Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

As a 'Nid player: No. No. No. No. No.

Im all for AV15 as long as IoM dont get it.....

Xenos only! =]

But seriously Av 15 is broke. AV 14 on a LR all the way around is broke.....

Too imbalanced. Not enough current weapons would be able to break through. Anything str 8 or lower is useless unless lance or melta

instead of stronger armor, how about reverse lance armor?
and AV 12s, or even AV 13/11/11, but it counts any weapon over Str 8 as Str 8.
Still immune to small arms fire, and being melee'd to death by tac marines. But just as vulnerable to grenades and missiles as normal.

Or put the 15 on the back armor, make a tank that rolls around ON FIRE or something, so it's nearly impossible to defeat in CC, unless with chainfists or powerklaws, so you have to shoot it's normal 12's on the front and sides.

anyway, 15 is just too much. 14 is almost too much most of the time. When 90% of my army can't deal with armor 14, and he shoots the 10% that could to death on his first turn, I'm already pretty screwed. 15 would just be too much on top of that.

tyro_neophyte wrote:So I was thinking about what would happen if vehicles had an AV of 15. Would this make the game outrageously unbalanced? Do you think it would add another element of tactics to the game? If you think it would be an interesting addition, why? If you think it would be completely awful, why?

EDIT: I meant to say for normal games of 40k, not Apocalypse or anything like that. Just a regular game, using regular rules, except some vehicles have AV15. Could be AV15 all the way around, or just on the front, whatever.

Just curious here. Also not sure if it belongs here or Proposed Rules, so mods, please move this thread if necessary.

I feel you have games design somewhat turned around.

Any change in the rules should be motivated by a need or a pressing issue that needs to be resolved.
Simply changing a rule for the sake of change and then wondering whether you can "get away with it" is kinda odd.

So my question to you is;

What has motivated you to consider the change in question?
Is it a balance issue, like feeling that vehicles should potentially be harder to destroy?
Is it a fluff issue, like feeling that certain existing vehicles are too easily destroyed?
Is it an innovation issue, like feeling that adding the new rule adds significantly to the game or impacts existing gameplay in a positive way?

My wyches with their haywire grenades wouldn't care but as has been stated, this would ruin the game structure more than it is now.

What do I think of the idea?
I think it's an incredibly stupid idea.

Which means that it will sooner or later happen, and that the IOM will be the only ones who get it

Better start warming up those Lances, lads

otakutaylor wrote:instead of stronger armor, how about reverse lance armor?
and AV 12s, or even AV 13/11/11, but it counts any weapon over Str 8 as Str 8.
Still immune to small arms fire, and being melee'd to death by tac marines. But just as vulnerable to grenades and missiles as normal.

You mean, exactly like Eldar energy fields?

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Jidmah wrote:

otakutaylor wrote:instead of stronger armor, how about reverse lance armor?
and AV 12s, or even AV 13/11/11, but it counts any weapon over Str 8 as Str 8.
Still immune to small arms fire, and being melee'd to death by tac marines. But just as vulnerable to grenades and missiles as normal.

You mean, exactly like Eldar energy fields?

Except for the immune to being melee'd to death bit, as the shield doesn't cover the rear Other than that, yup it's a Wave Serpent's field.

And no, leave those on the Eldar. The IOM doesn't need any more toys, and has av 14 all round boxes already

Next you'll want holofields on that LR..

Cerebrium wrote:As a 'Nid player: No. No. No. No. No.

This.

If they made something like an ork mobile barricade with no guns that's 15/10/9 or something and it's just a big scrap metal wall on wheels being slowly pushed by grots, that would be cool. Super shooty armies like tau or gaurd can still railgun or manticor it from the front, everyone else needs to get close with meltas or use mobility or close combat to get at the super squishy back. That sounds fun.

A land raider/monolith type vehicle that has 15/15/15 and is bristling with super weapons just completely does not work.

I don't think AV15 is out of the question as long as it's only on 1 facing. I could even see AV16, or even "Attacks from the front arc can't harm the vehicle".

As long as it's priced appropriately, and has a weakness in the other facings, it could be a cool mechanic.