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The problem with the multi-charge idea is that you don't have a choice where anything moves or what you charge. If your opponent has any idea what he is doing, he can easily prevent Grotzniks unit from multi-assaulting.

it is tough to get a multi charge w dok yep because of positioning. You basically HAVE to charge closest enemy, but once that enemy is charged, there is nothing preventing you from multi assault besides positioning. What I usually do to help control the group's position is this:

--------Kan------ Kan ------ Kan
Shoota1s Dok's mob Shootas2 |table edge/terrain

Hope that makes sense.

Flank his group with shootas basically and put kans/buggies right in front of him. Sometimes instead of shootas I use gretchin. The idea is to use his flanks and the rule that you can not move through a < 1" gap to your advantage. You use this to help "shape" grotsnik's group by closing the 1" gap and blocking anyone that wants to move the wrong way. think of it as corraling him. In a slow list like kan wall it's very doable. Albeit, you can generally only use 3-6 Kans and sometimes I throw in a dread(because people really love to shoot deff dreads!)

You still can only mutli-assault a model into another unit, if the unit you are multi-charging is the closest enemy to that model.

From what type of lists I've seen (to get back more to the point of the article) i see sluggas in faster, trukk heavy armies. Being able to roll up for very few points and pile out some crazy axe wielding orks to dish out the pain is very effective.

An argument that I have heard is that an Ork army should all move at the same 'speed.' this idea means that if you re doing foot sloggers/ mek attack that everything should be relatively together in order to push forward together and not get picked apart. I find tht sluggas are better for this roll and marching forward and peppering your opponent with big shoota and shootas all game can add up to quite a good amount of kills. Shootas tend to grind opponents down and then finish them off with a charge as opposed to just beat the living poop out of them and then moving on to get riddled with holes from their buddies.

I personally find Ork shooting to be pretty effective due to sheer volume. For this reason, i see shootas as the most effective for volume as opposed to power. If I want power I let my 3 or more deff dreads march up and grind people into paste. They can also destroy rhinos and land raiders, allowing their contents to be swamped with shots and killed via overwhelmign shots (plus rolling 40+ shots per turn per unit is pretty dandy).

All in all, I think it depends on what 'type' of army you want to play and what other units that shootas or sluggas are with. Sluggas and other close combat/ fast orks seem to work well but foot slogger mech heacy lists tend to prefer shoota style it seems. See which you like and then go from there.

-WAAGH!!

Cheers fr all responses

I recently played a 500 pt game against space marines which consisted of a squad of 30 Boyz and 20 Boyz all with sluggas and choppas. I managed to Waagh! on turn 3 and the two mobs completely wiped the floor with his tactical marines with wounds to spare and I had so many attacks I didn't even have enough dice to cover the attacks.

For the time being, I'm adding ten more slugga/choppa to round that mob out. The idea of potentially getting 120 attacks from each mob is amazing.

Yeah it's a discussion that may always be. I don't have too much experience but I love throwing out 60 dice for shooting at 18inch range for my on foot army. The big trade off is do you want an extra shot as BS2 or an extra attack as WS4, logic would say the extra attack since it has a better chance to hit, however when you consider the extra range, and possibly 2 full rounds of shooting before combat the shoota really balances out.

Not to mention, wounding something with shooting, is easier in most cases, then doing that with wound in CC

I have found that personally, the shootaz perform better than sluggaz. I will always have twice as many shootaz then choppaz. The only exception is if the boys in a trukk/BW then they are sluggaz 100% of the time

Again, it's really hard to compare the two, since they serve such different services. Shootas for footlsogging mobs used to deteriorate opponent's morale, tie up units, and hold objectives.

Slugga boyz are shock troops, ideally delivered in speedy fashion on turn 2 (or turn 1, if you can manage it) towards anything that needs to be krumped. A successful volley of slugga-trukc assaults enforces a devastating delay on the enemy's force.

Oddly enough, my latest build will see a relatively equal amount of both. Two squads of 20 shootas, and four trukks with 12 boyz. 40 shootas with 48 sluggas. If you don't count the nobs, that's 38 to 44.

Jidmah wrote:Seven diversified nobz are about 320, and will rip purifiers apart, be it two or ten.

No they won't.
EDIT: THE FOLLOWING IS WRONG

This, keeping in mind the fact that each Purifier carries a Storm Bolter with twice the range, twice the accuracy, and twice the number of shots as the Nobs' Sluggas.

(For some reason I thought that Purifiers could buy Brotherhood Banners. That's wrong, I apologize, I am an idiot.)

So it turns out you were right, 7 Nobz can bash 10 Purifiers if they get the charge off, god bless America, Waagh, crump 'em boyz and so forth, all is well.

My math looked something like this: .5*.5*.66*3*10 = 5 whereas it was supposed to look something like this .5*.5*.66*2*10*.7 = 2.31

Grots R OP wrote:It has more than a few drawbacks, your unit is no longer effectively scoring(i bring an extra grots unit). it is expensive yes. It works well behind a Kan wall though, instead of 2 groups of 20 you have one big monsterous group of 30+cybork.

1 bet 30 boyz + dok could multi assault charge two groups of 10 purifiers and do pretty well. Just keep dok away from hammers on the charge. Or better yet just put him at the back-he will never make it into combat on the charge so no enemies will be in base w him the first round.

Flame from 2 groups of purifiers = 60*.5 =30 wounds -cybork save = 20 wounds taken. After FNP = 10 wounds. (this raises a good question does cleansing flame even stack?)

Purifiers with hammer hand do 20 attacks, 5/6 wounds of which 3/4 go through cybork.

Good thoughts, however, Cleansing Flame is a psychic power and the GK Codex specifically says that GK "Brotherhood of Psykers" units are allowed only one psychic power per turn, e.g. they don't get to use both Hammerhand and Cleansing Flame.

Also, Cybork Bodies gives a 5+ invulnerable. 5+ is 2/6, or 1/3. That means that NFWs pass the save 2/3 of the time, not 3/4 of the time.

Heh, no harm done

Nobz should never be walking the field, so storm bolters are largely irrelevant to them. If the GK ever gets to shoot them, psyflemen will rip them apart anyways.
Either way, except for the psy bolters, the purifiers wouldn't do much harm to those nobz, as each storm bolter would deal only 2*.66*.5*.66*.5 = .22 wounds on average, as FNP can be taken against them.

Some GK player once mathhammerd that activating NFW > hammerhand > cleansing flames against nobz. If you search these forums you will probably find that. If your opponent activates either hammer hand or cleansing flame, you're golden anyways, because you can spread the wounds without losses.