours assembling and airbrushing my Custodes LR
First turn it gets Dark Lanced and I take it off the board

I spend 3 hours assembling and painting my Wrastler
I play with it until I screw up

AgeOfEgos wrote:

sourclams wrote:I do agree that it's easier to form an emotional attachment to a big, key PP model like a character warnoun or a specific, well-performing solo or go-to-guy model than in 40k.

I really enjoyed painting my Earthborn Dire Troll, Mulg, and my Dire Troll Bomber. Far moreso than Space Marine Squad #3.

Yep;

I spend 3 hours assembling and airbrushing my Custodes LR
First turn it gets Dark Lanced and I take it off the board

I spend 3 hours assembling and painting my Wrastler
I play with it until I screw up

This is how I feel as well Instead of having a unit that has 8 additional wounds on my Melta Gun guy/Squad Leader w/whatever upgrade, my 10 Praetorian Swordsmen are each doing something on an individual basis and is making a difference in the over-all outcome of the game.

It's also nice to see that the outcome of the game can't be predicted on turn one.

Regarding the minis, I do agree that some are tough to put together (Looking at you Carnivean), but I really enjoy the few poses infantry have. It adds diversity without making the unit look too busy. I've also found that it's easy to make Warbeasts/jacks look different than the standard run-of-the-mill models by giving them a unique basing job, reposing the arms just a bit, or adding little details like chains wrapped around their arms/hands. Simple things can make significant differences.

infinite_array wrote:I'm surprised no-one has mentioned 'pinning' yet.

Learn how to do it. It's a great hobby skill to pick up.

Pinning is a little annoying but definately amazing. i refused to rely on Behemoths normal glue points. his legs are pinned and i intend on pinning his arms once i am finished modding the gun and painting.

I have built about 40 points of Searforge and been really happy with the metal. Minimal mold lines and the pieces fit well with each other. My Basher had a lot of mold lines, and the pose is pretty boring.

I have been scoring and using that Loctite super glue and I am pretty sure it is stronger than pinning with normal superglue.

That Loctite super glue is my new favorite, and cheap!

I do like plastic and I do like units that you can pose and customize easily. But the PP sculpts are just so much better. And they are so much more fun to paint. As for putting them together I have had trouble with plenty of GW stuff. So I guess I don't notice that quite as much.

I think the core benefit with PP products is that they can be used directly out of the box. Whilst yes 10 man GW squads are a cheaper on a per model basis, you will need to buy additional melta guns and transports for the unit before they can be used on the table. It feels great to be able to buy a PP product and not need to buy excessive amounts of supplementary purchases.

In regards to the sculpt quality of PP products. I’ve heard lots of stories about people getting miscast or mispacked boxes however I’ve yet to encounter any issues with my products. I’ve bought from a number of sources and I’ve yet to encounter a miscast or mispacked product.

If you buy a Stormclad from the current batch, it will be missing it's boiler.
I bought 2 and another player bought one, all missing.

We even bought from very different places.
I got mine from an online store, he went to Games Plus outside Chicago.

They must have new packers.
The boiler is from the Ironclad, everything else is Stormclad specific.

Make sure you note the numbered slip inside of each package, and include it on your missing parts request to PP. The slip is the packer's ID number, and can be used to tell PP who isn't doing their job.

AgeOfEgos wrote:RE: Pinning;

Scoring Metal

+



+



=

No pinning and a bond from hell

I should score more often.

I'll go tell my wife.

malfred wrote:
wife.

I believe I've found the issue sir.

spiralingcadaver wrote:
Their minis are pretty inconsistent, though. Also, I'd like to point out that, while GW generally (always?) requires more minis, for the same price, I'm starting to think that GW's are vastly superior: $50 will buy you a basic 10-man unit of most PP's units, or around 1.5x that many of GW minis (give or take, on par, depending on which PP unit and which GW squad), or (for about 10% more) about as many Forgeworld pieces, which, frankly, are head and shoulders above PP's line.

Comparing unit to unit just doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. Games-Workshop could charge 25% less for their 10 man units, and you'd still end up spending more because by and large the units that are slightly less than Privateer are the ones that GW guarantees you must buy multiples of. So while I can say that Unit+UA=Tactical Squad+Transport cost wise. In general I can buy that unit once, and be done with decent size of my army. For many GW armies I'm buying that unit 3-4 times, and that adds up and is why I think GW will always be the more expensive game.

I agree with the OP. The miniature quality sucks, they could find better sculptors (find whoever sculpted the rakham metals and pay them whatever they ask), or could charge less for the miniatures. I don't feel I should have to brass rod eGaspys spear because it bends under its own weight, or spend extra time painting eyeballs to compensate for an awful face sculpt. That being said, I still enjoy the game and will continue playing

Trechor wrote:I don't feel I should have to brass rod eGaspys spear because it bends under its own weight

Eh? Is Daemortus trying to break free? My mini is holding up just fine on its original rod. Now, my Bane Knights on the other hand could use some brass rod love....

I have noticed, just in looking at my minis and some friends, that there is the occasionally flawed mini where a bubble or some other production defect results in too-thin pieces. Weapon hafts seem to be the most common culprit. I had it on a Juggernaut axe, others have had it happen on polearms.

It's far from the norm, but it definitely happens.

skrulnik wrote:If you buy a Stormclad from the current batch, it will be missing it's boiler.
I bought 2 and another player bought one, all missing.

We even bought from very different places.
I got mine from an online store, he went to Games Plus outside Chicago.

They must have new packers.
The boiler is from the Ironclad, everything else is Stormclad specific.

I just purchased the Stormclad from a store in SoCal and had the same issue. There was not a slip in the package to identify who packed/inspected but they sent the boiler within a few days, no questions asked. I also made a comment on a small void on the blade and excessive flash on the right arm in the hopes of informing their quality control, with the note that I wasn't requesting a replacement for that (as I could fix it easily) and they sent me a new right arm that looked completely cleaned up and prepped.


Anyway, now back to your regularly scheduled thread.

yeah, my parts came in less than a week.

There were no slips in mine either. There were slight issues on the blades also, but it looks like a consistent one.

malfred wrote:

AgeOfEgos wrote:RE: Pinning;

Scoring Metal

+



+



=

No pinning and a bond from hell

I should score more often.

I'll go tell my wife.

What's the product in the first image? I can't make it out...

Have you compared the Loctite you pictured to Gorilla brand Super Glue? I've just been scoring the surface with the tip of a file, then using lots of Gorilla super glue and holding it forever... seems to hold really well on larger surfaces, which the trolls have, although I'm not so sure about small arms/horns where there's not much surface area.

Also, GW liquid greenstuff looks like a match made in heaven for my trollbloods Dire Trolls