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Learn something new everyday.

shogun wrote:I like the battleweagonbunker format.

My 1750 points list:

Warboss with warbike, Powerclaw etc.
mek with kff and bosspole

5 bikernobs with the basic stuff (waaagh banner, powerclaw, painboy etc.

3x10 gretchins

3x 15 loota's
3x battleweagons with deffrolla and two big shoota's

Loota's go in the battleweagons and mek joins the middle one for complete kff cover.

gretchins go for the objectives or form a shield in front of the battleweagon, depends on the mission.

Warboss with Nobs go hunting.

its not perfect but i like it!

Not perfect is far from the truth. You are pretty much setting yourself up to get tabled. Three shaken results are enough to disable everything you have except six bikers. If your opponent manages to tarpit them or simply points all meltas and everything not able to glance AV14 he has at them, you have lost the game by about turn 3.

From what I gathered over the few months I've been playing, battlewagons weapons aren't very good with their main guns due to the ork's BS 2. I usually run 3 battlewagons with a red paintjob, deff rolla's, and a big shoota. And I sometimes run a burna wagon with the 15 burnas obviously. That loota wagon sounds promising because lootas haven't been too kind to me.

Here is my question, if battlewagons aren't good as mobile gun platforms, would looted wagons suffice? Because in all honesty, it sucks that putting the biggest guns possible seems like a waste of points. Which doesn't make sense when i run these oversized buses instead of these fortresses of dakka. Because Orks love their dakka.

God damn you Phil Kelly.

A looted wagon can have a boomgun, rather than a killkannon. A boomgun would be good on a battlewagon, too, but it can't take one. So yes, a looted wagon is actually the better shooty wagon,

Then maybe I will invest in converting looted wagons. (i don't like the leman russ or the rhino look.) Though the rhino stats doesn't look promising, that F11 S11 R10. Sounds like a death trap.

12/10/10 is also a death trap, but seems to work pretty well for the imperial guard. You don't use them as transports, you give them a 'ard case and park them somewhere in your backfield, preferably behind low impassible terrain, so they don't go turbo-boosting towards the middle of the board.

Jidmah wrote:
Not perfect is far from the truth. You are pretty much setting yourself up to get tabled. Three shaken results are enough to disable everything you have except six bikers. If your opponent manages to tarpit them or simply points all meltas and everything not able to glance AV14 he has at them, you have lost the game by about turn 3.

I think you overestimate the ability of armies to glance AV14 at range, without melta, through a 4+ cover save. Due to either distance or AV14, a battlewagon can simply ignore an awful lot of weapons, and others still have the dice to contend with.

Redbeard wrote:

I think you overestimate the ability of armies to glance AV14 at range, without melta, through a 4+ cover save. Due to either distance or AV14, a battlewagon can simply ignore an awful lot of weapons, and others still have the dice to contend with.

Many armies can and will spam rockets, assault cannons or equivalents like mad which all have a chance of glancing (eldar, black templar, dark angels, space wolves, vanilla marines, grey knights) or even deep strike anti-tank, like CSM, blood angels, daemons, any army including a drop podding dreadnought or any other units with means of starting the game anywhere on the board. In addition, there are enough armies with fast vehicles able to penetrate the sides of those stationary wagons (eldar, dark eldar, orks, marines with speeders) or simply bring a lot of S9 or lances like many marine codices and dark eldar do. Not to mention that any close combat unit capable of hurting vehicles will wreck the entire parking lot. And let's not talk about the imperial guard, who can do all of the above.

There is literally nothing else to shoot at, and deactivating 225 worth of S7 shooting should be top priority. In the end, you have a total of four units which can do anything at all, against 1750 points of any other army. You can only kill four units a turn, each shaken battlewagon reduces that capability by 25%.If you don't get first turn, some of your lootaz might not shoot at all for the entire game. On top of that, there is no reason to stay away from them, you can simply drive your entire army up to them and start hitting them with everything you've got. The worst thing happening is 15 boyz without a nob charing you.

When I drive at my enemies, my battlewagons get shaken(immobilized, wrecked) by glances all the time, not all of them, but you can pretty much count on two per turn, and I tend to get pretty lucky with my KFF. It would be more, if my opponents would switch targets after the first shaken result. Maybe your opponents aren't bringing the right tools to handle vehicles?

Berzerker: Agree, though I wouldn't care about a weapon destroyed on any variant of shooty BW. Even losing the kannon is less of a loss than getting shaken.