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What about the Exodites? Do they get consumed?

They basically went Amish, with an Infinity circuit on their planets like the ones the CWE have, so in general, no.

Ascalam wrote:They basically went Amish, with an Infinity circuit on their planets like the ones the CWE have, so in general, no.

Wait... Just remembered that in Path of the Renegade, it mentions that they merged their souls with the planet they lived on, or something like that. But then, it is a novel... don't know how accurate it might be.

Yup, same as the CWE merge their souls with the craftworld.

They are basically cwe but without the ships but more the violent hippie type.

Nom

Exodites have a "world spirit" instead of an "infinity circuit".
Their soulstones are planted at certain key "tree" points, where their souls merge with the world spirit like their CE cousins and their IC.

They didn't go "amish" as such. They still use technology, they just don't allow it to run their lives. They still use laser weapons (their "dragon riders" use them) and have access to the webway.
They use hard work as a replacement for the path system (idle hands and all that). They might be seen as "backwoods hicks" by many of the other eldar, but they are not exactly pre-steam tech, either.

I wonder if James Cameron got the idea for the Avatar "soul tree" thing from Exodite fluff then. xP They sound very similar.

More than likely he took the same mythology that GW ripped for their own.

It's not like it's something humanity HASN'T already done in the past (in terms of wacky religious beliefs, it's also far from the wackiest).

Ascalam wrote:pretty much.

The CWE went all puritan, to repress their urges, and save their souls in Infinity circuits and soulstones to stop Slaanesh getting them. It works, most of the time, but leaves them a shadow of themselves as they can't live full lives or reach their full potential.

The DE party as hard as ever they did, and top up their souls as they drain out the bottom. It works, sort of, but like any drug needs bigger and bigger doses to have an effect.

The ones that dies in the Fall have been called the lucky ones by some CWE. The DE are in denial

Harlequins are the exception. The Rite of Laughter basically has them possessed by a Keeper of Secrets (a Greater Daemon of Slaanesh) - the only way for them to banish it without outside help and free themselves of Slaanesh' touch is to confront and control their nature. Otherwise, the soul is devoured...if not, a Harlequin is the result. Since they've gained perfect control of the Eldar psyche, they are free to indulge in their potential in ways the Craftworld Eldar and the Dark Eldar cannot. This pretty much accounts for the mixture of admiration, respect, and fear expressed to Harlequins by both the Craftworld Eldar and the Dark Eldar.

It's decided then. When I grow up, I'm going to be a harlequin. Right after I'm finished being a warmaster.

hellspawn22 wrote:It's decided then. When I grow up, I'm going to be a harlequin. Right after I'm finished being a warmaster.

The Human equivalent is an Illuminati, who appeared in 3rd Edition, but hasn't since (although they weren't actually deleted per se). The Rite of Illumination is the same as the Rite of Laughter (in fact Illuminati and Harlequins are the only free to enter and leave the Black Library at will) - the only difference is that any Greater Daemon can be used, sicnce Humans aren't tied to any Power. Like Harlequins, Illuminati instinctively know what Chaos truly is, it's lies and truths, it's strengths and weaknesses, and as such both can use psychic powers freely without fear of daemonic possession/chaotic influence.

Tadashi wrote:

Harlequins are the exception. The Rite of Laughter basically has them possessed by a Keeper of Secrets (a Greater Daemon of Slaanesh) - the only way for them to banish it without outside help and free themselves of Slaanesh' touch is to confront and control their nature. Otherwise, the soul is devoured...if not, a Harlequin is the result. Since they've gained perfect control of the Eldar psyche, they are free to indulge in their potential in ways the Craftworld Eldar and the Dark Eldar cannot. This pretty much accounts for the mixture of admiration, respect, and fear expressed to Harlequins by both the Craftworld Eldar and the Dark Eldar.

Have you a citation and quote for this? I have seen this claim numerous times but each time direct proof was asked for, there has always been silence and none ever produced. It wouldn't be the first time some fan fiction theory was repeated often enough to the point that people mistook it for GW produced material.

But isn't there a Harlequin in every troupe that depicts Slaanesh, whose soul will go to Slaanesh automatically or something? So there must be some price to pay.

Durza wrote:But isn't there a Harlequin in every troupe that depicts Slaanesh, whose soul will go to Slaanesh automatically or something? So there must be some price to pay.

Solitaire. There's a possibility that an Eldar can banish the daemon, but his/her soul will still be taken. Cegorach has to intervene, but can only save one in seven souls.

Tadashi wrote:

Durza wrote:But isn't there a Harlequin in every troupe that depicts Slaanesh, whose soul will go to Slaanesh automatically or something? So there must be some price to pay.

Solitaire. There's a possibility that an Eldar can banish the daemon, but his/her soul will still be taken. Cegorach has to intervene, but can only save one in seven souls.

One in seven is a very specific ratio you are claiming here. Again where is the evidence for all these statements? Without direct evidence, this could easily be all be made up by a wildly speculating fan with no basis whatsoever.

Codex: Eldar...except the ratio, might have gotten it wrong.

Tadashi wrote:Codex: Eldar...except the ratio, might have gotten it wrong.

Quote it please. To my knowledge there is no such statement about what the Harlequin method of escaping Slaanesh is, and certainly nothing as specific as what you are claiming, namely that it involves daemonic possession.

'The harlequins belong to the laughing god. Their dying spirits merge together with their patron, strengthening his power.

The only harlequin not protected in this way is the Solitaire, who plays the role of Slaanesh in ritual performances and whose spirit already belongs to the Great Enemy''

Solitaires are given over to Slaanesh. Even addressing one accidentally is bad enough that it's said that you should suicide before you are doomed. They are basically already damned, and you don't want to be damned along with them.
Pg 6 Eldar codex if you want the whole quote.. it's longish.

Could you quote the page numbers? I have the Eldar dex in front of me and i'm not seeing anything about the 1 in 7 ratio, the greater daemon possession part or any of the rest. Perhaps from an earlier Eldar dex?


The DE codex (which also has them in) says that 'they alone know the secret of how to deny Slaanesh and keep their souls burning bright'

But otherwise adds nothing else that isn't covered by the Eldar dex.

From my understanding, Illuminati are pretty rare. What's the story behind them? How are they created/born/whatever? Whose side are they on? How are they connected to the Emperor and what does the Inquisition have to say?

hellspawn22 wrote:From my understanding, Illuminati are pretty rare. What's the story behind them? How are they created/born/whatever? Whose side are they on? How are they connected to the Emperor and what does the Inquisition have to say?

You can look them up on lexicanum. In old fluff they were the blood descendants of the Emperor, and had basically "good side" warp powers and immunities. Recent fluff does not discuss them except for a mention about how they were being tracked down by the inquisition on grounds of being a Tzeentch cult or some such.

The "ultimate goal" of the Sensei was to be to eventually unite all their members and I believe sacrifice themselves to awaken the Emperor/create the Star Child.

It seems that GW has given up on all of the positive endgame scenarios they've mentioned previously. Never retracted any of them, but never advanced them either. The Golden Throne is failing, the Imperium is dying, there are more psykers, and so on. But they never develop it further. I guess because that would bring about the endgame. Which would end the game.

Then there are Exodites, who are just hard working farmers who don't indulge in the raping and pillaging but aren't as strict as the CWE. Even then, their souls get saved by the planet which acts as an infinity circuit. So yes, Harlies are the way forward.

Keep in mind that the Illuminati/Star Child theory is heavily implied by the recent Xenology book.

If by recent you mean 2006 then maybe

Xenology has been out awhile.

Black Library isn't exactly known for sticking to the universe too closely either

Fetterkey wrote:Keep in mind that the Illuminati/Star Child theory is heavily implied by the recent Xenology book.

was it ever stated or just implied

Nom

I don't even remember it being implied, but it's been a bot since i read it. I'll have to reread it again

ph34r wrote:

hellspawn22 wrote:From my understanding, Illuminati are pretty rare. What's the story behind them? How are they created/born/whatever? Whose side are they on? How are they connected to the Emperor and what does the Inquisition have to say?

You can look them up on lexicanum. In old fluff they were the blood descendants of the Emperor, and had basically "good side" warp powers and immunities. Recent fluff does not discuss them except for a mention about how they were being tracked down by the inquisition on grounds of being a Tzeentch cult or some such.

The "ultimate goal" of the Sensei was to be to eventually unite all their members and I believe sacrifice themselves to awaken the Emperor/create the Star Child.

You're confusing Sensei with Illuminati.

Illuminati are supposed to be those humans that have fought off daemonic possession on their own. Sensei are supposed to be descendants of the Emperor that exhibit immunities, abilities, and powers associated with the Star Child.

hellspawn22 wrote:A question probably easily answered, but here it is: Do the DE worship Slaanesh or was he/she/it just created by the fall? I know the fall created Slaanesh, but I was unsure if the Dark Eldar actually worship it or if they stick to the traditional Eldar gods.

Probably been said already but the recent Dark Eldar book and codex are very explicit on this point.

Dark Eldar do not worship Slannesh. They fear her like other Eldar. Vect deliberately enforces zero tolerance on any use of psychic powers (to the point where much of the eldars ability has atrophied) and quite simply annialated any sub-realm that attempted to control demons. They worship Khaine (I think) since he is the god of murder and definetly worship the Dark Muses which are representations of all the sins/qualities of the Dark Eldar.

Also Dark Eldar souls are being slowly 'bled' from their time during the fall and as such need to keep inflicitng pain and suffering/watch such things in order to keep themselves healthy and young. So in a way Slannesh already has their souls but not knowingly or willingly from the Dark Eldars perspective.

I admit that it is confusing as to whether eldar worshipped Slannesh before the fall. Or that what they do currently cannot be construed as Slannesh worship since if before the fall they did the same thing and fed Slannesh then, well, you know... But since it mentions the dark muses as coming from a time before the fall and since SLannesh wasn't technically a goddess (eldar always term S as female) until it was born I would guess they didn't for the sake of arguments. Basically all dark eldar are on the rim of Slanneshs open maw and are desperately trying to not fall in and be swallowed up.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
On Path of the Renegade the DE raid an exodite world (massive Avatar reference ). In that the maiden world serves like the craftworld and rather than have the various paths of the craftworlders the exodites go greenpeace and retreat from the affairs of the modern world; living in village communes to seal themselves from temptation.

Iracundus wrote:

Tadashi wrote:Codex: Eldar...except the ratio, might have gotten it wrong.

Quote it please. To my knowledge there is no such statement about what the Harlequin method of escaping Slaanesh is, and certainly nothing as specific as what you are claiming, namely that it involves daemonic possession.

I don't recall ever seeing anything about posession by Greater Daemons in any Eldar Codex - its always that all (expect the Solitaire) are protected by the Harlequins own God from Slaanesh? I do recall a bit about when they die, the two Gods fight over the soul.......... but possession is very new to me?

Mr Morden wrote:

Iracundus wrote:

Tadashi wrote:Codex: Eldar...except the ratio, might have gotten it wrong.

Quote it please. To my knowledge there is no such statement about what the Harlequin method of escaping Slaanesh is, and certainly nothing as specific as what you are claiming, namely that it involves daemonic possession.

I don't recall ever seeing anything about posession by Greater Daemons in any Eldar Codex - its always that all (expect the Solitaire) are protected by the Harlequins own God from Slaanesh? I do recall a bit about when they die, the two Gods fight over the soul.......... but possession is very new to me?

Exactly. I have seen this claim come up over and over again on a variety of forums and threads yet each time direct proof is requested, no one has ever been able to produce it. By direct proof, I mean a direct quote and citation, not a "I remember in such and such place" or some 3rd party site like Lexicanum that paraphrases (and which in doing so may twist or distort any original meaning).

As Ascalam quoted earlier from the Eldar Codex, it just says that the Harlequins' souls merge with their god upon death, strengthening his power.

Little is known about the Solitaires, even amongst the Eldar. They have passed the sacred Ritual which all Harlequins must undertake, yet they live apart from other Harlequins. The Solitaires roam the Webway seeking out Eldar they believe can survive the Ritual, and take them to the Harlequin bands. It is said that the oldest and most powerful Solitaires become the dreaded guardians of the Black Library. On the extremely rare occasions when a Solitaire performs, he or she takes the part of Slaanesh and the Harlequin band will perform the legendary tale of the Birth of the Great Enemy – the most dangerous of all Harlequin masques. It is claimed that others have tried to take on the role of the Great Enemy and died or been driven insane!

p. 8, Citadel Journal #39

That was from the old experimental Harlequin list by Gav Thorpe in the now defunct Citadel Journal. All that really indicates is that there is some sort of ritual that is arduous and which poses the risk of death (or worse), and that this ritual seems to be key to being a Harlequin, and presumably being free from Slaanesh. The Solitaire exists as a special exception in that despite passing the Ritual, his soul is forfeit to Slaanesh barring the occasional times when the Laughing God can trick Slaanesh and reclaim the soul. However nothing is said at all about what the ritual involves. It could be something like being examined and judged by the Laughing God or somehow pledging your soul to him in an analogous way to how the soul of a Chaos Champion is pledged to his god.