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leohart wrote:It is simply illegal for anyone to upload detailed information and make it available for download.

Not if you're GW

leohart wrote:
Accuracy of the data file is of utmost importance. Rules information should point to the page in the book.

How about if the rules information was just there? with no reference to the book?

@Tetsugaku: If the rules information were there with no reference to the book then
1- if I am GW, it would be a bad implementation, I would rather the software flip me to the right page and give me a highlight so I read it with all the glory images.
2- if I am not GW, it would be illegal for me to do so (in most countries).

GW is not stupid, they are just slow. Here is what I see they will eventually get to:
1- Create their own app that does not use the iBook store. This allows their digital product to be available in multiple platforms and allow an incorporation of other aspects such as army builder, rss feeds information (What's New Today), ads for their newest products.
2- The army builder app will have all the information both inline and as a link to the corresponding section in the book.
3- The army builder part is an extra $10 on top of the digital codex.

Crazy pricing? Crazy control? You name it, but it maximizes my (umm, GW) profit.

Tetsugaku wrote:

leohart wrote:It is simply illegal for anyone to upload detailed information and make it available for download.

Not if you're GW

leohart wrote:
Accuracy of the data file is of utmost importance. Rules information should point to the page in the book.

How about if the rules information was just there? with no reference to the book?

Without permission from the owner of the system, this is a good way to end up in court and/or cuffs depending on where you are located.

Or you're a duck and you're having a go at the forums. In which case, you're doing a pretty good job of it.

leohart wrote: It is simply illegal for anyone to upload detailed information and make it available for download.

Accuracy of the data file is of utmost importance. Rules information should point to the page in the book.

What is actually illegal and what GW would says are illegal are two very different things. GW could very well license out or make the AB files themselves. They choose not to for God knows why.

People have been making AB files for GW systems for well over a decade now. How many of them have gone to jail? Not a single damn one.

Also, having every fething rule involved in an army list just refer to a page number almost entirely defeats the point of the list. The reason it has rules and stats on it are specifically so that you DON"T have to go flipping thru pages half the game.

And again, AB has absolutely zero to do with the GW data files made for it. They are made by guys on their own time. If GW did go after them, then it would change the way they operate but not shut them down completely. They'd turn to updating and uploading anonymously through sites outside of GW's legal jurisdiction. Therefore, GW gains no real ground by suing people willy nilly over it, and for years they have understood that.

Aerethan wrote:

leohart wrote: It is simply illegal for anyone to upload detailed information and make it available for download.

Accuracy of the data file is of utmost importance. Rules information should point to the page in the book.

What is actually illegal and what GW would says are illegal are two very different things. GW could very well license out or make the AB files themselves. They choose not to for God knows why.

I am not sure I agree with that. GW owns the IP to those rule details. They can choose to license it as they please. It is illegal to maintain a data file that has such IP and make it available for download to other people indiscriminately. The people who maintain these data files for AB, BS, or any other system are running a risk of being sued. This doesn't deter/unable them from doing it. They are doing other people a good service.

As far as I know, one can argue for fair use to create such data file for personal use. But distributing it to another person without checking (and keep on checking) that the person also qualify for the same fair use clause is illegal.

Anyway, we all know the situation of these data files. The OP asked for a comparison of army builder software and so far it is clear that on their own, AB and BS are both good products with different price tags. To each his own.

The Internet laughs at your paltry IP laws.

I'd have to delve into the AB forums and site a bit more to see their stance on the matter.

Honestly as long as there is a free builder with continued support and at LEAST as good as Battlescribe, no improvements are worth my money which is where this seems to be going.

+1 for Battlescribe. Great program for the money

Aerethan wrote:The Internet laughs at your paltry IP laws.

As well it might, the older I get the more I realise how unethical it is to infringe somebody else's copyright in most situations. It's GWs property, they put the effort int making it all, they get to do what they like.

Anyway - off topic - has anyone any other competitors? This thread has been hugely useful so far

Tetsugaku wrote:

Aerethan wrote:The Internet laughs at your paltry IP laws.

As well it might, the older I get the more I realise how unethical it is to infringe somebody else's copyright in most situations. It's GWs property, they put the effort int making it all, they get to do what they like.

You mean all those supposedly copyrighted things they list like the chaos star that they don't actually own in any way?

I'd feel bad about pirating GW books and such if GW was an honest company. But with how they treat their veterans and other companies, I feel no remorse in sticking it to them even if they don't know I'm doing it.

The fact is that most large corporations do shady things and bully smaller companies with petty lawsuits meant to drain them of resources until they fold. I don't like any company that does that.

Did GW ever once consider just buying out Chapterhouse instead of suing them? How much money have they spent on that already versus how much it would have cost to just buy them or strike a licensing deal?

No, instead GW wants to be the ONLY company making toy soldiers or anything related to toy soldiers.

GW turned a profit of 19 million last year. They could have done a great many things with that money. Instead they "reinvested" it back into the company with things like finecast and opening more stores down the street from LGS's. Hell, for much less than 19 million they could have bought AB, CHS, and damn near any other gaming related company out there.

How about we keep this thread on-topic so OP gets the info he needs instead of derailing it with talk about ethics and legality of pirating.

Tetsugaku wrote:---------------

StoneRaizer wrote:
Product: BattleScribe

What's not great
- Printed output spans many pages

Do you use this feature a lot? Can I ask what for? Is it for sharing with opponents, personal reference, something to scribble on etc?

For sharing with opponents and for personal reference. When playing a game it's much easier to have my roster on paper that way I can put it into my bag with my Codex and rulebook. Carrying around a laptop to look up my army is cumbersome and I don't have an iPad or smartphone. My handwriting is terrible so I don't like scribbling out my list on pen and paper. The only time I use the feature is when I'm preparing for a game and I don't have the list I want to play printed already.

Aerethan wrote:

Tetsugaku wrote:

If you could tell me
* What the product is called
* Any URL's you know
* What's great
* What's not great
* What you'd change if you had a magic wand

Byte wrote:Battlescribe.

1. Free.
2. Free.
3. Easy.

Did you not bother reading the list of things he's asking for? I swear BS fanboys are not all there.

Fanboy? Really? Enjoying free makes me a fanboy? Not all there?

Those are my points and its better than using pen and paper. Don't come at me like that.

You just made my ignore list and your a distraction to the rest of the quality content on Dakka. Being a miscreant and instigator is pointless and not in accordance with Dakka Rule #1 which ironically is in my sig.

Byte wrote:Dakka Rule #1 which ironically is in my sig.

I'm reasonably certain that it's not ironic that it is in your sig, unless you put it there with the explicit intent of ignoring it yourself, which would not be consistent with your usual posting behaviour.

daedalus wrote:

Byte wrote:Dakka Rule #1 which ironically is in my sig.

I'm reasonably certain that it's not ironic that it is in your sig, unless you put it there with the explicit intent of ignoring it yourself, which would not be consistent with your usual posting behaviour.

Only ironic in that I had to reference it to a member that responded to one of my posts(in which Rule #1 is clearly displayed) that is apparently operating on the fringe of acceptable. I'm not here to moderate, but I won't tolerate random snide attacks from disgruntled members. Hence, ignore list.

Keep it on topic guys. If somebody breaks a Dakka rule then use the "report post" triangle instead of sniping back and forth at each other.

Please.

Thanks.

And we're back in the room

Thanks for all your feedback so far everyone - any other takers out there?

Back on topic. I have been using Quartermaster on my Iphone. It is in a word. Fantastic and simple. It costs 5$ but hey it's only 5 bucks.