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DarknessEternal wrote:

Sparks_Havelock wrote:Actually, the humanoid models with a sword in the left hand could be considered to be left-handed models - as a left-handed former student of a couple of Western Martial arts & a former battle re-enactor (Englisc/Seaxon/Vikingr/Norman), I would much rather have a melee weapon in my left hand and the gun in my right - it would feel more natural to use the left hand & arm to strike & defend with the sword/melee weapon and to pop off shots with a gun in the right hand - wielding melee weapons in your 'off-hand', as it were, feels clunky, uncomfortable and really weird. This includes weapons such as power claws & powerfists, I'd much rather use them with my left hand.

I concur. If I were theoretically using a pistol and melee weapon at the same time, I'd definitely have the pistol in my left (off) hand. I could easily shoot a person at pistol ranges with my off-hand. There's no way I could effectively use a melee weapon with it.

There's also no way you'd hit anything with your off-handed pistol, lol. You'd probably have a much easier time learning to swing a sword with your off hand than learning to properly shoot with your non-dominant hand and non-dominant eye (since for most people they are the same side).

Well it's a tricky one you see - Tyranids aren't going to fence with you, so hack and smashing them before they get you is probably more important but if you're up against the General commanding the personal army of a noble house and it's your power sword against his, clutching the weapon in your off-hand is going to make life a lot, lot harder - it just doesn't 'feel' right. It's uncomfortable, it nags at the hand, the wrist and the arm, the movements feel awkward and clumsy, getting the right angle for an attack* is difficult and it nags at the mind. Parries tend to be weaker too and ripostes and counters a lot slower. Controlling the enemies blade whilst in a bind is just frustrating.

Anyway, one thing we are forgetting here. Holsters. Pistol out in main hand, bang, bang, bang, bang, enemy are within 20 feet, shove pistol in holster, switch power sword into main hand and you're off! Or you could just switch the weapons over so you can slash and hack with your sword in your main hand and blast away with your pistol - whether you hit or not could be irrelevant, just the danger of it may be enough to drive opponents back.

*A good attack should be as defensive as it is offensive - place a poor cut that leaves your side open and your opponent can exploit that.

LoneLictor wrote:The Imperium probably executes left handed people, but I guess that doesn't explain why all of the other races are still right handed. Oh well.

They're all secretly 1960's Catholics.

Anyway, I wouldn't be too willing to use a CC weapon in my right hand knowing that at any minute I might be in melee with a chain axe wielding maniac. I'd definitely prefer it in my strong hand. Your aim with a pistol one handed isn't going to be much better either way .

Wolf_Ov_The_Void wrote:Yeah i know but why is almost everything right handed? may be i'm just being silly but i wonder...

There are a few exceptions among the metal/finecast, like this guy, whose shield is on his right arm, suggesting he's a lefty.


Maybe he just faps a lot and his right arm is stronger by this?( )

Oh, Bugger! I've almost finished my 4th Company Ultrasmurfs and this guy who is supposed to be the Warden of the Fleet is the commander! A lefty! Now I know why they keep choking!

Being left-handed isn't even a guarantee that you'll wield a weapon left-handed. I'm a lefty, but my right eye is my dominant eye, so I shoot rifles right-handed. It actually feels more natural having my dominant arm supporting the rifle, anyway.

Your hand preference has more to do with fine moter skills then it does with Strength(often it is the off hand/arm that is stronger)

Because of this you would want your precision weapon(ranged weapon) to be in your right hand. Non-precision weapons would gravitate to your off hand.

This is why most powerfists are left handed.



If it makes the lefties feel any better, the DOW2 space marines seem to be largely lefties(especially the terminators)

Most eldar also have CCW in right hand and pistol in left.

Yeah, you're just not looking hard enough.

A full 50% of khorne berzerkers are lefties (I know, because half of their left hands have chain weapons and half have bolt pistols)



also, if you're counting pistols in the right hand as the sign of being a righty then 100% of the old imperial guard commanders are lefties.







Along with all its psykers:



and it's priests:





Heck, even its tank commanders



And that's just in a guard army. I know for a fact that there are several CSM models that are lefties.

If anything, I'm surprised that there are so many lefties represented in the models, given how few of them there are in real life.

Thats why I get really annoyed when a disproportionate amount of lefties show up somewhere(like in a game)

using pure probability, only about 1 out of every 20 characters should be left handed.

As a left handed person I'd just like to point out that if I had to wield a sword and a gun at the same time, I would have the sword in my left hand and the gun in my right, because it is much easier to aim with your offhand than it is to swing a sword.

Just convert them up, it's not that hard to chop up an arm to change it. Also, in real life, I'm right handed but my sword hand is my left hand.

Grey Templar wrote:Your hand preference has more to do with fine moter skills then it does with Strength(often it is the off hand/arm that is stronger)

Because of this you would want your precision weapon(ranged weapon) to be in your right hand. Non-precision weapons would gravitate to your off hand.

This is why most powerfists are left handed.

Chap, it doesn't work like that. Whilst it's preferential to use the dominant hand for a firearm, it's essential for using a melee weapon. It's not so clear-cut as just hack, hack, hack as the enemies line up and down they go. That's Hollywood, not reality. When you use a melee weapon a hundred & one different things need to be considered by your mind. If you go from what your brain is used to to that which it doesn't quite understand you will screw it up and in a melee that equates to death. Using your dominant hand with a melee weapon will help you to create a more solid parry and attack, the movements between your body and weapon will be seamless. You will remain balanced most of the time and know instinctively where to move the weapon, what angle the weapon should be, where to place your feet, what to do with your other hand, where your torso should be facing and, most importantly, it feels -correct-. Worst thing about wielding a melee weapon in your off-hand is that it feels wrong and it irks at your mind and it feels uncomfortable and your footwork feels clumsy and it seems harder to be balanced and it distracts your mind as you have to actively think about what you're doing, whereas with your dominant hand it's all instinctive and you don't even need to think about what you're doing next because your mind has already worked it out & your body is doing it.

When I was trained in the treatise of c16 rapier maestro's I learnt all of the movements with my right hand, all of the guards, parries, attacks, how to control my opponents weapon in a bind - all right handed. I then, with help from our maestro's, converted it for left-handed use - this made me capable irregardless of which hand the weapon was in. Even with that training (for over two years) I still dislike using my right-hand as dominant - it just feels horribly wrong, and as I said, it distracts you and leads you to getting skewered. Much rather have the fine finesse of my left-hand where I know that I can protect myself and disable my opponent - that surety and confidence is what helps you to win, not blindly swinging a sword around, because you will just be run through.

overkongen wrote:As a left handed person I'd just like to point out that if I had to wield a sword and a gun at the same time, I would have the sword in my left hand and the gun in my right, because it is much easier to aim with your offhand than it is to swing a sword.

This.

Learning to shoot with your off hand isn't that difficult. It's how I shoot; I'm right-handed, but I shoot with my left hand because my left eye is dominant. Shooting a pistol requires steadiness and wrist strength more than precise, fine motor control, and a pistol isn't accurate at extreme ranges anyway; the difference in accuracy between primary hand and off-hand can be compensated for fairly easily, it just requires you to adjust your expectation of where the bullet will go, since your angle of sight is different.

Learning to use a bladed weapon effectively with your off hand is very, very, very difficult; it takes months if not years of training, and even then you will NEVER be as good as you could be with your dominant hand. Fighting in melee is not a contest of strength, it's a contest of precision; or, in other words, fine motor control. If a right-handed person fights with a blade in his left hand and a shield on his right arm, for instance, he's going to be very awkward and off-balance. Training yourself to fight off-handed basically requires you to train yourself to be ambidextrous; it's possible, but quite difficult.

Now, of course, if you learned to fight off-handed right from the start, it'll feel natural to you just because that's what you're used to; but it's both easier and faster to learn to fight with your dominant hand

You do realise that 99% of guns are only designed to be fired from the right hand. Unless you like nice hot shell cases down the neck

Daston wrote:You do realise that 99% of guns are only designed to be fired from the right hand. Unless you like nice hot shell cases down the neck

In the case of pistols it doesn't matter at all; the gun is out in FRONT of you, not right up close to your face. And pistol + sword is what we're discussing, here.

LoneLictor wrote:The Imperium probably executes left handed people, but I guess that doesn't explain why all of the other races are still right handed. Oh well.

well said purge the left handed mutants

Sparks_Havelock wrote:

Grey Templar wrote:Your hand preference has more to do with fine moter skills then it does with Strength(often it is the off hand/arm that is stronger)

Because of this you would want your precision weapon(ranged weapon) to be in your right hand. Non-precision weapons would gravitate to your off hand.

This is why most powerfists are left handed.

Chap, it doesn't work like that. Whilst it's preferential to use the dominant hand for a firearm, it's essential for using a melee weapon. It's not so clear-cut as just hack, hack, hack as the enemies line up and down they go. That's Hollywood, not reality. When you use a melee weapon a hundred & one different things need to be considered by your mind. If you go from what your brain is used to to that which it doesn't quite understand you will screw it up and in a melee that equates to death. Using your dominant hand with a melee weapon will help you to create a more solid parry and attack, the movements between your body and weapon will be seamless. You will remain balanced most of the time and know instinctively where to move the weapon, what angle the weapon should be, where to place your feet, what to do with your other hand, where your torso should be facing and, most importantly, it feels -correct-. Worst thing about wielding a melee weapon in your off-hand is that it feels wrong and it irks at your mind and it feels uncomfortable and your footwork feels clumsy and it seems harder to be balanced and it distracts your mind as you have to actively think about what you're doing, whereas with your dominant hand it's all instinctive and you don't even need to think about what you're doing next because your mind has already worked it out & your body is doing it.

When I was trained in the treatise of c16 rapier maestro's I learnt all of the movements with my right hand, all of the guards, parries, attacks, how to control my opponents weapon in a bind - all right handed. I then, with help from our maestro's, converted it for left-handed use - this made me capable irregardless of which hand the weapon was in. Even with that training (for over two years) I still dislike using my right-hand as dominant - it just feels horribly wrong, and as I said, it distracts you and leads you to getting skewered. Much rather have the fine finesse of my left-hand where I know that I can protect myself and disable my opponent - that surety and confidence is what helps you to win, not blindly swinging a sword around, because you will just be run through.

I never said all CC weapons were non-precision weapons.

A sword should be wielded in the preferred hand because it requires dextreity to use properly.

A powerfist is not a precision weapon, and can't be swapped between hands, so it will be acceptable to put it in the off hand.


If I have a sword and pistol I will have my pistol in my right hand(right handed) so I can aim accuratly. My sword will be in my left hand/sheathed.

If CC is going to happen I will swap my 2 weapons.


However, if I have a Power fist and a pistol I would have the fist in my left hand and my pistol in my right. Accurate fire from the pistol and the slight change in dexterity with my left hand won't alter the powerfist's effectivness.

You implied that melee weapons were not precision weapons, as you wrote "precision weapons (ranged weapon)", hence my response.

If you want to just make wild haymaker swings with the power fist which won't connect with anything, then certainly, have it on your off-hand. I'd still much rather have the greater co-ordination between mind, body and weapon from using it with my dominant hand than my off-hand as that will reduce the chance of making mistakes, such as wrong-footing yourself, putting yourself off-balance or even injuring yourself because your brain is trying to adjust to something that is not natural to it. It's not like you're just punching with bare fists.

The only time in real history that swords and pistols were used together was from the 1500's to the 1700's, but I don't think they were used as close combat weapons.

EDIT:

I found this out the other day. Apparently, in the U.S. military, they don't care if you're left-handed. If you are, you put this thing on the gun so the shells eject downward instead of your face, and you're good to go. So at least in our times, the military lets people fire their weapons left-handed if they choose to do so. I don't know about other countries, though.

BeRzErKeR wrote:

Daston wrote:You do realise that 99% of guns are only designed to be fired from the right hand. Unless you like nice hot shell cases down the neck

In the case of pistols it doesn't matter at all; the gun is out in FRONT of you, not right up close to your face. And pistol + sword is what we're discussing, here.

As a left-handed pistol shooter, I know from experience that the casing defiinitely will end up on your neck if the pistol kicks them backwards.

With sword + pistol, I'd fire the pistol right-handed. Although I am right-eyed, the sword belongs in the dominant hand regardless.

I know something you do not. I, am not left handed.

best swordfight EVER!

Love that movie

DE seem to be about 70/30 right handed.

I have grots with either hand dominant, or ambi.

My orks have a fair few lefties.

My daemons have a few ambis and lefties in there.

AlmightyWalrus wrote:

LoneLictor wrote:The Imperium probably executes left handed people, but I guess that doesn't explain why all of the other races are still right handed. Oh well.

The Imperium uses the Ordo Anti-Sinistra to assassinate them all!

That'd be the Ordo: Dextra then.


Left-hander here (left hand dominant, anyway). Learned to shoot my rifle Right handed (in Army), use mouse right handed, do lots of stuff right handed (my handwriting is shocking, though).
Do I care that most models are right handed?
No.

Most people are Right handed. If I want a left handed model, I MAKE one left handed. There are enough bits out there and over time, you WILL get enough of them to do it.
I don't require a model in any of my armies to be left handed - they are not a representation of me.

The Legion of the Damned are rather sinister with something like 38% left handed. Of the 13 new models, 4 are holding the bolter in their left hand plus one sergeant has the pistol aimed with his left and the other with his right so pick which one you want as the more sinister of the two.

Look at an ork army

as a goalie in hockey i use my left as a catching arm, since its generally weaker, and the glove dosent really require strength to use. my stick on the other hand requires more "types" of movment, and is more strength based, in terms of stick checks, sweeps, etc. im a righty naturally although i have been forced into ambidexterity by virtue of work.. but i still prefer right handed writing eating, etc.

otherwise, its possible that left handers are heretics and have been purged by the inquisistion as traitors to the right hand of the emporer.

Well guys i think i've found it, The empire, and therefore all that is imperial is despicted from old greece(duh), therefore(prep yourself):



Historically, the left side, and subsequently left-handedness, was considered negative. The word “left” itself derives from the Anglo-Saxon word lyft, which means “weak”. The Latin word sinistra originally meant “left” but took on meanings of “evil” or “unlucky” by the Classical Latin era, and this double meaning survives in European derivatives of Latin, and in the English word “sinister”. Alternatively, sinister comes from the Latin word sinus meaning “pocket”: a traditional Roman toga had only one pocket, located on the left side. The right hand has historically been associated with skill: the Latin word for right-handed is dexter, as in “dexterity”, meaning manual skill. Even the word “ambidexterity” reflects the bias. Its intended meaning is “skillful on both sides”. However, since it keeps the Latin root dexter, which means “right”, it ends up conveying the idea of being “right-handed at both sides”. This bias is also apparent in the lesser-known antonym “ambisinistrous”, which means “clumsy on both sides”. In more technical contexts, “sinistral” may be used in place of “left-handed” and “sinistrality” in place of “left-handedness”.

Meanings gradually developed from use of these terms in the ancient languages. In many modern European languages, including English, the word for the direction “right” also means “correct” or “proper”, and also stands for authority and justice. In most Slavic languages the root prav is used in words carrying meanings of correctness or justice. In French, droit(e) (cognate to English direct) means both “right” and “straight”, as well as “law” and the legal sense of “right”, while gauche means “left” and is also a synonym of maladroit, literally “not right”, meaning “clumsy”. Spanish, Italian, Portuguese and German have similar constructs. The Spanish term diestro and the Italian term destro mean both “right-handed” and “skillful”. The contemporary Italian word sinistra has both meanings of sinister and left (the masculine adjective for sinister being sinistro), and maldestro means “clumsy”. The Spanish siniestra has both, too, although the “left” meaning is less common and is usually expressed by izquierda, a Basque word that made its way into Portuguese as well. In some Spanish-speaking countries, to do something por izquierda means to engage in corrupt conduct or employ illegitimate means, whereas por derecha or a derechas means to do it the right (legitimate) way. In Portuguese, the most common word for left-handed person, canhoto, was once used to identify the devil, and canhestro, a related word, means “clumsy”. In German, recht means “right” (direction) and “right” (correct), while the word link means “left” and that someone is back-stabbing or a liar.

The Dutch word links also means “left” and “clumsy” or “awkward”. In Irish, deas means “right side” and “nice”. Ciotóg is the left hand and is related to ciotach meaning “awkward”; ciotógach (kyut-OH-goch) is the term for left-handed. In Welsh, the word chwith means “left”, but can also mean “strange”, “awkward”, or “wrong”. The Scots term for left-handedness is corrie fistit. The term can be used to convey clumsiness.

In Finnish, the word oikea means both “right” (okay, correct) and “right” (the opposite of left). In Swedish, vänster means “left”. The term vänsterprassel means “infidelity”, “adultery” and “cheating”. From this term the verb vänstra (lit. “lefting”) is derived.

In Hungarian, the word for right is jobb, which also means “better”. The word for left is bal, which also means “bad”. In Polish, the word prawo means: right as well as law, prawy means: lawful; the word lewy means: left (opposite of right), and colloquial “illegal” (opposite of legal). In Estonian, the word pahem stands for both “left” and “worse” and the word parem stands for both “right” and “better”.

In Chinese culture, the adjective “left” (Chinese character: 左, Mandarin: zuǒ) sometimes means “improper” or “out of accord”. For instance, the phrase “left path” (左道, zuǒdao) stands for unorthodox or immoral means.

In Korean, the word for right is oreun (오른), to be compared to the word meaning morally proper, oreheun (옳은) which shares the same pronunciation.

In Hebrew, as well as in other ancient Semitic and Mesopotamian languages, the term “left” was a symbol of power or custody. The left hand symbolized the power to shame society, and was used as a metaphor for misfortune, natural evil, or punishment from the gods. This metaphor survived ancient culture and was integrated into mainstream Christianity by early Catholic theologians, such as Ambrose of Milan, to modern Protestant theologians, such as Karl Barth, to attribute natural evil to God in explaining God’s omnipotence over the universe.

The left side is often associated with awkwardness and clumsiness. The Spanish expression “tener dos pies izquierdos”, in English, the expression “to have two left feet”, refers to clumsiness in the domains of football or dancing. A “left-handed compliment” is considered one that is unflattering or dismissive in meaning. The Polish expression “mieć dwie lewe ręce”, Dutch “twee linkerhanden hebben”, German “zwei linke Hände haben”, the Bulgarian expression “dve levi ratse”, French “avoir deux mains gauches”, Hungarian kétbalkezes and Czech “Mít obě ruce levé” all mean “to have two left hands”—that one is clumsy or is a very poor handyman. The English equivalent of the phrase is “being all thumbs”. Moreover, the German idiom “mit dem linken Fuß aufgestanden sein”, the Spanish expression “levantarse con el pie izquierdo”, the French expression “s’être levé du pied gauche”and the Hungarian expression “bal lábbal kel fel” (literally, to have gotten up with the left foot) mean to have a bad day and do everything wrong or unsuccessfully, related to the English expression “to get up on the wrong side of the bed”. The Welsh phrase “tu chwith allan” (left side out) refers to an object being inside-out. In Russian, the use of the term nalyevo means “on the left”, but can also connotate taking bribes or “sneaky” behavior. Balszerencse (lit. “left luck”) is Hungarian for “bad luck”.

And so, comrades.

It has been solved

Wolf out!

every fith shoota boy is lefthanded, and the choppa slugga boys are evenly distributed.....

Orks are mad you and i both know that.