Do you measure before declaring shots?

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**agnosto**

Brother SRM wrote:It would be an awful change for a shooting-centric game. I can't recall many games I've played that allowed premeasuring in any capacity whatsoever, because it's an awful rule. The hemming and hawing over whether or not to take a shot or what have you is such an intrinsic part of gaming, and introduces an element of uncertainty that requires you to think tactically. You can take the risk of hitting that one unit just on the cusp of where your range might be, or you can take the safer shot at a closer unit and so on. Fantasy is a bit more about moving and charging than shooting, so it works better there, but it does not belong in 40k outside of a special unit here and there.

When did 40k become shooting-centric? Except for IG, Tau and Eldar all the factions in the game are all about loading up in a tank, getting across the field and getting in close combat. I've seen fantasy games with more shooting than most 40k games; heck my Ogre army can shoot more than many space marine armies.

**nosferatu1001**

n0t_u wrote: with the change to the guess weapons for 5th.

You meant 4th edition. 4th edition took the "guess" out of guess range.

**Jidmah**

KamikazeCanuck wrote:If someone whips out the tape measure and uses it he has officially shot with that unit.

This. Many people do that on accident, but invalidating their shots for that(which might even be in range!) is pretty much being TFG.

**daveNYC**

Unreg1stered wrote:I started up WH40k in my group of friends around juneish. I've managed to draw in about 4 regular players and a few people who will use my armies from time to time to play. With none of those friends do we use the rule that you need to declare a shot first and then check the range. To be honest, it doesn't seem to add much except to cripple new people who aren't as good at eyeing distances. I don't want to convince someone to play a game then slaughter them because I know what 12" looks like and they don't. That's not skill or anything fun.

But I do understand it's a part of the rules. I've yet to play at a gamestore so I have no idea how the rule is thought of.

For house rules allow your buds to get up to speed let them pre-measure, but have them make a call on what they would want to shoot at and how far away they think that target is. That'd help improve their skills in estimating distances while not getting them too crumped upside the head due to bad mk2 eyeball skills.

**Wardragoon**

The key I have found is finding something that measures on farily well, be it a land raider, or just a book someone left next to the table, it makes things so much easier, and you are not premeasuring. Admittedly this method does take some imagination, and a good sense of scale

**Budgie**

I agree with the house-rules.... Ive gotten alright at knowing distances, so this never bothers me, but i see where youre coming from.

On a similar vein, do units still have to shoot at the closest enemy target? Ive never used that rule, and i find it to be the stupidest one in the book..

**Madmax1**

I've played other games that allow pre-measuring and it really slows down the game. You inevitably end up playing against TFG that insists on measuring the distance from every one of his units to every enemy unit, then laying down markers to mark off specific distances between them. Then of course, he insists on doing this every turn before he decides anything. It gets ridiculous. I like the fact that 40K makes you make a quick, real-time decision and live with the consequences. Those new players will learn to eye-ball distances pretty quickly.

**Cryage**

I spend almost all day every day measuring stuff for work with lineal footage for rebuilding homes and even eye "mis-measure" when I eyeball something... so even the "pros" don't have an unfair advantage. You just generally get used to it and I actually find it more fun when you don't pre-measure since you're taking that chance that you may be able to unload everything you got , or have nothing at all.

**KamikazeCanuck**

I play against a guy that has a construction background and he definately has an advatage. Missing a guess weapon by half an inch is like a huge miss for him.

**Brother SRM**

Budgie wrote:
On a similar vein, do units still have to shoot at the closest enemy target? Ive never used that rule, and i find it to be the stupidest one in the book..

Nope, got dropped when we switched over to 5th edition. I liked that it made ld more important, but it wasn't a very good rule.

**susejo239**

Yes.

**Veteran Sergeant**

Genestealer1969 wrote:Not being able to pre-measure is one of the dumbest things in 40K. Your telling me that with all the advanced optics/HUD's/etc that should be present Space Marines can't figure out how far away something is?

This has always been the rule for 40K.

No pre-measuring. This game doesn't need to be dumbed down any further than it already has been.

**Luke_Prowler**

Only for flash gitz