Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Squats themselves weren't silly. It was the underground living space bikers theme of their army that was silly.

GW eliminated them from the universe because they were too lazy to revamp their army to something less silly, or alternatively were lazy and felt they wouldn't be economical or profitable to continue as a model line.

Honestly, the original idea that Squat players should just use them as Imperial Guard was the best. I think they could have easily given them a slightly altered IGuard list, or even made them an entry in an expanded Codex: Imperial Guard. But, they didn't.



I will agree with the posters who contest that Space Dwarves weren't "too silly" or "didn't fit". That's absurtarded. This is a universe with sentient idiot savant space fungus, immaterium dwelling elven space fetishists, elite shock troopers with hair too long for them to easily achieve environment seals on their armor, and space nuns who obtain divine powers from a deity that isn't a deity and hated being worshiped as one. Space Dwarves are downright serious in that context.

But this is irrelevant. Everything was silly in Rogue Trader, and got more serious as the game evolved. The reason the squats seem kinda silly is they never got the extra-grimdark treatment that everyone else did.

They could have kept them in the game, I'll give you that.
However, they didn't, and as a result the effort it would now take to revamp them and make them "modern 40K" would be pretty hefty.
Squats aren't coming back in their classic form.
I think it's time to move on from them.

"and space nuns who obtain divine powers from a deity that isn't a deity and hated being worshiped as one."


Wow, reminds me of someone...

I miss the the squats myself, and I loved the ratlings. For all the improbable things in the 40k fluff I don't think they're any more outrageous then say orange monkey geniuses with fingers that shoot lasers, or orks that come from mushrooms and speak with a British accent.

And of those things, only one has an army(the Orks who come from fungi[mushrooms are fungi, but not all fungi are mushrooms] and speak with a British accent).

If Jokaero or Ratlings had their own armies, it'd be a bit different. Jokaero, I might add, only recently made a return to the tabletop. They had models early on but vanished in everything except fluff references for digital weapons.

Kanluwen wrote:And of those things, only one has an army(the Orks who come from fungi[mushrooms are fungi, but not all fungi are mushrooms] and speak with a British accent).

If Jokaero or Ratlings had their own armies, it'd be a bit different. Jokaero, I might add, only recently made a return to the tabletop. They had models early on but vanished in everything except fluff references for digital weapons.

And are still fething dumb.

Someone reset the clock

Squats? Seriously?

We have more than enough races in the game. The last thing we need is yet another codex to slow the release scedual of codexs people actually want.

Squats were stupid. Stupid name. Stupid concept. Stupid models. Stupid story.

They were dwarves who smoked cigars and traded with orks and eldar. They rode around on powerwheels with engines.

They are nothing more than short Imperial Guard who act like bikers and red-necks. Sure they had powered armour and other junk.

Epic? Who cares. Different game. Keep them there.

The Squats are now the Demiurg. Subterrainian rock people. Small of stature. Tubes will give the apearance of beards. They will be part of the Tau because they are unworthy of their own codex.

I may have to build a Squat (bad name.. How about Svart) Land Train some day, probably out of ork Battlewagons.

Hmmm

Ork codex counts as Squats... the IRONY

DeffDred wrote:The Squats are now the Demiurg. Subterrainian rock people. Small of stature. Tubes will give the apearance of beards. They will be part of the Tau because they are unworthy of their own codex.

Wasn't the 'squats becoming rock monsters' rumour from ghost21? If so, be careful in stating it as even a reliable rumour.

Demiurg are space based miners. They live on big ships in clans and mine asteroids IIRC.

Wasn't the 'squats becoming rock monsters' rumour from ghost21? If so, be careful in stating it as even a reliable rumour.

I dont know about Ghost21.

All I know is that I saw the design sketches and the models on sprue.

-Loki- wrote:

DeffDred wrote:The Squats are now the Demiurg. Subterrainian rock people. Small of stature. Tubes will give the apearance of beards. They will be part of the Tau because they are unworthy of their own codex.

Wasn't the 'squats becoming rock monsters' rumour from ghost21? If so, be careful in stating it as even a reliable rumour.

It has nothing to do with ghost21, so there is no problem with stating it at all.

Demiurg = Squats has been around for years--mostly since the release of the Tau codex.

GW killed off most of the Squats in the fluff. They are near extinction after the Imperium began exterminatus-ing their planets.

But, now we have the Demiurg, under that hard rocky exterior, lies the squishy nougat center of the squat race.

I thought it was pretty widely known by now that Squats dissapeared because one of the employees who developed them won an intellectual property lawsuit after he was fired and the Squats went with him.

Seriously, this is why. Everything else was normal GW CYA BS.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
That's also why they are gone and won't ever come back.

Squidmanlolz wrote:GW killed off most of the Squats in the fluff. They are near extinction after the Imperium began exterminatus-ing their planets.

What? The Squats just disappeared from the fluff. There was never a "killing off", especially by Exterminatus. There was an offhand comment from Jervis Johnson about their homeworlds being eaten by Tyranids (from some magical Hive Fleet that apparently only ate the squats then disappeared, lol), but it was never in the fluff.

Like I've said before, Squats should have been brought back as the Tau. Not the Demiurg(although the name is better tha "Squats", but as the tau are mechanically, just as "dwarves". A shooty, gun-line army with technology that in ways surpasses the Imperium (because it'd be from the Dark Age of technology). They make up for their small stature with armored suits and big weapons.

They are found on the edge of Imperial space which they had held since the Dark Age. The Imperium wages war with them because they are an empire of abhumans, and so they claim "outcast unclean!"

There could even be hints that their vehicles, whatever form they might take, were actual STC vehicles.

"Yes they deserved to die, and I hope they burn in HELL!" - Samuel L. Jackson on the extermination of the Squats

Squats have a horrid name and on that basis are the silliest of the 40k races.

I always figured Squats could have survived into modern 40K by being yet another of the many second-class servant abhuman races that the Imperium keeps floating around. They can't and don't exist as a separate/independent army anymore, but they might be some subset of the Guard or something.

Veteran Sergeant wrote:

Squidmanlolz wrote:GW killed off most of the Squats in the fluff. They are near extinction after the Imperium began exterminatus-ing their planets.

What? The Squats just disappeared from the fluff. There was never a "killing off", especially by Exterminatus. There was an offhand comment from Jervis Johnson about their homeworlds being eaten by Tyranids (from some magical Hive Fleet that apparently only ate the squats then disappeared, lol), but it was never in the fluff.

That isn't correct. This did appear in text. See the reprint of the old Ian Watson novel Inquisitor, which was retitled as Draco. There is an added on part that says the story is difficult to verify, because the Squats were destroyed by the Tyranids.

I'd say the portrayal of orks of 40k not only does the stereotype justice, but also gives them back some of the dignity other universes deny them (and all without making them "green klingons", that is). Let's not forget that "the orc" is the embodiment of the ultimate antagonist, a creature so foul its very existance is an affront to all that's good and holy. It's a touchy stereotype, not entirely devoid of racist undertones. IMHO, Games Workshop handled it perfectly.

Ogryns and Halflings are there in the limelight, as useful mutants with a minor role. Space Undead have also been dealt with quite elegantly, forgoing the fantasy imagery in favor of a blend between Ancient Egypt and the Cybermen from Doctor Who. The Squats, however, were HORRID.

I'm not saying Dwarves are completely out of context in 40k. But norse bikers in leather? With ties to the Mechanicus? Oh, please. The idea of Dwarves in Space was ok. The execution was monstrous. I desperately wanted to like the Squats as I've always liked Dwarves, but this time I just couldn't. Reading 2nd ed. Codex Imperialis it felt like they were there, sitting in the middle of an otherwise perfect setting like a greasy, purulent zit in the face of a top model. Their fluff a slapdash collection of random occurences, their units an incoherent bucket of "meh", their fiction a lame piece taking place in some sort of subterranean german bierhalle. They HAD to go.

I'm not opposed to the idea of Space Dwarves. With some major modifications from the established stereotype (like, getting rid of the norse angle), I think they could find a room in 40k. But if dwarves are returning to 40k please, pretty please, let it not be Squats...

I agree. The old fluff was really goofy, other than their base origins.

I would like to see 'space dwarves' if they resembled something more like Mantic's Forgefathers, but with near-future body armor more like Mantic's Corporation or the Tau rather than anything resembling WH fantasy Dwarf architecture and armor.

And unlike any dwarf ever made by GW, they have to have anatomically correct legs. You know, the ones with both thighs and shins on either side of knees?

Agent_Tremolo wrote:I'd say the portrayal of orks of 40k not only does the stereotype justice, but also gives them back some of the dignity other universes deny them (and all without making them "green klingons", that is). Let's not forget that "the orc" is the embodiment of the ultimate antagonist, a creature so foul its very existance is an affront to all that's good and holy. It's a touchy stereotype, not entirely devoid of racist undertones. IMHO, Games Workshop handled it perfectly.

By making them idiot savant sentient space fungus?

Okay.

The Orks are the most cartoonish possible stereotype of the orc. Which is fine. They're quite amusing. But they are anything but "so foul their very existence is an affront to all that's good and holy". Heck, Orks in 40K aren't even evil. They're just stupid and determinedly militaristic. They don't fight to be evil bastards, they simply fight because they don't know how to do anything else. Hardly "evil" or "foul". Like I said, a cartoon villain. But that's fine. At least they do it with panache. A lot of the 40K villains are just mustache twirlingly over-dramatic.

Zinderneuf wrote:

Chowderhead wrote:TRICYCLES HO!



And that's all I have to say.

Besides for the fact that Squats don't fit at all.

And orks of the same period (1ed) had armed dune buggies.

Orks still have armed Dune Buggies:
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440267a&prodId=prod1090183

The worst thing about it, is, the more I think about Redneck Drunk Biker Dwarves in space, the more I think it would be perfect as a faction. Admittedly, it would fit more Gorkamorka than 40k, but I feel I could deal finely with an other comical faction in the game.

Not wanting to be contraversial or anything, but if people want to play Squats, then play Warpath from Mantic Games..

http://www.manticgames.com/Shop-Home/Warpath/Forge-Fathers/Infantry.html

Rules are free, models ok IMO....Everyones a winner!!!

In truth, I personally think Squats could have been re done...but they weren't for whatever reason. Lets all move on rather than look back.

So Squats where redneck bikers. Thats lame. I thought they were super smart miners, who actually understand technology. I just lost all respect for them.

ObliviousBlueCaboose wrote:So Squats where redneck bikers. Thats lame. I thought they were super smart miners, who actually understand technology. I just lost all respect for them.

They were both. They made fantastic tech, but rode on bikes. They were thematically a bit of a mess...in a good way...

In no way are they the "Lest silly". The name itself takes them out of the running, and the steam-tech/super tech, Viking, bigwheel riding bikers was just...a bad joke. In my 40k They never happened. I could see a heavy worlder type of Abhuman, but not a whole xeno race and not that silly. May be a bit odd but I do not like a lot of silly in my 40k.