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marineskilla66 wrote:Ive been going to my local FLGS since I was a tiny little boy. My father, uncle, mother and several family friends have worked there over the years and we have always loved having a place to buy models at a slightly lower price than retail.

Naturally, the store sells many other gaming systems such as Infinity, FOW etc. They recently hired a new cashier that every time I bought a GW product, would bash me for doing so. He would always say how GW is sooo expensive and not worth the money. (While this may be true there is no reason to point it out EVERY single time I buy something.) Then he would continue to say how GW is the worst company on the planet and how I was stupid for buying their product. He would then go on for 15 mintues about how Infinity is the greatest game on Earth and how he built his army for only $75 compared to "wasting" hundreds of dollars on GW product. (I am not bashing Infinity it seems like a great game, I just didn't feel like hearing I was dumb for playing 40k instead of Infinity)

This happened every time I went into the store for about two months, I finally get fed up and told him he could shut it and walked out of the store. Went in there today and now he is gone. Thank the Emperor.

I would have complained to the manager after the 2nd time. Seems childish to just walk out in a huff and never mention it to his boss, especially at a store that you have been shopping at for so many years and have had so many relatives work at. The last thing an employer wants is an employee berating a customer for spending their money how they choose. Tends to make customers walk out of the store and take their business elsewhere...

Skriker

No, you guys are all right on the AOBR discounts, don't get me wrong there. Hell, I actually bought one early on when I was getting back into the hobby and sold off the marinesjust the way ya'll were saying. What was consistently putting me off about this particular employee is that I had already told him this multiple times and yet he was still trying to push it on me every time I walked in the store. The second and third time I forgave him because you can't expect a retail guy to recognize every customer, they deal with too many people. But the eigth, ninth, and tenth time, when you've seen me play other gamers there with my horde of footsloggin' boy, my own Rulebook, templates and so forth? He launches into his sphiel every time - so I quit going. And if I do, I bring my girlfriend or my sister to run interference. As someone said earlier, nothing gets them off your back like having a girl ask them the difference between a Land Raider and a Rhino.

Havvelock, I always assumed they were working on commission. If what you say is true, then I feel sorry for them.

Curran, what I mean by that is there is just no denying that GW products are expensive. They even did yet another price hike and they know we are all gonna buy it no matter what because we love the game.

curran12 wrote:What I do greatly admire in GW stores is the staff's focus on keeping things 'clean' both in terms of taking care of the shop and making it a pleasant experience for people to play at. I've never been in a GW that was disorganized or poorly maintained, and (this is big for me) poor sportsmanship or really foul language are usually talked down on in a big hurry. Call me old fashion, but I do like a bit of class there. Now, before folks jump on, this is not to say that FLGSs do NOT do this, but it is rarely a guarantee if they will or not. At a GW, I can count on it.

I can show the opposite of this to the extreme in a LGS. Years ago two guys, who became and still are very good friends, opened a new game store within walking distance of my home. It was a great place, always clean and well organized and quite well run. The store moved to a new location and one of the owners lived in an apartment above the store. Eventually the two moved out of the gaming business and the store went to a couple with 6 kids. They ran the store OK, but it was always a little crazy with the kdis running around all the time. Finally they realized that trying to raise their family in a game store was not the best of plans and sold it off. The guy who bought it was disgusting. He lived on site, but apparently never saw the point in "cleaning up" for the customers. He would pretty much roll out of bed and into the store. He treated the stock as his own personal library and barely paid attention to customers when they needed anything or when they wanted to pay for products. It got to the point that the store started to smell badly and you'd pull a book off the shelf to look at and it would be covered in sticky fingerprints. It was just nasty. Not surprisingly the store went under pretty quickly after that, never to return.

I definitely appriciate that most GW stores are well maintained. Of course I also appreciate well maintained LGSs as well. If I take a box off the shelf, even if it has been there a while I shouldn't have to blow and inch of dust off of the product before I buy it. Nor should I have to worry about sticky fingerprints on the product I want to buy either. Also for the love of heaven the staff *must* bathe regularly.

Skriker

I find GW staff too pushy. I only went in with my girlfriend to pick up some paint, I turned my back for 5 minutes and the guy on duty was trying to sell her an army despite the fact i'd reiterated to him that she had no interest in gaming at all.

My local store is great, staff are friendly, terrain is good, and the gamers are okay, but really has limited stock. If you want something specific he can get it within a week though, which is good.

i'm going to say this again. a SALESMAN trying to SELL you something is not a cause for butthurt.

warboss_grimjaw wrote:I think the thing that puts me off about GW stores is the way that the employees immediately latch on to you like leeches the moment you walk in the door. I'm so annoyed by their "sell sell sell" demeanor, over-exuberant dorkiness, and desire to engage in constant chatter that I actually avoid going in there. Unless I'm really in a pinch for some supplies, I go to a mom and pop FLGS almost ten miles away. They ask if I need help finding anything and then they leave me alone, instead of hovering like vultures trying to get me to buy every paint color, hobby knife, and starter kit in the store. I always thought this might be particular to the shop in my town, but I've been to enough in the DC metro area -- and even one in North Carolina -- that were all the same way that I can only assume it's store-wide.

All you need to do is pull up your man pants and say "Look man, I know you're supposed to give the pitch, but I know what I am here to get and would appreciate if you leave me alone."

If they persist, you can happily talk to a manager to get it rectified, and if that fails, write an email/call corporate about the bad customer "service". I don't understand what all the problem is for some people in handling things like this. I brush off salespeople constantly, and it would never occur to me to complain about it, lol. 99% of the time, if you tell them to buzz off, they will. Especially if you do it politely.

I have generally had good experiences with GW and FLGS employees. THe only bad one I can think of is at one FLGS that I generally dont go to that has one employee who is a d-bag, but other than that people are generally very nice and helpful even if they do try to get me to buy things, that is their job.

I don't have an FLGS to go to, only a GW...

Yeah, they're nice. A bit enthusiastic, but they know their place and respect their players.

Allot of times I feel bad for people who work at the GW stores, I used to work in retail and I know how much corporate can breathe down your neck about your sales numbers and increasing sales. It is not always the employees fault they have to make sure that they push products because if their sales numbers are down for to long they can lose their jobs. Companies like GW also love to send in secret shoppers who will make sure that the employees are pushing everything they are told to push by corporate.

Generally if every store seems to be pushing for sales like this it means that they have corporate dictating what to push and how to push it.

Well I'd have to say flgs employees tend to be very weird. Just introverted and tend to look at you like they think you crawled out from under a rock, almost like your knowledge of galaxy spanning geekdom will never be on the same level as theirs.

That being said, I do agree G-dub employees are way too overbearing and do try to sell you things you don't even want or need. I Remeber I was looking to get into 40k and I went into the store just as the new space marine dex was released( just run of the mill). I'm not a win at all costs guy, but the manager asked me what I was looking for. I said an army that I don't need to update for awhile and is still able to win a few games without having to rely on 2 lists posted on the net. U know just a decent all around army. So he recommended dark angels. I thought about it and then looked at the new SM book. I noticed units were cheaper or at least had more weapon options for squads.

Undeterred, I thought DA were cool. So I asked the manager well can't I just use the new sm codec, paint a bunch of dark angels and use those rules? Just cause I liked the look of DA and it made sense to use the new SM book. He told me absolutely not. Then someone said that DA were in need of an update pretty bad. I asked him why bother selling me an army that didn't fit the description of what I was looking for ( mainly didn't need to be updated to be at least decent). All he said was " but think of all the termites you can field!"

I get it. They need to push all stock and try to make profit on even out dated armies. For me it just epitomized my average run in with GW employees. Friendly for sure, but sometimes don't listen to what you really want. But that's ok! They are still good guys and I don't mind chatting with them bout the hobby.

I always seemed to be looked down on for playing warhammer at the LGS, as though my hobby was too childish, or mainstream for them, so I decided it was worth the extra time to drive to a GW, simply because I know there will be shared interests there. An employee once or twice suggests something to me, but usually only when I'm specifically browsing. If they know I'm here to game, they leave me to it.

why isn't there a poll result for I liek GW employees and the people at my flgs.

I don't have a GW in my area, but when i visit the wife's family in chicago i make it a point to stop at the GW up there usually to pick up an IC or two but mostly to pass the time while my wife shops at the woodfield mall, all the guys up there seem nice, genuinely interested in the hobby and want to see picks of my ork army and talk about the game. a few even suggested stopping by the battle bunker they have there and that some of them would be there later playing.

and my flgs is awesome they are very supportive built us some nice tables and bought tons of terrain. it is a multi platform store so 4 minatures gaming tables 4' x 8' with a 4' x 6' mat so that 2 feet is just records and model storage. they also have probably seating for no joke 200+ people at tabels to play board games and rpgs. then they have a pc gaming and console gaming area with alienware pc's so i'm not going to complain there it is a variable geeks paradise.

so again i say... where is the i like both my options and don't idsliek either button?

G00fySmiley wrote:why isn't there a poll result for I liek GW employees and the people at my flgs.

I don't have a GW in my area, but when i visit the wife's family in chicago i make it a point to stop at the GW up there usually to pick up an IC or two but mostly to pass the time while my wife shops at the woodfield mall, all the guys up there seem nice, genuinely interested in the hobby and want to see picks of my ork army and talk about the game. a few even suggested stopping by the battle bunker they have there and that some of them would be there later playing.

and my flgs is awesome they are very supportive built us some nice tables and bought tons of terrain. it is a multi platform store so 4 minatures gaming tables 4' x 8' with a 4' x 6' mat so that 2 feet is just records and model storage. they also have probably seating for no joke 200+ people at tabels to play board games and rpgs. then they have a pc gaming and console gaming area with alienware pc's so i'm not going to complain there it is a variable geeks paradise.

so again i say... where is the i like both my options and don't idsliek either button?

Where is this magical place and how may I find it? My store is a literal hole in the wall, and as much as I love playing there, I'd love to visit this store you're talking about at least once. It sounds insane

its called gamescape in the tallahassee mall in tallahassee, florida. its actually in what used to be a big old navy store that closed down and they got the lease. the place is huge. I play there on rpg/chess nights an rpg and there are usually 20-30 people there playing chess and 4-6 rpg groups around with plenty of room and no noise problems. note this as all while people play rock band and ddr in the front area

God i am so glad i have my store here. The emloyees are awesome, and the owners know EVERYTHING about the games there.
You could even talk about video games/life/music and such with the employee's and as someone who is adept at who is adept at reading emotions, the love to talk about it.

Gorgarak wrote:Well I'd have to say flgs employees tend to be very weird. Just introverted and tend to look at you like they think you crawled out from under a rock, almost like your knowledge of galaxy spanning geekdom will never be on the same level as theirs.

That being said, I do agree G-dub employees are way too overbearing and do try to sell you things you don't even want or need. I Remeber I was looking to get into 40k and I went into the store just as the new space marine dex was released( just run of the mill). I'm not a win at all costs guy, but the manager asked me what I was looking for. I said an army that I don't need to update for awhile and is still able to win a few games without having to rely on 2 lists posted on the net. U know just a decent all around army. So he recommended dark angels. I thought about it and then looked at the new SM book. I noticed units were cheaper or at least had more weapon options for squads.

Undeterred, I thought DA were cool. So I asked the manager well can't I just use the new sm codec, paint a bunch of dark angels and use those rules? Just cause I liked the look of DA and it made sense to use the new SM book. He told me absolutely not. Then someone said that DA were in need of an update pretty bad. I asked him why bother selling me an army that didn't fit the description of what I was looking for ( mainly didn't need to be updated to be at least decent). All he said was " but think of all the termites you can field!"

I get it. They need to push all stock and try to make profit on even out dated armies. For me it just epitomized my average run in with GW employees. Friendly for sure, but sometimes don't listen to what you really want. But that's ok! They are still good guys and I don't mind chatting with them bout the hobby.

To be fair, I have found that many employees tend to talk people into armies they personally play/want to play. The probably thought that DA were awesome and thus wanted to talk you into playing them. I can't help but smile when one of the store managers tries to talk everyone into starting Vanilla Marines. Ironically, the players around here are extremely xenos heavy, marines are in the minority by far.

Over the years I've had a lot worse customer service from independant games stores than with Games Workshop.

I've been to LGS that don't even know their product. One store owner laughed at me for asking about Star Wars role-playing game books, "West End Games lost the licenece years ago mate." Hmm... this was well into Wizard of the Coast's Revised Edition tenure. Guy was pretty annoyed when I told him WOTC had the licence and told me to leave!

I've not been to a local GW where the staff were not friendly or didn't know their product. I'm a geek. I want to go to a games store where staff are enthusiastic about their product.

phoenixrisin wrote:i'm going to say this again. a SALESMAN trying to SELL you something is not a cause for butthurt.

And I'm going to say this again. If a salesman comes across as pushy, desperate or hostile - they are doing their job badly. If it's obvious that they're trying to upsell to you - then they're doing their job badly. If you find a store environment an unpleasant place to browse products because of the shop floor employees - THEN THEY ARE DOING THEIR JOB BADLY.

Salesman will try to sell, yes, and so they should. However, if overt, pushy sales tactics - the kind that any decent salesman would know never to use - are dominating your shop floors, then you are doing it wrong. Trot out the old 'stop whining, it's their job to sell you things' if you wish, but there is such as thing as bad salesmanship. GW excel at it.

BattleGoat74 wrote:I've seen lots of topics on the tfg(s) at stores, but I never heard any about crappy managers and employees at your local FGLS and GW stores. I'll start with this story.

A few years ago, I used to play at a FLGS in Virginia when I lived there. The place was great, two large rooms, tons of people, and several friendly employees. Unfortunately, the tfg somehow got a part-time job there. Anyways, the place went under renovation, several of the old, crappy tables were removed, and new ones were being built in one of the rooms. The store became a lot more crowded, and some people decided to stop coming to the store until the construction was finished. So one of the guys was talking about leaving to a nearby GW store for the 3 weeks it would take for the renovation, and the that fething employee starts arguing with him about how he should play where he plays, and they argue for a bit before the TFE says "You know what? Just get out". Keep in mind that the guy ran a 2500 point ORK army, and purchased 1500 points of it from the store.

So tell me your stories Dakka.

Also, tell me who do you think is more unfriendly, GW employees, or Gaming store employees.

I've not had a problem either way really. I talk to my local GW store manager on a regular basis and I also game in another store in the city and the staff there are pretty decent. I've never really talked to any FLGS guys to be honest. I've been in some of them but I've just never learned anything about them really.

The only instance I can remember was quite a few years ago in another store unrelated to the ones I go to now, when I first started the hobby, where I witnessed a store employee treat a kid like an idiot during a game because he got a rule wrong or something.

htj wrote:

phoenixrisin wrote:i'm going to say this again. a SALESMAN trying to SELL you something is not a cause for butthurt.

And I'm going to say this again. If a salesman comes across as pushy, desperate or hostile - they are doing their job badly. If it's obvious that they're trying to upsell to you - then they're doing their job badly. If you find a store environment an unpleasant place to browse products because of the shop floor employees - THEN THEY ARE DOING THEIR JOB BADLY.

Salesman will try to sell, yes, and so they should. However, if overt, pushy sales tactics - the kind that any decent salesman would know never to use - are dominating your shop floors, then you are doing it wrong. Trot out the old 'stop whining, it's their job to sell you things' if you wish, but there is such as thing as bad salesmanship. GW excel at it.

Basically this. It makes the interaction awkward when it should be as simple as a, "I'm fine, thanks, just browsing."

G00fySmiley wrote:and my flgs is awesome they are very supportive built us some nice tables and bought tons of terrain. it is a multi platform store so 4 minatures gaming tables 4' x 8' with a 4' x 6' mat so that 2 feet is just records and model storage. they also have probably seating for no joke 200+ people at tabels to play board games and rpgs. then they have a pc gaming and console gaming area with alienware pc's so i'm not going to complain there it is a variable geeks paradise.

My FLGS went from a small corner shop where a lot of the gaming tables were in a basement to a store front with 2 of the walls being almost totally glass and incredibly bright. There is one large table always dedicated to mini gaming and then another 10 or 12 tables that can have 4x8 boards placed on them for mini games or can be used as is for card/board games instead. The move was a pricey one for the owner, but all the natural light has led to a dramatic increase in player numbers and people who came out of the woodwork saying that they couldn't bring themselves to play in a store basement for the weekend.

Only real negative of the new location is that if there is a major rain storm it is impossible to get into the store because the water pools on the street in front of the store and regularly gets thrown up on the front of the store by the traffic. Luckily those conditions don't happen all that often.

Skriker

htj wrote:

phoenixrisin wrote:i'm going to say this again. a SALESMAN trying to SELL you something is not a cause for butthurt.

And I'm going to say this again. If a salesman comes across as pushy, desperate or hostile - they are doing their job badly. If it's obvious that they're trying to upsell to you - then they're doing their job badly. If you find a store environment an unpleasant place to browse products because of the shop floor employees - THEN THEY ARE DOING THEIR JOB BADLY.

Salesman will try to sell, yes, and so they should. However, if overt, pushy sales tactics - the kind that any decent salesman would know never to use - are dominating your shop floors, then you are doing it wrong. Trot out the old 'stop whining, it's their job to sell you things' if you wish, but there is such as thing as bad salesmanship. GW excel at it.

i just looked over this thread and when did you say it in the first place? unless you have an alt, this is your first comment in the thread. if you don't like their sales tactics, then leave the store. it's private property and it's not your right to be there. stop whining and let your money do the talking. AGAIN pushy sales =/= being a dick, which is what the thread is all about.

or alternatively, just say "i think i know what i'm looking for already but i'm just going to browse for a while. i'll let you know if i need any help." you know, actually converse with them like they're a person instead of getting all frustrated because they can't read your mind like you're a female in a relationship and you want your sig. other to just "know" what's upsetting you.

phoenixrisin wrote:

htj wrote:

phoenixrisin wrote:i'm going to say this again. a SALESMAN trying to SELL you something is not a cause for butthurt.

And I'm going to say this again. If a salesman comes across as pushy, desperate or hostile - they are doing their job badly. If it's obvious that they're trying to upsell to you - then they're doing their job badly. If you find a store environment an unpleasant place to browse products because of the shop floor employees - THEN THEY ARE DOING THEIR JOB BADLY.

Salesman will try to sell, yes, and so they should. However, if overt, pushy sales tactics - the kind that any decent salesman would know never to use - are dominating your shop floors, then you are doing it wrong. Trot out the old 'stop whining, it's their job to sell you things' if you wish, but there is such as thing as bad salesmanship. GW excel at it.

i just looked over this thread and when did you say it in the first place? unless you have an alt, this is your first comment in the thread. if you don't like their sales tactics, then leave the store. it's private property and it's not your right to be there. stop whining and let your money do the talking. AGAIN pushy sales =/= being a dick, which is what the thread is all about.

or alternatively, just say "i think i know what i'm looking for already but i'm just going to browse for a while. i'll let you know if i need any help." you know, actually converse with them like they're a person instead of getting all frustrated because they can't read your mind like you're a female in a relationship and you want your sig. other to just "know" what's upsetting you.

I've said it before in other threads. Apologies if this wasn't clear, I admit I could have worded it better.

This is not just me 'not liking their sales tactics.' This is to do with me, as an experienced retail manager whose job it is to promote sales, judging them to be faulty. And you think I don't treat them like people? Interesting leap. I worked as one of them for a year, and have held many equivalent jobs. So yeah, I fething well know that they're people and treat them with the dignity they deserve. You know what, though? That doesn't make their sales tactics any better.

Oh goodness, you thought of a way to tell people you're just browsing? You genius! Oh no wait, everyone knows to say that. But you know what else? You shouldn't have to fend off salespeople coming up to you when you are clearly browsing. If it were just a case of 'can I help?' then this would be all fine and dandy, but it is not. One of the things I know from, let me remind you, actually doing that fething job is that you are instructed to open a conversation with every customer and highlight new releases in order to drive upsales. Most people, when they enter a shop, are shopping and browsing. You cannot upsell to them by enforcing a conversation that they do not want to have. You will alienate them, and they will not return to your shop. This is retail 101. Doing this is bad. I cannot emphasise this enough.

I am not saying pushy sales = being a dick. I am not putting that argument up. I am responding to this comment that you made.

phoenixrisin wrote:i'm going to say this again. a SALESMAN trying to SELL you something is not a cause for butthurt.

But if pushy sales tactics are making people come away from your shop thinking 'that guy was being a dick' then clearly you're doing something wrong. It's not like what makes someone a dick is a science. So telling people off for saying that they think someone is a dick due to their manner in the shop is nonsense. They came off as a dick, so that customer thought they were dickish. End of story.

EDIT: Sorry if I came at you a bit hard on this one. It's nothing personal, but this is an argument I've seen frequently to defend terrible customer service, and it really raises my hackles. The events described that you said were just pushy sales tactics were beyond that. They were bad, rude, and I would certainly consider them dickish. The way that sales assistant behaved would not be acceptable on my shop floor.

I've seen both ends of the scale. There have been some awesome staff in the past at my local GW, people whom you could have a natter with about just about anything and wouldn't push sales on you etc. and really knew their stuff. There is a guy there currently who is just like this. Had a great conversation with him about TMNT amongst, other more, GW related things.

I've seen some right knob jockeys of GW employees. I remember a manager at another store I was a regular at in my home town, we were doing the normal spiel about what to buy, as I needed a new model for my Wolf Lord- He recommended a Long Fang sgt (IIRC), as I was, in his words "crap at converting" On a related note, I really regretted missing him cutting his hand with a scalpel and finding out he was haemophobic. I really didn't like that guy, no-one ever played games when he was there and it became a running joke his catchphrase was "get out my store!"

Then you have the truckload of staffers who's rage button is sites like Dakka, Warseer, BOLS etc. where they'll hurl abuse at you for even daring to know something they don't. I remember getting in an argument with a manager about there being a then unreleased scenery piece on the back of the IG codex. He kept mentioning about "Saddos on the Internet knowing nothing". Then there was a manager's meeting the following week were said terrain piece was revealed. To his credit he apologised to me when he next saw me.

Then the Mail Order guy who regularly came into the Loughborough store. At the time the Mumakil was going to be released. I was sitting at the painting table and he was trying to be all cloak and dagger about its price, with him hiding his hand behind a codex, and I quote "it will be ten times the amount of fingers I'm holding up". So I said "So it'll be maximum of £50 then?". His reply was priceless "How do you know that? I might have put more fingers up."

A slightly random one, I saw an Area manager throw a hissy fit as he was not allowed something from my local GW's cabinet, as it belonged to a customer. It was an awesome Eltharion vs. Shadowblade diorama, Golden Demon quality stuff and the AM came in and said "Cool diorama, I'm having that". The staff said he couldn't for the above reasons and well, it just shows the cult of personality that runs through GW's upper ranks.

To end it with a nice note, I've seen a great staffer (not least because I used to share a house with him). He was playing a kid at LOTR- Fellowship vs. Full Uruk Hai force IIRC. The kid was wiped out quite badly and ready to quit there and then. The staffer offered to switch sides and show him how to use them to their full effect, as this was his main problem, he was throwing them in piecemeal and expecting an army of heroes to kill everything in their path. The staffer sohwed him where he went wrong and the kid got a load more tactical knowledge that day.

GW employees. When they still had stores in New York, one of the stores in the city, the employees were completely over bearing andf could not be bothered to give me the time of day and they made me leave the store to test my blood sugar. That last part would have been fine if the hunched over employee didn't rush over to me and yell at me to take my needles and blood outside when i was having legitimate problems with my diabetes.

My FLGS is great however, The manager is quite literally venerated and is possibly one of the most welcoming people, always having patience with new players and always looking to answer ones questions now matter how small, big, specific, or broad about the hobby, lore, and rules. The people their are all great fun and boisterous which can sometimes lead to awkward yet hilarious moments .

Commisar Von Humps wrote:GW employees. When they still had stores in New York, one of the stores in the city, the employees were completely over bearing andf could not be bothered to give me the time of day and they made me leave the store to test my blood sugar. That last part would have been fine if the hunched over employee didn't rush over to me and yell at me to take my needles and blood outside when i was having legitimate problems with my diabetes.

My FLGS is great however, The manager is quite literally venerated and is possibly one of the most welcoming people, always having patience with new players and always looking to answer ones questions now matter how small, big, specific, or broad about the hobby, lore, and rules. The people their are all great fun and boisterous which can sometimes lead to awkward yet hilarious moments .

if someone said that to me when i am testing my BS, then they are liable to get hit in the jaw. and i would never shop there again.

I guess the ulimtate upshot of all these comments is that like everyone else staff of gaming stores are a subset of the human population. As such you will find some who are nice people and some who are not and many at the various levels in between. GW definitely does not have a monopoly on hiring lazy, unhelpful or rude sales people. They are everywhere in retail, and pretty much anywhere else as well.

Skriker