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McNinja wrote:

Basimpo wrote:

smUrfsrUs wrote:I agree that you need to role for night fighting for the Doom Scythe but i think you have to role to see and if you say role 9" then you may place the marker upto 9" away, this is the only way I can see that night fighting will effect the death ray. The tesla destructer is deffinatly effected by night fighting.
So in other words you are targeting a point with the death ray, which as Drunkspleen says you have to be able to see.

I agree.

I don't. Nowhere in the Doom Scythe's rules does the Death Ray ever pick a target unit, which is part of the requirement for Night Fighting. The HF rules say "After selecting a target, but before a unit fires, a check needs to be made to see if the firers can clearly spot their target through the darkness. Roll 2D6 and multiply the result by 3, then measure the distance between the two units..." There is no other unit. The Death Ray simply picks a starting place and goes from there. Only the Tesla Destructor is subject to NF rules. The Death Ray is not, nor is it subject to LOS restrictions. In fact, the only thing it is subject to is a shaken/stunned/WepDestroyed/wrecked result. Other than that, it does not fire like a normal weapon, hence the extra rules.

I agree with you that the death ray isn't affected by night fighting, like i said it would be the only way I could see it being affected. If I played a game and this came up for some silly reason I would try and use this idea of rolling to see and then being able to start line from that area as a middle ground.

So order of operations would be as follows:
1. Roll Night Fighting distance.
2. Resolve Death Ray (unaffected by Night Fighting).
3. Select one unit hit by the Death Ray as your target.
4. Compare target distance to NF Spotting distance.
5. Resolve rest of Shooting as normal.

Or would you move Step 1 between 3 and 4?

Drunkspleen wrote:Until a FAQ is made, I will play by the RAW, which requires the Doom Scythe be able to spot a target to be eligible to fire any of its weapons.

Citation needed.

McNinja wrote:Again, they actually do. Specific > General, and the Death Ray rules are specific in how the Death Ray is supposed to be fired and how the Tesla Destructor can be fired.

There is no target unit for the Death Ray. It does not even target a point. it selects a starting point for the Ray. The other weapon on the Death Scythe has no targets whatsoever until the Death Ray's shooting is resolved.

The problem is, the specific don't override the General in this case, you have interpreted parts of the rules in very broad ways so as to infer from them that rules are being overridden when it is not explicitly stated, and I believe that not only is the interpretation to correct, but to try to infer additional rules at any time is incorrect in terms of a RAW discussion. The Death Ray rules do not say that it's firing isn't simultaneous with other weapons, they only place a restriction on what constitutes a valid target for other weapons; Similarly, because you nominate a target unit on a PER UNIT basis, you aren't nominating a target for the Death Ray, you are nominating a target for the Doom Scythe, and there's no rule exempting it from this standard process, you have just inferred that this vehicle doesn't nominate a target because a significant weapon system on the vehicle fires in a unique way, to do so is patently incorrect.

No, it cannot select a target, because of the final rule in the Death ray. If it has already selected a target then it is unable to comply with the rule in the death ray.

So you have broken a rule - meaning the more general rule has to go.