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d-usa wrote:It's not about the military wanting recognition or some Marine running around going "look what I did". The military is not really the subject of the story at all.

It's about the child.

A child who wanted to be a Marine.
A child who was made an honorary Marine because that was his wish and it was important to him.
A child who got the feeling that he was important as a Marine, who received the final honor as a marine.

If you don't think that military should receive some special spot in our society, then that is alright since that is not the point of the story at all.

A child wanted to become a marine, so the marines made him one and he got to be a marine until he passed. It was something that was important to the child and he got it. Not because the marines wanted it, but because the child wanted it.

Hum, yes. Thank you for pointing out something which was clear to everyone in this thread.

Kovnik Obama wrote:

Jihadin wrote:youtube
"Highway of Hero's"
Its a canadian highway "401" that was rename "Highway of Hero's". Its the route the canadian war dead from Afghanistan goes down before they are buried. Massive amount of support/solidarity for the fallen soldier from the civilian population. Not going to get into a debate with you and try to change your mind. You just never served in a military branch.....and the Canadians took the hockey rink with them from Kandahar Afghanistan

I'm not trying to start a debate on the value of jingoistic demonstrations.

Did you really just equate the story in the OP with jingoism?

Someone tried to imply that it is trolling to state indiference toward the particular spin given on this particular story ; I wanted to point out that it really isn't the case.

Except your "case" falls flat on its face when you realize that neither you nor the poster who was accused of trolling are required to post in these threads.

Seriously. If you have nothing nice to say on a story like this; then don't post. There is a time and a place for the kind of behavior that Azazel is exhibiting--and threads like this are neither. All posts like yours and Azazel's have done is drag it off-topic. The fact that you referred to it earlier as he had a "right" to put his opinion out, by the by, just makes it clear that you're only here to argue.

Everyone with a proper moral mindset will show compassion toward the sick kid in the story.

You would think so, but...

Not caring about the military dude doesn't make you a dick... except to military personnel who somehow believes that their choice entitles them to a higher form of respect than the rest of the population.

Your bias is showing.

The fact that the man was in the Marines has nothing to do with the warmfuzzies feeling that people were having; nor the reason that they are lauding him or the other Marines involved with this story.

It's the fact that it is random strangers engaged in an act of kindness to someone they most likely had no real interaction with prior to a request to get involved. They had no reason to get involved either, mind you.

Kovnik Obama wrote:

d-usa wrote:It's not about the military wanting recognition or some Marine running around going "look what I did". The military is not really the subject of the story at all.

It's about the child.

A child who wanted to be a Marine.
A child who was made an honorary Marine because that was his wish and it was important to him.
A child who got the feeling that he was important as a Marine, who received the final honor as a marine.

If you don't think that military should receive some special spot in our society, then that is alright since that is not the point of the story at all.

A child wanted to become a marine, so the marines made him one and he got to be a marine until he passed. It was something that was important to the child and he got it. Not because the marines wanted it, but because the child wanted it.

Hum, yes. Thank you for pointing out something which was clear to everyone in this thread.

I am sorry, I mistook your "I am sorry that I don't care about military" comment and figured that you thought the marine was supposed to be the hero of the story.

Kanluwen wrote:
Did you really just equate the story in the OP with jingoism?

In the sense of extreme or emotional militaristic nationalism, yes. In the sense of belligerent militarism, no, of course.

Except your "case" falls flat on its face when you realize that neither you nor the poster who was accused of trolling are required to post in these threads.

Seriously. If you have nothing nice to say on a story like this; then don't post.

This applies to everyone in this thread.

There is a time and a place for the kind of behavior that Azazel is exhibiting--and threads like this are neither.

This is the time and the place : this is not a memorial to the child's memory. This is an Off-topic discussion board. If you post a story, its content will be discussed.

All posts like yours and Azazel's have done is drag it off-topic. The fact that you referred to it earlier as he had a "right" to put his opinion out, by the by, just makes it clear that you're only here to argue.

So every time states they have a right to an opinion they are just whining? I felt the same as Azazel when reading the story, and if I had posted my opinion, would've received the same response ; hence why I defended him.

The fact that the man was in the Marines has nothing to do with the warmfuzzies feeling that people were having; nor the reason that they are lauding him or the other Marines involved with this story.

It's the fact that it is random strangers engaged in an act of kindness to someone they most likely had no real interaction with prior to a request to get involved. They had no reason to get involved either, mind you.

Which is something that happens everyday in everyone's life. And yet this dude gets it's name in the paper, while the doctor who treated the kid didn't.

Your bias is showing.

Your demagoguery is showing...

People just doing their job, however important, usually don't get singled out for "kindness of strangers" stories. Docs and nurses are expected to do what they are doing, so as far as human interest stories are concerned they are just doing their job so there is nothing special going on there.

Kovnik Obama wrote:

There is a time and a place for the kind of behavior that Azazel is exhibiting--and threads like this are neither.

This is the time and the place : this is not a memorial to the child's memory. This is an Off-topic discussion board. If you post a story, its content will be discussed.

Clearly. You did not understand the point you were replying to.

You are not forced to post in a thread. If you choose to post some kind of snarky reply in a thread such as this; you will be blasted as a troll--and quite frankly, rightfully so.

All posts like yours and Azazel's have done is drag it off-topic. The fact that you referred to it earlier as he had a "right" to put his opinion out, by the by, just makes it clear that you're only here to argue.

So every time states they have a right to an opinion they are just whining?

Since I'm assuming you meant "So every time someone states they have a right to an opinion they are just whining?"...

You, in fact, do not have any rights on forums beyond what the moderators and administrators of the site gives you.

I felt the same as Azazel when reading the story, and if I had posted my opinion, would've received the same response ; hence why I defended him.

And here's where the problem comes from.

Rather than y'know, not post anything about a story which you do not like and avoid the whole situation or needing to be defended...
You felt the need to post in this thread anyways, for whatever reason.

The fact that the man was in the Marines has nothing to do with the warmfuzzies feeling that people were having; nor the reason that they are lauding him or the other Marines involved with this story.

It's the fact that it is random strangers engaged in an act of kindness to someone they most likely had no real interaction with prior to a request to get involved. They had no reason to get involved either, mind you.

Which is something that happens everyday in everyone's life. And yet this dude gets it's name in the paper, while the doctor who treated the kid didn't.

KingCracker wrote:I did, your still being a jerk off and for no reason. You want to pretend to be a badass go for it man, I wont stop ya. But do it in a thread that isnt about a child dying ya?

Only out of sheer respect for your general opinion(s) in the past will I ignore the child-like name calling that you have so quickly resorted to. However, I will point out the hypocrisy of your commentary thus far with regards to pretending to be a badass.



Now, while I do appreciate the show of support, I feel that I should clarify things here before this gets more out of control and even uglier:

My initial comment was merely stating that I don't consider this story to be uplifting. Ultimately, it is a story about a dying child being granted his final wish before succumbing to cancer. This is no more uplifting than watching Old Yeller, which is also full of positive elements -but is ultimately a depressing story.

I did not downplay what the Marines did for the kid, nor have I ever said anything that could be construed as such. I personally think that was a very touching gesture on their part, and intimated as much in my original post.

However, everyone seems to want to attack me for ...I have no idea, honestly. Nothing that I have said could possibly be interpreted as offensive, so where is all of the misdirected anger coming from?

@Kanluwen: I am really disappointed to see that you believe only messages of pure agreement with the sentiments of the OP should appear in forum threads. Rationale like yours would effectively makes these forums moot. However distasteful you may find that idea with regards to certain topics, I urge you to think carefully when you start your discourses. The fact that the slights your imagine I must have said are just that: imaginary -only makes your chiding appear all the more foolish.

Well, following a certain line of discussion past a certain number of constant reiteration of the same 'you had nothing nice to say so you should have shut up' is pretty pointless.

I'll just point out that demagoguery is the strategy, not the title.

No matter what anyone says, Cody Green must have been one hell of a kid, and Sgt Mark Dolfini is one master class stud.

Now I remember why I stopped coming to off topic.

The point of the story is supposed to be about that young boy's final days, who got his last wish, and the marine, unable to do anything to prevent his death, tried to make his last hours as meaningful as possible, and make him feel like a marine. Isn't that what counts?

Kovnik Obama wrote:
In the sense of extreme or emotional militaristic nationalism, yes. In the sense of belligerent militarism, no, of course.

How is this emotional, militaristic nationalism? I mean, it might be, but on a fundamental level the Marines, and one particular Marine (presumably) did something they didn't need to do, while the caretakers certainly didn't. Moreover, the guy searching for a cure? The father likely doesn't know his name, nor could easily find it out.

It can be construed as a matter of jingoism, or a matter of the most unexpected and immediate kind thing* following the death of a child being mentioned first; and that's just before we consider selective reporting.



*I also disagree that the kid matters, he was going to die. It was nice of the Marines to honor his last wish, but the posted guard was more for the parents/family in reality, if not in intention.

At first this thread made me sad in a sort of heart touching way, now this thread just makes me sad...

I remember reading about this in the paper awhile back, it took me awhile to figure out why it meant so much though but when it did I had to applaud the marine for doing what he did.

Kovnik Obama wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:
Did you really just equate the story in the OP with jingoism?

In the sense of extreme or emotional militaristic nationalism, yes. In the sense of belligerent militarism, no, of course.

Jingoism is extreme patriotism in the form of aggressive foreign policy.[1] In practice, it is a country's advocation of the use of threats or actual force against other countries in order to safeguard what it perceives as its national interests. Colloquially, it refers to excessive bias in judging one's own country as superior to others – an extreme type of nationalism. -wikipedia

: extreme chauvinism or nationalism marked especially by a belligerent foreign policy -Merriam-Webster Dictionary

Kovnik, it would help to actually know what words mean before you actually use them. Merriam and Webster heavily disagree with you on the actual meaning of jingoism and I would say that emotional militaristic nationalism is not jingoism that's called realizing that there are people who get shot at to defend your rights, or in certain dictatorships, your lack of rights.

kovnik wrote:

kanluwen wrote:
Except your "case" falls flat on its face when you realize that neither you nor the poster who was accused of trolling are required to post in these threads.

Seriously. If you have nothing nice to say on a story like this; then don't post.

This applies to everyone in this thread.

Everyone else posted nice sentiments except for you and Azazel, so no this really just applies to you and Azazel.

kovnik wrote:

kanluwen wrote:There is a time and a place for the kind of behavior that Azazel is exhibiting--and threads like this are neither.

This is the time and the place : this is not a memorial to the child's memory. This is an Off-topic discussion board. If you post a story, its content will be discussed.

No this was a thread that was made to show something that had happened, I'm sure the OP did not want to discuss and in fact it was meant more like a facebook 'share' or whatever the devil it is people do with facebook updates. Unless you feel the need to constantly debate with the status updates on your facebook then you should realize this. If you are compelled to debate every single facebook status you receive then I would gather that you don't have many friends.

kovnik wrote:

kanluwen wrote:All posts like yours and Azazel's have done is drag it off-topic. The fact that you referred to it earlier as he had a "right" to put his opinion out, by the by, just makes it clear that you're only here to argue.

So every time states they have a right to an opinion they are just whining? I felt the same as Azazel when reading the story, and if I had posted my opinion, would've received the same response ; hence why I defended him.

kanluwen wrote:The fact that the man was in the Marines has nothing to do with the warmfuzzies feeling that people were having; nor the reason that they are lauding him or the other Marines involved with this story.

It's the fact that it is random strangers engaged in an act of kindness to someone they most likely had no real interaction with prior to a request to get involved. They had no reason to get involved either, mind you.

Which is something that happens everyday in everyone's life. And yet this dude gets it's name in the paper, while the doctor who treated the kid didn't.

Maybe the doctor who treated the kid didn't get into the paper because the doctor kind of failed to save the kid's life? We have a group who did something the kid wanted, he wanted to be a marine and the corp allowed him to join, the kid wanted to live and fought the cancer as long as he could, the doctors kind of failed in keeping him alive. In the end the Marine Corps delivered and the doctors didn't.

In the military there are times when you stand guard out of necessity, like on a military base, and then there are times you stand guard out of respect. The Tomb of the Unknown Soldier has such an honor guard that is usually rotated, its not necessary to guard the tomb but that's why its called an 'honor' guard, with a heavy emphasis on the honor. The marine in question gave a 12 year old boy an honor guard, which is something that most 12 year olds and in fact a lot of people never receive. That's why this case is so special and in fact, does not happen everyday in everyone's life.

kovnik wrote:

kanluwen wrote:Your bias is showing.

Your demagoguery is showing...

1
: a leader who makes use of popular prejudices and false claims and promises in order to gain power
2
: a leader championing the cause of the common people in ancient times

Again, I feel that Merriam and Webster are rolling around in their graves,

Corpsesarefun wrote:At first this thread made me sad in a sort of heart touching way, now this thread just makes me sad...

Same...

Good gravy, my ignore list got added a few pounds.

I'm with Purple and corpses.

Lovely story OP regardless of what followed, my heartfelt respect to the Marine in question.

The thing that no one has mentioned, and I am sure applies is that the Marine who stood the honor guard would have done it even if his name never got in the paper.

Corpsesarefun wrote:At first this thread made me sad in a sort of heart touching way, now this thread just makes me sad...

This.

Nocturn wrote:

Corpsesarefun wrote:At first this thread made me sad in a sort of heart touching way, now this thread just makes me sad...

This.

Agreed.

I can only think of one other poster that I've been as disgusted with as I am with two douchebags in this very thread. Which, in the Dakka OT, is saying something.

KingCracker wrote:Good gravy, my ignore list got added a few pounds.

Most of the people in this thread were already on my ignore list.

I see why buddy
Class acts the lot of em

KingCracker wrote:I see why buddy
Class acts the lot of em

I only see 2 people needing hugs, not most of the thread.

I smell an imminent lock...

Good idea.

No this was a thread that was made to show something that had happened, I'm sure the OP did not want to discuss and in fact it was meant more like a facebook 'share' or whatever the devil it is people do with facebook updates. Unless you feel the need to constantly debate with the status updates on your facebook then you should realize this. If you are compelled to debate every single facebook status you receive then I would gather that you don't have many friends.

For the record, Facebook "share" posts are not an appropriate use of Dakka. This IS a discussion site, and if a post is just something you'd share on a blog or on Facebook, with no intent of any discussion, it shouldn't be on here.

That said, a thread about a dead person and their dying wish usually isn't a good place to go looking for a debate. Discussion therein should be kept respectful and preferably avoid ascribing insulting characteristics or motivations to deceased people or those who honor them. Assuming it's not a deceased dictator or terrorist or something.